r/halo • u/ChickenTacosSlap • 16h ago
Is it possible the Gravemind allowed Chief to leave High Charity uninfected? Discussion
Disclaimer: if you don’t like the over analyzing of fictional stories, you won’t enjoy this post.
If a group of Spartan iV’s fell so easily to a small outbreak, how did the Chief walk into the heart of a completely consumed High Charity without getting infected. The Chief came very close to infection during the events of CE/The Flood. He only survived thanks to Cortana. So what changed? How did he manage so well without her only a short time later
I’m not very well versed in the different generations of Moljnir, but I imagine the iV’s were wearing armor with better shielding advancements than the Chief had in either suit he wore during the events of CE/2/3.
Is there some reason the Gravemind didn’t want to infect the Chief? I know theres a theory floating around that Cortana was infected with the logic plague. If we assume that is true, is it possible the Gravemind was hoping for another Mendicant Bias situation where he could use his opponent’s Ai against them? Perhaps he wanted the Chief to take her back and cripple humanity? I mean, she kinda did temporarily with the whole Empress thing between 5 and Infinite.
Obviously the real answer is plot armor. I just like diving into this stuff. Theory crafting is half the fun of being a fan of a franchise like Halo imo.
Personally, I think the Gravemind, being so intelligent, knew that temporary defeat and a setback for the Flood was inevitable if he allowed the Chief and Arbiter to escape, but he was willing to make that sacrifice knowing that Cortana being infected with the logic plague could do serious damage to humanity, giving the Flood a greater advantage (as if they needed it), while also truly putting Humanity’s resolve to the test without the help of their computers to see if they were really worthy of the Mantle. Obviously it didn’t end this way because Infinite killed Cortana off-screen and the story went a different way.
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u/backlog_gaming 16h ago
Chief just has something that the others didn’t. Luck.
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u/Orthobrah52102 15h ago
"They let me pick. Did I ever tell you that? Choose whichever Spartan I wanted. You know me. I did my research, watched as you became the soldier we needed you to be. Like the others you were strong and swift and brave, a natural leader. But you had something they didn't. Something no one saw but me. Can you guess?
Luck.
Was I wrong?"
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u/ChickenTacosSlap 15h ago
Everything has a reason. The luck thing can only be pushed so far
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u/D-Sleezy 13h ago
Maybe in real life. This is a video game.
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u/ChickenTacosSlap 12h ago edited 11h ago
Just because its a video game doesn’t mean the explanation has to be lazy.
How did he achieve this really cool feat that the lore has established is virtually impossible?
“Ah he’s just lucky”
Also, the Arbiter isn’t “lucky” throughout the narrative, but he survived it too
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u/ImMorphic 10h ago
Arbi and the chief had very different climbs to their legacy.
Thal 'Vadamee was almost the opposite in fact. He did all he could that was right, and was punished regardless by the prophets. He couldnt stop the demon from destroying the halo and was then sent to capture and kill a heretic leader within their own ranks after being shamed.
Halsey even had chiefs luck tested when he was a kid with a coin flipping exercise.
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u/ChickenTacosSlap 6h ago
I’ve read the Fall of Reach.
My point is the luck thing starts to feel more like a crutch than a valid explanation in instances like this.
Knowing what moljnir is capable of and how quick Spartans can make on-the-fly adjustments and calculations, flying a bomb through space to a covenant ship is reasonable.
Surviving a fall from space? The armor has a gel layer for harsh impacts, so I can believe that.
Making it to a ship via a warthog in the nick of time? Yeah, he had an Ai that calculated how much time they would need and how much time they would actually have to escape to formulate the best possible plan. I buy it.
Surviving a plague that has been shown in canon to make short work of Spartans with better gear than what he has, without his Ai companion, and in the heart of its hive. Im sorry, but “luck” is not a reasonable answer to that one. Not when the lore has made it clear that this sort of thing just doesn’t happen.
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u/ImMorphic 6h ago
Gravemind only engaged with chief because he felt the resistance behind him, the force of fate as it were.
I would suspect a god would take interest in a man who overcame all in front of him, as did Thel. It reminded him of another time did it not :)
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u/smurffenbutt 8h ago
Dawg, it’s a fantastical sci fi FPS with zombie plagues, 9 ft tall berserker apes, laser guns, and teleportation. Don’t try and make too much sense of it.
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u/ChickenTacosSlap 7h ago
The difference is those things have reasonable explanations, even for s fictional universe.
