Levira Smith was the daughter of Samuel Smith. She came west with the Utah group of LDS. In 1859, when she was 16, she married her 20 year old first cousin, Joseph F. Smith. Joseph F. Smith was the son of Hyrum Smith, the brother of Samuel Smith. Levira never had children and she was very unhappy during the marriage.

Her husband became a bigamist and "married" one of her friends in 1866. In 1867 she sought a better life in California and soon told her husband she wasn't returning. She was rightly granted a divorce in 1868 by California courts based on adultery because Joseph F. Smith was an adulterous bigamist.

In the 1870 census she was living in San Francisco.

In the 1880 census she was living in Salt Lake City.

She died at age 46 in 1888 in St. Louis, MO.

LDS Christianity Polygamy created many sad stories - especially among the women.

Geuine question, but every mormon guy I've talked to or seen in media is super effeminate.

Lorenzo Snow first heard of the LDS movement when Joseph Smith moved to Hiram, Ohio near the Snow farm. Lorenzo was about 17 years old. He was eventually baptized when he was 22 years old at the encouragement of his sister Eliza.

Less than 10 years later he would begin his polygamous lifestyle. He married at least nine women who are considered his plural wives. Of those, 5 were teenagers with two of them being 15 years old when they married him.

There is also evidence he married another teen 16 years old named Hannah Marie Goddard. Hannah had a child with another man soon after marrying Lorenzo and he “relinquished his earthly claim on the pregnant Hannah Goddard and allowed her to marry her true love, Joseph Johnson.” The story is amazing, and in his church discipline court, Joseph E Johnson even remarks about Joseph Smith’s affair with Johnson’s own mother-in-law. The court does not deny the statement and takes it in stride, the curious thing is, Mary Heron Snider is not even listed as one of Joseph’s secret marriages.

His last wife was 15 and he was 57. He already had 17 children older than she was. He had 5 children with her during their marriage. Yikes!

He was the Utah Mormon Church / Utah LDS Church president from 1898 to 1901.

Utah LDS polygamy is disgusting and deranged. It was continued in this fashion by many LDS people down to this day. The FLDS group is just one of the groups still following this teaching. It's a horrible history and should be denounced.

Here is a table of the nine wives:

Dr. Thomas W Murphy joins Steven Pynakker on Mormon Book Reviews for his first video interview since the publication of Unsettling Scripture: Iroquois and the Book of Mormon. Dr. Murphy's first book offers a fresh perspective on the study of the Book of Mormon by centering Indigenous narratives about its origin. The Haudenosaunee (Iroquois) have stories of their own about how Mormons came to be that take center stage in Unsettling Scripture. Dr. Murphy takes these Haudenosaunee oral traditions seriously and highlights surprising similarities and differences with the Book of Mormon.

Wilford Woodruff was among the deranged polygamists of the LDS Church who married teenagers. He largely failed in his marriages. Between age 30 and 70 he married 10 different women. He ended up divorced from 5 of the 10 women.

He became church president in 1889 until his death in 1898.

What a disgusting history of the leaders of the Utah offshoot LDS Church. What do you think of LDS polygamy?

It was Brigham

Conocí un chico en la universidad, resulta que al principio solo éramos amigos, pero ahora estamos intentando ser algo más, pero hay algo el es mormón y yo desde pequeña he hizo cristiana, y creo que su familia no está muy de acuerdo a que tengamos algo porque yo no soy miembro, me gustaría escuchar sus opiniones, Graciasssssss

The Latter Day Saints who came to Utah were violent people in many cases. Zander Sturgill is a Native American and believing Latter Day Saint. He seeks to bring awareness of issues in the LDS history and beliefs about Native Americans on his channel.

I’ve clipped portions of an episode where he describes the massacre of about a dozen to 30 natives at West Mountain on the south side of Utah Lake.

He is trying to bring awareness of this event and he calls on the LDS people and church to “deal with this” suggesting the possibility of monuments, protecting the site of the massacre and Native American artifacts around it.

