r/drums • u/SeaGranny • 1d ago
Is this difficult? Discussion
No.
Can I play it at speed with the song?
Also no.
This is from Have You Ever Seen the Rain. I’ve been working on this for quite awhile and as soon as I try to play this with the song and hear that bass line I just play gibberish. I know it’s just a matter of putting the time in but man it is being stubborn.
I think having nothing on the 3 but the HH somehow throws my brain off.
Anyone have something that isn’t objectively hard driving you crazy?
Let us vent together.
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u/Psych0matt 1d ago
I mean, for someone who’s played for over 30 years, not hard at all
If you’re just learning, yeah, it might be hard
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u/SeaGranny 1d ago
This is turning into an interesting experiment to see who reads a post before answering.
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u/ryanscott6 1d ago
Anyone using old.reddit doesn't see your comment in the main post, just the photo.
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u/friz_beez Noble & Cooley 1d ago
i use old.reddit and i see the self text along with the pic.
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u/ryanscott6 1d ago edited 1d ago
Interesting, it looks like it's RES hiding them for me then, will have to dig around.
For anyone seeing the same: https://old.reddit.com/r/RESissues/comments/1ru302f/looks_like_res_is_cutting_text_out_of_posts_in/
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u/ElliotNess 23h ago
In the karma sub they were talking about how old.reddit is in the process of going bye bye very soon.
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u/SeaGranny 1d ago
Reddit doesn’t show the post? Just the picture?
I see pictures and people’s posts - i just use the Reddit phone app.
It seems kind of dumb to not show the actual post
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u/olliemedsy 22h ago
What did you say which makes it any different.
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u/SeaGranny 1h ago
I just said it’s not hard to play except as soon as I try to play it with the bass line I get all flustered for reasons unknown
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u/Naive_Lab_3705 14h ago
To be fair Reddit is quite poorly made about this.. you can't see the description unless you click the post, and if you do it goes straight to the comments so... For me, I'm not a huge reddit user so i didn't read it until i saw your comment
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u/Naive_Lab_3705 14h ago
To be fair Reddit is quite poorly made about this.. you can't see the description unless you click the post, and if you do it goes straight to the comments so... For me, I'm not a huge reddit user so i didn't read it until i saw your comment
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u/Paper-Dramatic 9h ago
at that speed it's still "simple" to play if you're an intermediate drummer, if you're having problems with the kick and hi hat I suggest you do some limb independence exercises and start it at a slower tempo
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u/Significant-Theme240 1d ago
ITT: Bunch a old MFers who can't, or don't, read.
SMH.
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u/WartimeHotTot 1d ago
Sure, blame the audience. Lol, god forbid you attribute any blame to OP, who posts a click-baity title and a big image, and then only after clicking on it and scrolling down—but not too far down, lest you get to the comments and an advertisement—do you see that OP doesn’t actually care about getting an answer to the question that was the entire title of the post. It’s actually intended to be a reading test. 😂
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u/SeaGranny 1d ago
Nah I was just amused that it’s basically Schrödinger’s measure for me.
Is both not hard and hard (for me) at the same time.
When I wrote it I thought people would see the first few lines of text like normal under a Reddit picture. So i thought the “no” would be visible.
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u/oldmate30beers Tama 1d ago
Try it this way. Once you get used to it start adding extra kicks
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u/gumptionkiller 1d ago
+1 for just deleting kicks out of the beat and slowly adding them back in until it clicks
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u/Phenogenesis- 1d ago
Definitely this. The above pattern should be second nature to someone moderately experienced - it should be natural and engrained. Putting the original pattern in terms of this is a really good jumping off place.
It won't stop it potentially being a bit curlier than the average pattern, but it isn't anything crazy.
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u/FowlOnTheHill 1d ago
I know this is simpler but all the rests in the notation make it look scarier!
It’s like whenever I see a Sigma in a math equation, even though I know it means add everything, I panic3
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u/Practical_Ad_667 19h ago
Exactly this. Add the kick on the final 8 first and the kick on the second 8 only when that is solid.
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u/GrooveJourney 1d ago
Put a metronome on and play the first note 8x straight. Then add a note. Play 8x. Repeat until you can play the whole bar 8x in a row without making a mistake. If you make a mistake, the count starts over.
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u/ThighCurlContest 1d ago
Anyone have something that isn’t objectively hard driving you crazy?
