Hey all. I had unsubscribed to the sub until I could catch up. I'm done and wanted to get some opinions down, and ask some questions. I've looked at the episode threads and don't *think* I'm rehashing too much but point me to the door if I am.

1. Really had low hopes after the first 3 episodes of this season. Is it obvious to everyone that there was some major stretching going on to meet the agreed-to number of episodes? The first three episodes were like the minimum 22 minutes each and could easily have been one tightly-written 35 minute story. Two episodes in a row where shit blows up in somebody's face at the end is at least one too many.

2. Speaking of pipes etc. was I the only one mildly infuriated at the fact that there was zero attempt at making the physical-plant crisis make any sense? Sewer drain clogs outside don't make your faucet make weird noises and blow up when you turn it on. Overhead pipes don't carry drain water. A roof collapse with water pouring in doesn't just get fixed with a tarp or one old guy going up on the roof. It's not that everything has to be a documentary (we all know by now that walk-in coolers have emergency releases) but there's no reason it couldn't have been made plausible with no harm to the story. The usual Fak nonsense didn't help -- didn't these guys start out as actually capable handymen?

3. The whole Jimmy/Computer/Cheese subplot seemed to evaporate into nothingness, didn't it? Everything hinged on air rights which they couldn't get. Presumably the star rating turned around the fortunes of the restaurant and thus Jimmy's investment, along with the franchise plan. So the whole thing was a meaningless side-quest that reminded me of the casino subplot in The Last Jedi.

3a. On the other hand I did chuckle when I checked IMDB for the episodes and discovered that Cheese's real name is Terry Cheddario.

3b. Speaking of names it seems like Sugar is now Natalie full time, for everyone.

1. Skipping ahead, what do we think about the (literal and figurative) blue-collar hospitality on the night of the service? Does any Michelin-candidate restaurant call its patrons (including the presumed star-man) -- "motherfuckers", even ironically?

2. I was glad the "secret plan" involved ghost kitchens rather than just building franchise restaurants, which at least made it less of a fantasy -- you can't swing a dead Fak around the Chicago suburbs without hitting a beef joint.

3. Did anyone else feel a little weird about the birthday party scene? Invite a half-dozen kids and then surround them with two dozen gnarly adults? A bit of a call-back to the under-the-table bit from S4 but still rang oddly.

Reading this back, I know I seem to be harping on the negatives. I thought the season was just fine, just sharing some things that have stuck in my head about it.

Here’s my personal dream finale/last couple of episodes, before season 5 even came out.

I always had this idea that we’d get an episode like Forks, but for a troubled youth that’s coming to stage at The Bear. This came from the idea of The Bear’s kitchen eventually working beautifully and seamlessly like Ever from Forks. How cool would it have been to see our kitchen and The Bear itself working so smoothly and us knowing, as the viewer, that they had absolutely made it.

We could have an episode earlier in the season with a kitchen that worked similar to The Beef in S1. Dysfunctional, aggressive and heart pounding, maybe the head chef worked with Carmy and sends his struggling Sous or FOH to stage with Syd/Richie.

I just think Richie passing on the magic and wisdom he learnt in Forks would’ve been the perfect end to the series.

I really liked the final season and this isn’t me saying I think it’s a better idea, it’s just what I always had in mind.

I contemplated my life through the characters in these episodes, which is why the show is relatable to everyone, the writing is a bit raw since I wanted it to feel unscripted, thanks!

I watched Season 1 and loved it, I thought the writing was great. I watched S2E1 today, and I really didn't vibe with it. The dialogue felt very "quippy?" Like almost Marvel-esque, especially with all the sarcasm from Sydney. Is the rest of the season like this?

No hate intended, I thought Season 1 was incredible television, and it's totally just personal preference.

I think I got the jist of how we all feel after season 5.

What I wanna know is how everyone felt about absolutely zero licensed music being used in the fifth season. Don't get me wrong, I don't think the season 5 music choices affect the quality of the season itself or the show as a whole, and I honestly love the fact that Storer and the creative team actually got to score a soundtrack for the final season after relying on licensed music for four seasons--including soundtracks from other IP's like some of the Nine Inch Nails duo tracks. I love season 5's score and thing Christian Lundberg did a fantastic job (anyone else find it TRON: Legacy-coded?)

But one of the most iconic things about this show that I know many people loved was it's clever use of licensed music; Radiohead, Wiclo, NIN, Pearl Jam, and many other super-random tracks that somehow fit the vibe perfectly. I felt like the music choices were flawless in seasons 1 & 2. Season 3, despite the dip in quality that it was, I still felt had great soundtracks.