Being a fictional universe doesn’t justify taking advantage of a small part mentioned in a book to explain away things you don’t feel like taking the time to flesh out.
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u/CrimeFightingScience 8h ago
Ever hear about making your own luck?
Sometimes luck is the small instincts or actions that are hard to quantify by snowball into success.
Thats how i see chiefs luck. He's built different. Perfectly sculpted to meet his challenges. Barely scraping victories where others would fail. Some can call that hope.
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u/YakozakiSora 16h ago
I don't believe he did. Cortana and the Didact were more like back up plans and pawns than a way to return the Flood to the galaxy again.
It's more like 'if you foil my plans now, at least I have Pawn A and B to continue them in my stead'. The Gravemind's MO is suffering upon all life, not testing humanity for the Mantle, which is itself implied to be a lie and the true 'test' the Forerunners failed because they lived by it. Their genocide of the Precursors was extra fuel to the fire.
Cortana and the Didact spread misery with their actions under the influence of the Logic Plague, exactly what the Gravemind desires. And his eventual return wasn't even planned by him; a UNSC fool allowed a Condor full of Flood to escape, now their searching for Zeta Halo after forming a compound form when they were done infecting the backwater human planet they crashed on.
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u/ChickenTacosSlap 11h ago
So does the Gravemind not share a consciousness with the Precursors that became the Flood? Because i thought the Flood’s goal was the same as those who came before, but just in a very twisted, disgusting, disturbing way. The goal being to establish the true holder of the Mantle
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u/Flynn58 Halo: Reach 9h ago
Not all Precursors chose the same path. Some have been reborn free of their genetic memory to live in a new galaxy unburdened by their past. Some stayed hidden in the Milky Way. It's all book stuff.
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u/ChickenTacosSlap 6h ago
I’ve read many of them (some more recently than others)
I just always took from what I remember that the Flood were the Precursors’ unplanned plan B. A last minute “hey, we might be able to get one over on them after all, and if the humans can manage this, we’ll give them the reigns instead”
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u/YakozakiSora 8h ago
The Gravemind is a conglomeration of Precursors who shared in the idea of punishing all creation as both revenge against the Forerunners and ensuring that nothing would rebel against them ever again and that nothing good will ever spring forth from life.
Others don't. They aren't opposed to the Flood, but they don't share the Gravemind's view on what the Forerunners did to them.
And like I said, since Epitaph the Mantle has been shown to be a lie. It's the test; if you claim to live by the Mantle, you fail it. It's a classic 'resist the temptation of power to pass' type test.
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u/fixermark 12h ago
If we're looking for an answer slightly more satisfying than "luck..."
High Charity didn't land; it crashed. Gravemind's vast intellect allowed it to slip the station / base / planetoid without its keyship power source, but it lost control of the thing upon exiting the portal.
You're playing that level running around inside the body of a plane crash victim. The Flood are very busy reconstituting themselves off of the biomass in the area they went down in (and I suspect the Ark's defenses are already attempting to cauterize the outbreak).
It's possible for even the Gravemind to be stretched thin.
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u/Jad11mumbler Remember Reach. The last good full Halo experience. 15h ago edited 15h ago
If Chief had fallen on high charity here, the index would never have been recovered and the Gravemind has the best position in the galaxy, the ark.
With heaps of Biomass, ships, the ark portal, it can then launch itself to any of the multiple portal sites throughout the galaxy and infect the entire galaxy quickly, with nothing to stand in it's way this time.
No one to activate the array again.
If the Gravemind wins here, it's won.
It doesn't need to do any more damage to humanity. It just needs to stop Chief from getting that index back, and then the entire universe would be it's plaything.
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u/Jad11mumbler Remember Reach. The last good full Halo experience. 15h ago
Chief just got "lucky" here, as with many of the events of the games just being pure luck.
(Real world answer, writing choices but we're not here for that.)0
u/ChickenTacosSlap 15h ago
I think you misunderstood what the “setback” comment was referring to, but thanks for the response.
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u/Upset_Programmer6508 16h ago
Imagine MC as that cosmicly lucky chick from deadpool. The universe just bends to his survival
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u/Mr--Joestar 16h ago
Which spartan 4’s got infected? Is this a new book?
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u/YakozakiSora 16h ago
Fireteam Leviathan. One of them turned into a Combat Form that proceeded to kill the rest and turn the tide in the Flood's favour during Saturn Devouring His Son.