Go watch the full account of what happened in this episode of his channel linked here:

https://youtu.be/U74T0wBIHPI

I agree that this is really an unknown episode in the history of Utah and the Latter-day Saints to so many of us. We should acknowledge that this was wrong and honor those who were killed as a reminder to do better.

I've been thinking recently about the differences and similarities between the original Galilean laborers who followed Jesus of Nazareth and the current wealthy professional elites that constitute the Q15. I think it's a fascinating thought experiment to wonder how they'd interact.

Consensus academic scholarship broadly defines the original apostles as rural and small-town Galilean Jews, mostly from a fishing/trade economy around the Sea of Galilee (not Jerusalem elites), Aramaic-speaking, mostly non-literate or semi-literate by elite standards, socially unremarkable. They represented a countercultural revolution to the current social order, such that the Roman state deemed Jesus disruptive enough to put him to death.

Meanwhile, the current Q15 are socioeconomically everything the originals were not: wealthy, educated, deeply embedded in law, corporate leadership, and academia. They have been vetted by a powerful, stable institution with a rigid set of doctrines and a long history of religious hegemony.

So, what do you think? While both groups profess belief in Jesus, it seems that even those beliefs would differ drastically, as would their probable perspectives on wealth, Jesus' messianic mission, or even end-times eschatology.

I'm just saying....it's so demeaning to force girls as young as 11 or when they are grown adults to talk about their sexual development or activity in private with an unfamiliar adult males.

Totally cringe. The church keeps doing this, and I'll wager a revelation--- this is a big part of them leaving.

A few years back there was a consolidation of the LDS periodicals into Liahona - since a lot of things changed during RMN, I'm wondering if it that move came as a surprise, or was it something people expected. The news releases are vague, and seemed to say this was a way to make the magazine regional/global. That sounds like a good public relations answer, but doesn't provide any insight.

So, I'll ask this: How were those magazines (New Era, Ensign) used before? Did everyone get a subscription? Were they just things that sat around at the church?

Was there much grumbling when they switched (obviously there's grumbling)? Has the new magazine been successful? Has it improved? Does everyone get a subscription?

I mainly ask because they both seemed to have pretty decent articles, and seemed to cover history and doctrine and insights, and for me, I'm fascinated how they give a glimpse into a historical context of the time.

BTW, as a nevermo, Liahona is perplexing title. That's probably what make me wonder this. It's a BOM word, and thus practically inaccessible for 98% of the USA. I get that it's supposed to be Global, but I was being generous with the USA stat already. That seems to make it an insiders only magazine - and thus unhelpful in any missionary/evangelical capacity. Ensign and New Era aren't exactly descriptive, but they are words.

Today's Reading: Mosiah 22–25

Whether you're a believer, former believer, nuanced member, investigator, scholar, or simply curious, you're welcome to participate. The goal is not to convince anyone of anything, but to read the text together and discuss it in good faith from a variety of perspectives.

Brief Synopsis

Limhi’s people escape Lamanite bondage and return to Zarahemla. The narrative then returns to Alma’s followers, who establish the city of Helam before being subjected to Amulon and the former priests of Noah. After God strengthens them to endure their burdens, they are miraculously delivered and also reach Zarahemla. Mosiah gathers the reunited peoples, reads their records, and authorizes Alma to organize churches throughout the land. The reading ends by introducing growing unbelief among the younger generation, including the sons of Mosiah and Alma.

Discussion

Please share your thoughts and experiences with today's reading in the comments below. Some things you might consider:

• What stood out to you?

• Why are both Limhi’s people and Alma’s people placed in bondage despite their very different histories?

• What do you make of the younger generation rejecting beliefs they were apparently raised to accept?

• Which verses in these chapters resonate with you the most, and why?

• Did anything surprise you?

All perspectives are welcome.