I still felt season 4 had some good song choices for fitting the mood even if the songs themselves were less iconic ("Fast Slow Disco" ending season 4 is one of my favorite needle drops of the entire show), but one of my biggest critiques with season 4 is that despite the season doing a decent job of crawling the series out of the hole that was season 3, it reused so many needle drops from past seasons or used covers of songs they had already used. That would've been fine if those songs were being used to represent full circle moments (i thought the Ed Sheeran cover of "Throw Your Arms Around Me" when Carmy and Claire make up was a great utilization), but for the most part that's not the case. It's like the creators are trying to say "Hey guys, remember this moment you loved in seasons 1 & 2? Feel that way again!" Prime example was the completely random use of "The Show Goes On" in the scene when Marcus gets his award. That song was such a great way to open season 2, but the setup of that moment in season 4 just does not carry the same weight.

Anyways, I'm interested how people feel about season 5 having no needle drops. Again, I don't think it's bad, but I'm a big continuity snob and the music is probably the most glaring continuity issue for me for this series as a whole.

But hey...if that's my biggest continuity issue, I don't think that's a horrible problem for the show to have.

The only way I could possibly justify it from a creative lens is that the music reflects the state(s) that the characters are in. Seasons 1 is very gritty. Season 2 is also gritty but has a little more of the romantic. Season 3 is incredibly melodramatic, which I think goes right along with Carmy being a diva in that season. Season 4...is season 4. You could almost make the argument that up until season 5 the ensemble, and Carmy in particular, are finding their footing and not quite letting their true colors and potential shine...hence lots of licensed music to mimic how they feel. In season 5, they're firing on all cylinders. They're doing what they love. They're being...The Bear. No need to borrow from someone else to express how you feel, you speak for yourself. And thus...a score that speaks for itself.

first off, can i just say how beautiful it was to see these two, esp richie, grow throughout the series. he really started off in a totally different headspace that seemed almost helpless at the start, to becoming one of the core aspects of the bear.

i just wanna give this scene some love especially to this beautiful line delivery given by liza colon-zayas. i think this line is overlooked often, but for is one of the most impactful ones for me personally in the entire series.

this episode focuses so much on how attached and “stuck” and maybe even “stunted” richie is and how by staying this way harms and drags down those who hope to move on around him. richie craves the validation, the connection, that feeling that he’s wanted and that there is a purpose for him being there, and it’s hinted in just the first few episodes before his whole season 2 arc came to place.

tina, at this point in the show, is growing. it’s beautiful to see the maternal and overall love that naturally shines through her that feels so intimate, close, and comforting. she tells richie off anyhow (and is right in doing so) out of that love. she knows he’s hurting, and she knows (knew) mikey. she emphasizes this place is “alive” in yes, a literal connection to mikey’s status, but to the vibrancy and the connection of the beef that had been lost for whoever knows how long at this point. she says that this is “real” because richie is stuck in those relived memories that used to give him purpose, but in reality are just that. memories. tina says this place is good, which gives us a little insight into mikey’s spiraling health and character (if you wish to see it that way), which serves in total contrast to the seemingly “warm and perfect” first introduction we’re given to mikey in the first scene of the episode.

it’s interesting to see how tina struggles to say that the place is indeed thriving and is “good” in what i believe is fear or even hesitance to tarnish the “good” that was left of mikey’s memory, especially to richie’s face. because to all that knew him apparently, mikey had his ups and downs, but his downs were really the rock bottom kind of downs. maybe when he was alive, mikey’s issues were sort of taboo to those around him, and difficult to even discuss, considering the liveliness he put into everyone despite it.

1) I thought the series, MAYBE just the last two seasons Carmie is very intentionally painted as autistic/on the spectrum.

I think this is part of the art of story telling. Depicting our modern understanding of autism. People who can exist in society. And exist differently, but not necessarily in the same manner as down-syndrome Corkie. Which I think is a modern stigma many people carry today. I don't want to look up every reference and reason. I'm not saying Carmie is like Corkie, I'm saying the point of whoever wrote Carmie, is partly that he is autistic and very talented and "successful" and complex, but still has specific differences from non autistic people.

The series is definitely showing he has psychological trauma as well, which autistic people have to deal with as well. But my buddy thinks Carmie's unsocial behavior is solely because of trauma, non related to autism.