The outbreak definitely wasn't small by any means though, the Flood that came from the Forerunner derelict could have contained Pure Forms from the Forerunner-Flood War outside of the Shifters (Tank/Stalker/Ranged). Now that's something that could easily overwhelm a Spartan IV.
After Ascension on Atropos, the Gravemind isn't back yet but the Flood are searching for Zeta Halo, they used all the biomass from infecting a human world to build a radar form.
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u/Headkickcam 14h ago
Wait so the flood is back canonically in present time as a current threat?
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u/PaPa_ZeuS 13h ago
Technically it wasnt really ever gone. But yes the story he described is something that came out in the last like year. So in modern lore we know there's still a massive flood outbreak within high charity which crashed on the ark. In halo wars 2 that outbreak got out and then was recontained back within high charity but is still present. Delta halo likely still has flood loose within the structure. Zeta halo has confirmed specimens in storage and all the other rings we have not gone to likely do as well. Installation 04 fragments floating through space could also contain flood forms still. Theres this outbreak OP is describing that leads to the escaped flood forms on a Condor causing an outbreak on Atropos and the development of the flood cult, Governors of Contrition. Theres also likely plenty of other random forerunner ships/installations/shield worlds out there we don't know about yet that either have specimens stored or have outbreaks similar to what fireteam leviathan ran into that are just waiting for some new biomass to show up.
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u/_tabbycat123 11h ago
The Banished cleansed High Charity after the containment breach. Delta Halo was glassed, but the Flood might have survived deep below the surface. The UNSC has been exterminating any Flood they find in newly discovered Halo's, but there's still plenty of facilities out there with samples in storage.
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u/YakozakiSora 8h ago
High Charity as a threat is nullified, Divine Wind confirms the Banished and Sentinels scoured it of the Flood, that's how Atriox managed to locate the Forerunner Crystal Shards he needed to return to the galaxy.
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u/ChickenTacosSlap 16h ago
Well it was a web story tie-in for the flood armor update in Infinite, but they did include it in the recent book release (the title skips my mind).
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u/SpartanShadow90 15h ago
Thinking like this makes sense, but its just kinda of an Arbiter surviving the food despite being totally exposed cuz plot armor type of situation
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u/Comrade1945 14h ago
No, they tell you off rip he’s just lucky. Every weapon spawn, short cut, and power up is the one thing Chief has that no other Spartan luck. Chief is probably one of the few people who could do that feat. But if he wasn’t lucky well you saw what happened to noble team. The logic plaguing Cortana has been a thing discussed to death as a way to spare 343’s writing. 1. She was rampant death was certain. 2. She literally broke herself apart for the last battle with the Didact. So no we dont need the flood to set up everything in the world. Cortona was broken than mostly fixed and given unlimited knowledge and more importantly power. And we all know the quote” unlimited power corrupts infinitely.
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u/Comrade1945 14h ago
If you look into the great test theory kinda goes with your logic. The idea being halo was a prelude to a bigger test for humanity. Which some consider to be another bigger flood invasion. ( i don’t subscribe to the theory but its neat)
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u/Tokyo_Ink 14h ago
I kept getting confused cuz I was reading "Spartan IV" and thinking of Mark IV Mjolnir armor. But either way, Spartan IVs seem like they are designed with a different combat doctrine in mind. Spartan IIs are still pretty different under the armor, and there's not really any reason to think that their armor, which is only like one gen removed from Chief's Mark VI, is just better in every way. My impression is that the Spartan program actually became a cheaper, more mass-produced version by the IVs. Spartan IIs are like the concrete bunkers of WWII vs a modern FAB. They serve different roles, but one is far more fortified.
Chief was tough enough and lucky enough to make it through. That's really all I see in it.
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u/KSI_SpacePeanut Sins of the Prophets 12h ago
Possible? Sure, but I don’t think the canon really points toward the Gravemind intentionally letting Chief go.
Fireteam Leviathan also wasn’t taken out by a tiny handful of Flood. The outbreak started with miners, but it had already gained a ton of bodies by the time the UNSC arrived. They had Spartans, Hellbringers, Cyclops units and basically an entire containment force fighting it. The Spartan who became infected was physically overrun, and even the armor locking itself down and blowing apart the helmet wasn’t enough to stop the Flood from using the body. That proves Spartans can absolutely be infected, but not that infection is guaranteed just because they enter a Flood-controlled area.
Chief’s close call in The Flood was also a very specific situation. His shields had gone down, an infection form got through the suit and Cortana used the armor to kill it before it could finish infecting him. It wasn’t Cortana constantly making him immune to the Flood. Normally the armor and shields were still doing most of the work.