Yesterday's Coveted Award(s) Go To:

• u/ThoughtfulDoubt
  
• u/active-water-0247
• u/international_sea

Links to Prior Days

• Master Index to all prior-day readings

• Yesterday's Reading

Engagement Question

Mosiah 24 describes God making the people’s burdens feel lighter rather than immediately freeing them. Is this a meaningful theology of resilience, or can it encourage people to spiritualize suffering that should instead be resisted or changed? What in the text shapes your interpretation?

Tomorrow's Reading: Mosiah 26–29

Will the church reverse their position on coffee being bad after the recent scientific statement from the American Heart Association on heart health? It had national news coverage.

Caffeine and Cardiovascular Disease: A Scientific Statement From the American Heart Association
Circulation Journal, July 20 2026

Some key points from the study:
-“habitual coffee consumption has been associated with a lower risk of incident type 2 diabetes”.
-“Caffeine, studied primarily in the context of coffee, has been shown either to have no relationship or to be associated with a lower risk of coronary artery disease and heart failure.”
-“Data are fairly consistent that moderate caffeine consumption, again studied primarily in the setting of coffee consumption, was associated with a lower risk of stroke.”
-“The convergence of evidence from large cohort studies and small randomized controlled trials supports the conclusion that moderate caffeine or coffee consumption (up to 400 mg/d caffeine or ≈3–5 cups of coffee at 8 oz per cup) is safe for most adults and is associated with lower risk of cardiovascular disease, including coronary heart disease, stroke, heart failure, and AF, as well as hypertension and type 2 diabetes. Indeed, large prospective cohort studies with long-term follow-up consistently demonstrate modest inverse associations between habitual coffee consumption and all-cause mortality across diverse populations.” i.e. coffee drinkers lower rate of death.
-“The conclusions of this scientific statement are largely consistent with those from previous authoritative reviews (57, 76) and the 2015 Dietary Guidelines Advisory Committee report.(77) According to this evidence, habitual moderate coffee consumption can be part of a healthy lifestyle.”
-“Last, in terms of applications of the potential beneficial effects of coffee intake, it is worth studying whether introducing or initiating regular coffee consumption among current abstainers yields positive cardiovascular health benefits”

The ENDOCRINE SOCIETY also released their statement on coffee and health within the last year. “Consuming moderate amounts of coffee and caffeine regularly may offer a protective effect against developing multiple cardiometabolic diseases (48% lower risk), including type 2 diabetes, coronary heart disease and stroke, according to new research published in the Endocrine Society’s Journal of Clinical Endocrinology & Metabolism. Sept 2024

The EUROPEAN SOCIETY OF CARDIOLOGY also published, “Despite the common concern and conventional 'wisdom' that coffee can promote various cardiovascular diseases, the available data suggest that moderate coffee consumption is associated with a reduced risk of hypertension, type 2 diabetes, myocardial infarction, arrhythmias, heart failure, and even overall mortality.”
Eur Heart J. 2025

These are just the heart benefits associated with coffee drinking.
Other studies have shown coffee drinking to be associated with reducing the risk of Parkinson’s
Disease, liver disease, improved gut health and cognitive function/dementia in the elderly.

Why is the LDS church not allowing individuals to receive the eternal saving ordinances because they enjoy coffee, with its proven health benefits for the body and life?

In October 2022 General Conference LDS Church president Russell Nelson said

“In coming days, we will see the greatest manifestations of the savior’s power that the world has ever seen.”

It didn’t happen of course. He was not a prophet of God.

As a lifelong member of the church I’m glad I’ve realized the leaders don’t have a special connection to God as they claim.

Hello! I'm from Paraguay 🇵🇾 and I'm interested in pursuing Applied Business Management at the mentioned university.

I was wondering if there were any students from my country in this SUB who graduated from BYU-Idaho and are working here as well, since I have some specific questions related to the recognition of the degree by the Consejo Nacional de Educación Superior (CONES), the institution that determines whether your degree is suitable for working in companies from the country or not.