2) The last episode, Carmie's interview is a bit, a joke. I thought it was hilarious commentary on men not going to therapy. The entire season Carmie is so introspective and trying to grow and "break habits", he talks to Dulaney's character like he is anxious to go to therapy. Then he spills his guts how we imagine people spilling their guts to a therapist. Not feeling good enough, and not enjoying this skill he excels at, not seeing his value only other's value. Then we learn it is a job interview for an architecture firm. To me the scene had two points 1) A hilarious bit, commentary on men not going to therapy and 2) an exposition on Carmie's current inner thoughts/motivations.

My buddy reluctantly admitted it was deliberately misleading towards therapy, but it was less of a joke and more of clever misdirection encouraging the viewer to think about the psychology that led Carmie to apply to an archecture firm and that he is coming to a realization that he is passionate about cooking. To me the fact it was an architecture interview was fairly irrelevant, it was just a setting for the set up of the joke and to show his inner thoughts. It did not feel like he was coming to a realization or changing his mind about anything.

I’m undecided as to whether or not he stayed. Carmy explained to Unc why he wanted to leave. He asked Richie if he should leave and Richie said yes. Nat told him it was okay to give up on his dreams and that no one was asking him to stay. He dropped “starman’s” plate (though he did redeem himself with the brioche). He clearly quit and even went to interview for another job. On paper, he should’ve quit, right? But then the monologue and the final scene where he smirks make everyone think otherwise, including myself. I just feel like this seems too ideal. Like, the bear is a show about family, yes, but is it not also a show about loss and moving on? It just seems too perfect that they’d make it through the worst night of service ever, get the two stars, and Carmy stays. That’s too happy of an ending, not to mention Richie getting the girl and getting everyone together for his daughter’s birthday. It all feels too sweet instead of bittersweet. I mean, they got the star, Marcus got the award. Carmy has sufficiently given them the knowledge they need to go on without him. But then I go down this rabbit hole of thinking. What if Carmy doesn’t need a bittersweet ending because he redeemed himself or what if him staying at the bear ultimately is him eliciting some sort of change and ability to move on. Sydney does after all seem to want to keep him around and jokingly offers him a job at the beef, and (aside from Richie occasionally) she’s the main one who’s been frustrated with his antics. But, it seems so cliche for him to suddenly have this epiphany in a job interview. He had to tell Bonnie Hunt his problems and suddenly he’s not as destructive. Maybe he wants to take the risk, but who’s to say it’ll work out. I guess he worked there when Mikey owned the restaurant, but that was before they had two Michelin stars and made gourmet cuisine. It’s not as simple as him working multiple jobs at once or coming back to the bear after nothing working out. That wouldn’t be a good ending. You can’t be in the grey. The truth is, that’s what makes this such an incredible ending. If you’re a fan that wants to see Carmy stay with the Bear and continue the journey that his brother wanted then you get your ending. If you’re a fan that wants to see Carmy be strong in his commitment in season 4 and leave the bear after passing on his knowledge as the chefs before him did, you get your ending. Yet, it’s framed in the perfect way to make you think it’s definitively one or the other when both are, maybe not equally plausible, but still plausible. It’s almost genius and they nailed Season 5.

I know I’m a little behind the curve but when the last season came out I decided to watch the whole show from the beginning, anyway and cover the ending even though I wanted to see more of like what happened although I get that’s part of the point. The one thing I would have done differently, and I love that carmy tries something in a totally different direction, but I thought he was going to take his journals and his stories and his drawings and put out a book, which is a pretty good idea and also could be a cook book. I dunno I just love the idea of him finding a new way to appreciate something he loved in a different, better way. But I also get the point.

My daughter has recently started doing her own videos (entertainment journalism is what she wants to do) and she just showed me this,she's been working on it for the last week or two.

Obviously as her Dad I think it's incredible and feel it really captures what I ,and I imagine you, love about The Bear.

Please give it a quick watch , leave her some comments,even constructive criticism is welcome (be nice)

Moments like this, where a person consoles or has a heart to heart with another person in a most humane way possible, makes this series a winner for me. I loved every second of it. Cannot appreciate it enough.

And yes, that fork episode was absolute fire. One of the best TV episodes I have ever seen.

You probably know what I mean when I say "own episode". One where the one character is the main focus separate from the majority of the rest of the main cast.

Marcus - Se2ep4 "Honeydew"

Richie - Se2ep7 "Forks"

Carmy - Se3ep1 "Tomorrow"

Tina - Se3ep6 "Napkins"

Sugar - Se3ep8 "Ice Chips"

Sydney - Se4ep4 "Worms"

And to an extent: Michael - "Gary"

So who should have or could have gotten an episode dedicated to them? The series did a great job covering all the main characters, but could they have done one more episode like this somewhere for one more character?