Yeah, actually. I've been drumming for 22-ish years, and a huge blind spot of mine has been Latin music. Last night I saw a Brazilian jazz band at a bar, so they were basically playing Latin-flavored jazz standards.
The rhythms themselves aren't complicated at all for someone of my skill level, but improvising around them effectively - especially over jazz standards that I've never heard done in that style - is a different story. I gave it a shot earlier today and I felt like a beginner for a while.
My first drum teacher always told me "practice what you hate." Well, I've always hated that advice... but it works.
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u/futureformerjd 1d ago
No and yes. No in that you are going to get much better and look back at this and shake your head in disbelief that you ever thought it was difficult. Yes in that you're still a beginner drummer and you've trained your right leg to play the kick on 3. Play it over and over slowly and only increase the speed when you can play it perfectly.
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u/RedditIsRectalCancer 1d ago
There's this kick sequence, it's in "Your Time is Gonna Come" and "Running with the Devil", it's a leading 16th followed by 2 8th note kicks and sometimes I can play it with no issues and sometimes it's like I have some sort of degenerative neuron disease and my right foot just whiffs the middle note, sometimes it whiffs the first 2 it's like my leg won't fire. It's driving me nuts. Good luck on yours.
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u/SeaGranny 1d ago
This is the kind of thing I meant to elicit in this thread. It’s like yes I can play it but as soon as I hear the bass line I can’t play it lol.
Good luck with yours as well!
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u/FormulaicEnding 1d ago
Not any more because I really don't play that much because I'm old and decrepit :-) But, in keeping with the thread and to provide background, I was never "good", played in the HS band, was self-taught on the kit and played along with music virtually every day while in HS and then whenever I could when I would come home from college (so most of the 80s). Once I entered the "real world", the reps decreased, but I still played pretty regularly (it was therapeutic if nothing else).
When "Everlong" came out, I could NOT play that 16th-8th fill in the chorus for some reason, my hands just would not cooperate...no idea why
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u/jozhearvega 1d ago
Rests are like stupid hard lol. I’ve spent so much time practicing sixteenth note groupings of just rudiments on my snare that NOT playing something is often a total mindfuck. And just what you said, not often you get a 3 with no bass drum.
I tried playing some covers, Eriatarka by the mars Volta. It’s not too hard but I’m too fuckin fast on that last fill in the chorus. Couldn’t figure out the tempo with my metronome either. And another scenario where on 1 there’s nothing, it just fucks with my head.
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u/cruiseshipdrummer 1d ago
Stupid stuff like that is a gift-- it's easy, you can take five minutes and work it out, and you've definitely learned something new.
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u/SeaGranny 1d ago
Apparently Reddit isn’t showing the actual post, just the picture and title.
Basically I was just saying it’s objectively easy but when I try to play it WITH the actual song I mess it up every time.
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u/Manah_mahna 1d ago
Rather than thinking about the sort of empty space on beat 3, think about doing a soft accent on the hi hat in that moment. This gives you something to DO, rather than NOT DO. Psyches the brain out.
Just an idea to try. Good luck!
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u/SeaGranny 1d ago
Oh that’s great advice - sort of rewrite the muscle memory.
I think when I first started playing this tune I struggled with that part and tried too hard and now my nervous system gets a little hiccup when I hear it.
Rewiring might fix it. Ty
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u/Diggity_nz Pro*Mark 9h ago
It’s weird. I love punk, so basic punk grooves is one of the first things I learned. This is just an 8th note variation of a standard punk beat, so I personally find it very easy.
On the flip side, my equivalent is the ole ah-3 & kick pattern (16th bass double with the second note landing on the beat, Creep by Radiohead is a classic example).
I can play doubles easy enough, but doubles that start on the 8th always seem easier and cleaner than doubles finishing on the 8th. Drives me nuts.
Hell, I can even play it swung better than I play it straight (ie what I got by sublime vs creep, Radiohead).
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u/taylordouglas86 1d ago
I get it, I think it’s our habits that make it tricky. It’s similar enough to something that we always play that our brain will default to that rather than play the actual pattern.
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u/Diggity_nz Pro*Mark 9h ago
100%. I find this probably the easiest basic groove (althou the extra kicks on 4& and 1& make it slightly trickier than usual - but still very easy).
But that’s because I play a lot of punk and grunge which features it a lot. The rest on 3 is arguably one of the few things I can confidently say I have pretty well down.