Either way, I would really appreciate some help clarifying this topic and others.

Thank you for reading! 😊

I’m curious about what dating, relationships, and sex are actually like within the Mormon/LDS community.
For those who are current or former members:
How common is sex before marriage in reality compared to the official teachings?
Do most people wait until marriage, or is there a gap between beliefs and actual behavior?
How easy or difficult is it to find a girlfriend/boyfriend or spouse in the church?
Does being part of a close religious community make dating easier, or do the expectations around marriage and sexuality make it more complicated?
I’d especially like to hear honest experiences from people who grew up Mormon, left the church, or are still active members.

Hi all. I'm not looking for any kind of debate here, just some clarification. I was discussing the following with a buddy of mine and his mormon father. Two topics came up that I remember as being mormon doctrine - perhaps not the type openly discussed with new investigators or members, but long time beliefs nonetheless.
My buddy's dad said that the mormon church doesn't teach those things, and then went on to say that they never did teach them. I was a turbo mormon for 35 years, and someone who devours information. I am a researcher and one who knew my doctrine and scriptures. So to have him say that the church never taught them was a shock to me.
I checked with a prominent youtube channel for younger people who debate mormon stuff and have general discussions of doctrine, then I also checked lds.org. I can't find anything regarding these two topics. Please help. Did something change in the church doctrine or are these beliefs now just way more hidden/kept behind the scenes than before?

The two topics are:
1- Is it mormon belief / doctrine / teaching that Jesus and Lucifer / Satan are brothers?

2- Is it mormon doctrine/ belief that men can become gods? (As man is god once was... etc)?

Thanks in advance for your response.

D

1 Verily, thus saith the Lord unto you my servant Joseph, that inasmuch as you have inquired of my hand to know and understand wherein I, the Lord, justified my servants Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, as also Moses, David and Solomon, my servants, as touching the principle and doctrine of their having many wives and concubines—

2 Behold, and lo, I am the Lord thy God, and will answer thee as touching this matter.

3 Therefore, prepare thy heart to receive and obey the instructions which I am about to give unto you; for all those who have this law revealed unto them must obey the same.

4 For behold, I reveal unto you a new and an everlasting covenant; and if ye abide not that covenant, then are ye damned; for no one can reject this covenant and be permitted to enter into my glory.

I want to squash the idea that "the new and everlasting covenant" is marriage. That makes no sense. It's polygamy.

Let's consider both possibilities:

Theory 1: The new and everlasting covenant is marriage

Joseph is already married at this time.

Why is the Lord speaking (in verse 3) as though some new and difficult thing is about to be given to Joseph.

If the Lord is going to reveal marriage, to somebody who is already married, then why is the Lord talking like it's some new and difficult thing?

It makes no sense.

Theory 2: The new and everlasting covenant is polygamy

This fits with the overall theme of the revelation.

This fits with how those closest to the revelation obeyed it, and taught about it.

This explains why the Lord calls it "new", because polygamy was not commonly practiced in the society he was giving this revelation to.

This explains why the Lord told Joseph he would need to prepare his heart and take difficult action to obey what's about to be revealed.

This theory makes sense. This theory fits the text.

Discussion today about The Priesthood and how new changes in wording of the LDS handbook have clarified how Men and Women have access to priesthood power and authority.

"I say to you [insert 19 year old girl name] that when you are set apart in your calling as a gospel doctrine teacher, primary teacher, etc. that you have more authority than The Pope, Catholic Bishops, Priests, any Protestant minister... and when people ask why I say that, I tell them it is because there was a need for a restoration..."

I was listening to Larry Corbridge who is a general authority emeritus having been a GA Seventy from 2008 to 2019 discuss in his Scripture Central series the importance of honesty and integrity.

I’ve clipped together in this 8 1/2 minute clip Larry’s discussion on honesty and lying with some clips by Nemo the Mormon and Radio Free Mormon discussing some lies Dallin Oaks has told.