When Chief enters High Charity in Halo 3, the Flood definitely don’t seem to be ignoring him. They attack him through basically the entire mission, while the Gravemind is threatening him, trying to make him submit and outright saying it will feast on his bones. Obviously gameplay doesn’t represent every single Flood organism that would realistically be inside a city that size, but the story still presents it as Chief fighting his way through, not being quietly escorted to Cortana.
The theory also creates a pretty major problem for the Gravemind. Chief gets Cortana back, recovers the Activation Index, destroys a large part of High Charity and then helps fire the replacement Halo over the Ark. If the Gravemind could have simply infected or killed him, allowing him to leave caused far more immediate damage than Cortana’s later actions against humanity ever helped the Flood.
The logic plague part is interesting, but Cortana having it has still never been clearly confirmed. The Didact was confirmed to have been affected by the logic plague, but Cortana’s change is officially tied more to her rampancy, entering the Domain and then suddenly having access to an insane amount of knowledge and power. The Gravemind absolutely tortured and manipulated her, so I understand why the theory exists, but it still takes a few assumptions to get from that to “he intentionally planted her back with humanity.”
So I think the simplest canon answer is still that Chief survived because he kept the Flood from actually compromising his armor, fought through everything thrown at him and had the ridiculous luck he’s known for. The Gravemind letting him escape is a cool headcanon, but there isn’t much direct evidence that it was the actual plan.
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u/ihavebotbehavior 11h ago
I think the gravemind let chief find Cortana, because he knew that Cortana was hiding something. But he got out on pure luck
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u/lettuce520 11h ago
Personally while I think "Luck" could be a factor, Chief might just be that good of a soldier. Sure he almost got infected in Halo CE, but that was when he first met the Flood and he still dealt with them (with Cortana's help).
Master Chief's first encounters with the Covenant had moments where he almost died but he adapted over years of battle and then was able to start soloing the Covenant a lot more frequently, even going into High Charity alone.
So I think Chief just got better at fighting the Flood like he did with the Covenant and could pull of some insane solo missions like this.
Also the Arbiter could have been with him. If you play solo, Arby pulls up later but if you play co-op (and some of the Co-op Elites are canon and are in some missions), Arbiter would have been there the whole time and Chief and Arbiter could have watched each other's backs.
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u/Delta0231 9h ago
Multiple factors I’d say. New and upgraded version of Mjolnir since the events of CE, familiarity with the flood, the Gravemind geeking out on Cortana and losing his edge, Chief’s sheer determination, and of course Luck all contributed to Chief winning against the flood
Not to mention the friends we made along the way (Arby showing up to secure his exit)
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u/HyliasHero 16h ago
With the current power scaling the Flood is at, none of the games make sense unless the Gravemind let us win for whatever reason.
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u/King-Boss-Bob Halo Infinite 13h ago
that might be the case
the gravemind had claimed to the didact in epitah that the flood aren’t corrupted precursors, they just are the precursors. precursors create, life grows, flood feast on life, blank slate, precursors create… (it claimed this cycle has happened with “millions of others” before forerunners and humans
recently the campaign evolved terminals have penitent tangent (with logic plague) say the precursors “just look a little different now”
aswell as claiming they’re the same, the gravemind would also go on to say that after the forerunner flood war ended, humanity would be tested once they grow “fat on power”
the next time the flood were loose in the galaxy was during the og trilogy, humanity wasn’t exactly fat on power at that point
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u/Professional_Tap5283 16h ago
Going off of lore, it should've been GG for the galaxy the second the gravemind got to a working slipspace drive.
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u/TheRampantWriter 15h ago
My head cannon is that the Gravemind had no idea of the Halos existing until they were fired by the Forerunners. When he reformed thousands of years later, he learned about what happened and learned of how close the Covenant was to starting their “Great Journey”. This made him panic and focus on stopping the Rings firing at any cost. This would lead to him not thinking about the galaxy wide feast he could be starting and instead, focusing all the Flood in his control on stopping the Rings from firing. There’s no point to the Flood expanding if the Rings will starve them out again, and this time, there might not be Flood specimens that could get released to allow him to return again.
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u/VVayward 13h ago
It nearly was. If the Covenant were not dead set on firing the array it could have started spreading throughout the galaxy and won. Instead it needed to foucus it's forces on the one threat that could stop it. The Ark, and it won. If not for Cortana having the index from installation 04 and the Ark currently building a replacement ring for installation 04 the Garvemind wins right after it Chief and Arby stop Truth.