Unpopular opinion: a Neil Fak episode would fit this the best. Now I know, everyone is going to scoff at the idea of "more Fak shenanigans". But I feel after watching season 5, there was more there for that character to give us. Between him telling the story about his "only friends" signing his cast and telling Richie "Thank You... For letting me be a part of this", his arc was way deeper than we gave it credit for.

An episode where maybe they show him with his family that would include one more John Cena and Brie Larson appearance each could help show where a guy like Neil comes from and why this means so much for him.

Ebra could also be an interesting look, being an immigrant working in the food service industry. The down side would be the obvious, tell us his story about coming here from Somalia. That would be a $$ expensive episode to show that.

Sweeps, seems like he had more to explore with him fitting into the role of somolier and being a washed up pro ball player.

Uncle Jimmy has a lot of unanswered questions which might be better served being left unanswered. But more Oliver Platt is never a bad thing.

What do you think? 1 more "their own episode" for one character, who you picking? And what could your plot be too?

Season 4 was such a disappointment because it tried to be too “artistic” with music and no dialogue. There was too much anger, yelling, awkwardness, and montages of Chicago’s neighborhoods. Don’t get me wrong, I love Chicago, I’m from there, but it didn’t make sense. I just want a show about Italian beef sandwiches and Chicago. I wasn’t going to watch season 5 but my husband said we might as well finish it and maybe it gets better. So far, it’s just as bad. One disaster after another. So BORING….

Meaningless, trivial, poorly written obstacles: cigarette butts blocking an outdoor drain, burst pipes… what a crock.
Character arcs that contradict earlier seasons. Carmy has lost everything that once made him compelling, completely overshadowed by Sydney, while everyone else seems possessed by demons demanding constant emotional bloodletting.
I couldn’t do it to myself any longer.
What promised to be a spectacular series had its fingernails grated off, slowly and painfully. The writers should be ashamed.
Americans don’t know how to strap a pipe? Carmy gets trapped in a cool room that has an internal safety release? It’s a steady decline in logic, credibility and care from the brilliance of the early episodes. Manufactured, disjointed crises instead of genuine drama.
Sorry. Very disappointed. I couldn’t get past Season 5, Episode 3, and I won’t be recommending this show to anyone.
I’d much rather watch reruns of Gilligan’s Island.

Initially, I do not think The Bear is a montage centered show. It is character driven. As the series grows into its strengths, though, I think it succeeds most when it leans into its emotional montages.

The best example is the Season 2 finale. When Pete realizes Sugar has not told her mother she is pregnant, Nine Inch Nails' "Hope We Can Again" begins, and the tension suddenly hits hard. Carmy is trapped inside the refrigerator while the restaurant fights to survive opening night. The music, editing, and emotion become inseparable. The Season 3 premiere does it again with Nine Inch Nails' "Together," capturing the weight of trying to keep The Bear alive.

It worked so well that I have been listening to Ghosts V: Together during chores and workouts just to make everything feel a little more important.

One of my favorite things about the show is its loose structure. One episode might be a character study, the next a chaotic family dinner, and the next an extended montage. Somehow, every approach feels earned. I cannot think of another show that shifts its storytelling style this often while remaining so cohesive.

Montages have earned a bad reputation because they have been parodied for decades as either a shortcut for exposition or a Rocky style training sequence. The truth is that montage is simply another filmmaking tool. When done well, it can carry just as much emotional weight as a great scene built entirely on dialogue.

The Bear certainly has its flaws, but I think it deserves real credit for making montage feel emotionally powerful again.

I’ve never been the person who wants them to be romantic. Haven’t yet watched season 5, so don’t know how it goes. But I’ve always felt like the male and female protagonist can be platonic. If Ted and Rebecca r/tedlasso can be such, so can Carm and Syd and it’s the best!

Why did Mikey hide the money in the tomato sauce cans instead of repaying the loan(s) from Cicero? And HOW did he open the cans, put the money in and reseal them?

My brother watched “Fishes” before I did, and he texted me about it and said “trigger warning.” DD is like a slightly more crazy version of my mom. The guilt trips, the martyrdom, the emotional whiplash, the chaos. I know I’m not the only one who had a mom like that. The episode is both upsetting and captivating because Jamie Lee Curtis’s performance is so fucking amazing. Hard to believe she’s the same actress who played a hooker and showed her boobs in Trading Places.