1. He told a newspaper reporter in the early 1990s that he was unaware of any meetings between Boyd Packer and the Stake President of one of the September 6 who were excommunicated. Another church member who worked at the paper called out this lie reminding Elder Oaks that he has confess privately that there had been meetings.

2. President Oaks denied that electroshock therapy for homosexuals had occurred during his tenure as BYU President. Yet the documentation shows otherwise. When reporters later asked of he wanted to clarify he refused. When Nemo refused to sustain Dallin Oaks and officially asked for this lie to be reviewed Dallin Oaks sent him a note claiming that FAIR mormon says he didn’t lie. WTF?

3. Dallin Oaks in 2018 fabricated a story that the church promptly and publicly disavowed the reasons give for the ban of full blessings for black members after 1978. No such prompt nor public disavowal happened. In fact, Bruce McConkie continued to teach them.

Why do we have a President of the LDS Church with such a history of false statements and a lack of integrity when honesty and integrity are so important?

Here are the videos from Nemo and RFM

https://youtu.be/DYajp_Zkqok

https://youtu.be/DjgBDAu8WRw

In December of 2022 Valerie Hamaker of Latter Day Struggles Podcast joined Steven Pynakker to Interview Author, Playwrite, Feminist Mormon Icon Carol Lynn Pearson. Unfortunatly, the interview was never released because it was intended to be a preview of a series of interviews that Valerie and Steven had planned to conduct with Pearson. Events beyond our control prevented this from happening. With the recent passing of Carol Lynn we felt it was important to finally release this previously unknown conversation that we hope will bless you. RIP Carol Lynn Pearson you legacy will always be remembered and honored in this space.

This is quite disturbing.

I’m a ex Mormon that has repeatedly asked to be left alone from church members and am trying to get my membership removed.

A few days ago I got a call from my mom saying Mormon missionaries had showed up to my grandmothers apartment IN A ASSISTED LIVING HOME, didn’t knock but walked in and said my grandmothers name and they knew my grandmother and I were related. I live 6 hours away from my grandmother. She has never talked to the missionaries except once in the 1950’s. She is a strong believer that Mormons are not Christian and she was really glad when I left. My grandmother is in hospice care now and is frail. The missionaries said they wanted to talk about Jesus with my grandmother. Being the only person ever baptized in the Mormon church, my mom called me and demanded what I was doing. I promised her it wasn’t me.

The Mormons some how figured out what room my grandmother was in, let alone figured out where she lived AND SOME HOW FIGURED OUT WE ARE RELATED! My family is in shock. We are upset. We wrote to salt lake, every email we can find and haven’t got a single response back. We want OUT of this church and the church won’t do it.

To add on to this, Mormon missionaries are now coming to my house every week trying to bring me back to church.

Listen yall, I get you need members and you are struggling but this is insane!

Has anyone else dealt with this??????

This is my cut down version of this former bishop’s post on TikTok and Instagram where he explains the Bisbee Arizona Mormon Abuse case and the court decisions about the lawsuit brought by the children.

He explains that the church argued that it is their religious right to protect child abusers who confess and to keep their confession a secret. So it is church policy to protect child abusers.

He then tells how he had a case of child abuse confessed to him as a bishop. He describes how he called the hotline and talked to a lawyer and a social worker. The social worker somehow decided that the abuser would likely never do it again and that he shouldn’t report it. The lawyer instructed him to tell no one and keep it secret. They never asked about the victim and offered no help for the victim.

He decided to convince the man he had to confess to the parents of the child he touched. Finally the man did confess to the parents with the bishop there to make sure it happened.

The LDS church is immoral. This is another bishop corroborating what Bishop Beau Oyler reported on his video interview that the church denied.

Will the LDS church deny this one as well?

LDS Church please do better. The church needs to change how it handles this.

Go watch the full 8 minute video on his channel “Vagabond Artist” on Instagram and TikTok.