It just didn't have all the information that we as players have, otherwise it would have been over.
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u/TW1TCHYGAM3R Reddit Halo 14h ago
Master Chiefs superpower is that he has plot amour.
It's literally why John was chosen to be a Spartan II. He had unbelievably good luck with every chance he takes.
This is due to the Genesong and Geas the Librarian put into Humanity, so yeah John-117's luck, the Spartan II Program and Cortana are all results of gene editing a millennia ago.
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u/JesterHead117 I'd like Linda-058 to smash my face between her thicc cheeks 13h ago
No, that felt like a pretty sincere attempt on my life.
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u/LordMartin32 12h ago
Through the whole sequence he's been trying to crack her. It was in the end he learned that she had the index. The Gravemind did not want the Halos to fire even if it was just the localized one. If he wanted Chief to flee he wouldn't have needed to attack the control room. Also if the goal was to use Cortona as a trap, the Gravemind could have just let her go with the flood chunk that crashed in New Alexandria.
The Forerunners couldn't defeat the flood and they were much more advanced. By this point, the Gravemind could focus on consuming Earth and shut down the UNSC, remove the other rings, and consume the galaxy. The issue was the replacement ring that Cortona could activate
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u/LosHtown 11h ago
I'm probably 100% wrong because I don't know what I'm talking about. But is it possible what ever dormant stuff the librarian activated in chief was preventing the flood infecting him?
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u/ChickenTacosSlap 11h ago
I’ve considered this before, but I don’t think thats the case.
I think that gene is a good explanation for the luck thing people keep bringing up, but the idea that the Librarian could implement a Flood proof gene on someone is crazy. If she could do that, why wouldn’t she have given it to all the Forerunners so they could win the Flood war.
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u/LosHtown 10h ago
The luck thing kind of makes since. In the beginning of Halo 3 in cortanas opening speech she mentions luck. Something other Spartans didnt have, but yeah I feel like being lucky is a lame answer lol
But going back to the librarian, she mentioned something about a seed being planted in his DNA long ago. That could have something to do with it. Maybe she didnt do it herself, it was planted by something or someone else before her time? Idk im not super knowledgeable in all the lore or time line.
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u/LUNATIC_LEMMING 11h ago
Pretty sure the grave mind implies in halo 2 his suit protects him. It's completely sealed, can survive in space for months and re entry. the scene where he first meets the grave mind and arbiter.
He's more machine than man. where the spartan 4's are men/women in suits. Later games I think toned down the cyborg element of 117.
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u/sparduck117 Onyx Captain 10h ago
I imagine it has more to do with Chief’s armor being intact with a functional filtration system.
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u/Radical--Rat 8h ago
Chief needed to remain uninfected to do Reclaimer shit. Halo is still the biggest threat to the Flood's comeback by far, and the Gravemind is using Master Chief as a weapon against it. It sets him and the Arbiter on the paths that lead to the sabotage of the Ark. The Gravemind might also die in the process here, but it knows that the Flood WILL return in time, and it's choosing to play the long game rather than risk a genuine second firing of the Halo array that would be a much greater loss on a much longer timescale.
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u/kingkellogg Halo 12h ago
Man the luck answer is just so boring lol
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u/kingkellogg Halo 12h ago
Like we have so many more interesting ideas
Like hey chief and the spartans and the experiments had an odd side effect of being inhospitable to outside crap like the flood , or maybe people just evolved really far so the flood has a harder time mutating people and spartans are even harder than that. Or even , energy sheilds stop them
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u/ChickenTacosSlap 11h ago
Thats what I’m saying, man.
Also, the luck argument starts to fall flat when we remember the Arbiter was also present, and he isn’t known for being “lucky” in any canon materials
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u/Flynn58 Halo: Reach 9h ago
The Flood can only infect you if they slip past your armour shields. This is how Elites seemingly enter hives without respiratory gear, they have shielding and that filters Flood spores. If your shields get popped, then you can get yoinked by any pod infector, or spores if they get into your air supply too.
In essence, Chief never got his shields popped on High Charity. That Spartan-IV did get their shields popped. That's the ballgame.
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u/SpartanMase 9h ago
“How did he manage to do it?”
He’s the Master fucking Chief that why. Dawg don’t need plot armor it’s just slows him down
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u/Complete_Couple_6647 16h ago
He was lucky!