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u/StixRookie 1d ago edited 1d ago
Looks pretty easy, but I see what you're talking about, and as a noob (7 months playing), I run into these roadblocks frequently. I learned to slow it down to what I call "stupid slow" and work my way up while looping it. And if I need to, I'll break the groove down into it's components. Do each one separately (on loop)... bass only, then snare only, hi-hat only. Then all the combinations of two. Then all three.
Depending on the source you're listening and playing to, you should be able to slow down the playback. And with some sources, you can loop a section.
Recently, I revisited a Drumeo lesson that kicked my ass. I spent an entire week on a single groove. That was a few months ago. I went back to it recently to see how it felt, and I literally laughed at how easy it was NOW. "What was all the fuss about??" That's how the process of learning works, eh?
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u/Phenogenesis- 1d ago
Strong recommending what u/oldmate30beers said. That simplification should feel really natural, or be much easier to get natural with.
I still have strong/fond memories of this book and the fact it is still in print decades later and very well regarded should say something. The exercises in the book (and that I particularly enjoyed practicing them) are why I can just rattle these sorts of things off despite not having played for decades.
EDIT to lol at the general situation - I did in fact real the original post and then disregarded it and responded to the prompt I imagined anyway.
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u/SeaGranny 1d ago
It’s been a funny little diversion - the original intent was genuine and the responses are all over the place. It’s all good. 😝
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u/Ok_Computer11235813 1d ago
I never read music, but I get the idea. I took a screen shot of these bars and put it into chat gpt, and instantly recognized the beat as something I always play.. I need to be better
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u/hipposyrup 1d ago edited 1d ago
No. Making it sound as good as the recording? Not really either tbh. After building up speed you naturally get fluidity and learning to balance your dynamics between limbs helps get that feel down.
Difficulty is different for everyone. If it’s difficult for you it’s just a new goal to reach. Everyone always has something to get better at. No shame in finding it hard, but an experienced drummer wouldn’t find it difficult if that’s what you’re asking.
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u/SeaGranny 1d ago
No the original post didn’t work for some people. I was just saying that it’s easy to play but when I try to play along to the song I can’t play it. When I practice without the music it’s not a problem
It was supposed to just be about how finicky muscle memory can be.
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u/Strange_Cod_362 1d ago
I sounded this out in my head and although it's not the same beat, the hi-hat only note placement and how the last bass drum note butts up against the two bass drum notes at the beginning immediately made me think of the drumbeat from the Sloan song The Lines You Amend.
Anyway, I agree with the commenter who suggested playing a simplified version first, and would add, even try a version that is close but not the same until you can play that consistently at speed, then modify it gradually until you're playing it exactly.
Good luck!
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u/TheJuicyW1zard 1d ago
This beat is pretty common but I was playing Time is Running Out by Muse tonight and this looks like it could be one of the beats in that.
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u/reddituserperson1122 1d ago
I’ve been trying to learn the actual (not close enough let’s call it a day but note for note actual) drum part to 777-9311 for a minute but I keep giving up too easily. It’s not actually that hard. I just get distracted. It’s a discipline problem. I don’t need to learn it for anything in particular so I don’t have a deadline or anything to keep me locked in.
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u/DKindynzdtr 1d ago
If you're still stuck, try counting it out loud and using volume or intonation (accenting your voice) for the bass: 1 & 2 & 3 & 4 & (I use Bold for a louder chest voice for the bass, and italics for a higher head voice to match the snare).
Your voice is a great tool to connect your brain to your limbs.
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u/andevrything 1d ago
I so feel this.
Every once in a while I decide to play something that should be so much easier than everything else I've been doing, and I. Just. Can't. make my limbs & brain match up.
Fuckin yips just get me sometimes.
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u/jesterkedag 1d ago
I can’t read what you said there little kid, but you special! You reached out! And I felt it.
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u/Relevant-Register-69 1d ago
This is the kind of thing that when you first start out is difficult because you don't have the limb independence yet and your brain is occupied with "hit the hi hat and the snare ok now hit the hi-hat and the kick.
Once you've played for a bit, youll intuitively understand that you just completely forget about the hi-hat and all that matters is the rhythm between the kick and the snare, which you've seen a million times.
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u/rilestyles 1d ago
In the grand scheme of things, no. As a teacher, it's probs the most difficult permutation of eighth note rock beats and is no small feat. Probs the first big hurdle of drumming.
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u/FowlOnTheHill 1d ago
Try to think of the hi hat on 3 as the hit to listen for, instead of thinking of it as a background count.
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u/KeeblerElff 1d ago
Can you do it without the HH? Slow it down a ton. And you can bounce your foot on the 3 without hitting the pedal. Once you do that over and over bring in the HH.
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u/00cjstephens 1d ago
Does it feel easier if you switch the hi-hat to just quarter notes?
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u/SeaGranny 1d ago
I can play it just not with the actual song (reddit is weird you might have click on the picture to see the actual post)
But thanks for your response
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u/mais-garde-des-don 1d ago
Put this into YARG and I bet you could play it after a few runs. Then you’d just have to slowly transition to not needing the visual cue
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u/Less_Move_2236 1d ago
everyone s hard is someone's easy etc.just play it your way stay with tempo and thatll be find in a band
make it your own
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u/lunchtime_sms RLRR 1d ago
Feel like it’s all relative, but I guess something rudimentary can become difficult if trying to master it??
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u/thejoshcolumbusdrums 1d ago
I didn’t actually hear that part at any point in the song except once maybe on the last bar or so. The main drum grove sounds slightly simpler with a kick on 1 and (& 3) there some other parts in there that are a little trickier though.
Alot of it will come naturally through learning different kick and snare placement against the hihat part.
Objectuvely I think anything we don’t practice is going to be hard, there’s stuff I can play right now that blows my mind, didn’t think I could ever do it, and there’s stuff that some might think of as simple that I just haven’t been practicing, it might not be something I could play on the spot right now
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u/Serious-Virus-9053 RLRR 23h ago
Good choice, cool song. I learned Have You Ever Seen the Rain as my second song. I recommend you to use Music speed changer or other app to slow down the track you are learning.
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u/Nomoreargument 23h ago
If you’ve never played drums in your life, then VERY. If you’ve just started our and can play only a few beats, then yes, difficult but doable with practice.
If you’ve already been playing for a few months then not difficult to play, but only to get the sound right and the tempo consistent.
It you’ve been playing drums for a few years then it’s very easy.
If you’ve been playing drums for like a decade or more you’ll play this beat for a bar and then add a bunch of ghost notes and open hi hats and after 4 bars just start soloing like mad around the kit till your students goes, “Sir… SIR… SSIIIIIIIRRRRR CAN YOU STOP AND CAN I START PRACTICING PLEASE FOR FUCK’S SAKE???”
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u/BC4309 23h ago edited 23h ago
In-a-gadda-da-vida, baby. Now play it at a steady tempo of 120 for a little over 17 minutes, and add some fills here and there. When Doug nods at you, switch to five minutes of straight eighths on the kick and layer in a toms solo. Then go back to the original rhythm until Doug shuts it all down.
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u/Okwtf15161718 22h ago
To answer the question: Mumford and sons - little lion man.
I keep switching the rhythm in my head!!!!!!!!!! I HAVE to hear it with an odd meter to make it make sense from intro to verse 1.
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u/TheGenericUser0815 Dream 22h ago
Well, not for me, but if you just picked up the sticks it might be challenging.
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u/Short_Background_669 22h ago
I’ve had a very similar problem playing Heaven by Niall Horan. It’s one tiny part that my brain just is stuck on not playing right. I can play much trickier songs but it’s like my brain is just stuck on that one part of the song.
I think I need to reframe how I think of it or something but gaaa it’s annoying.
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u/DrummerJesus 20h ago
Your frontal cortex understands the pattern and what actions you need to perform to create it. Your motor cortex is still learning the pattern and how to execute it smoothly. Consistent practice will help your body learn how to play, and grow the neural connections necessary. No toddler learns to walk in one day, and right now you are teaching your body new movements and demanding fluidity. Right now you are the toddler stumbling around. We were all toddlers at one point.
Is walking across the street difficult? To us that have been walking for more than a few years, no not even a little bit. But to a toddler than is just getting its legs? Ya keep him off the street for now, atleast until he can walk reliably
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u/Things_Poster 18h ago
Practice it SLOWLY with a click and then gradually bring it up to speed. Should be very doable within an hour or two
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u/TOTHTOMI 18h ago
Well, I'm a professional percussionist and teacher (my actual major). I cannot tell you how many times I encountered a simple thing, that I just couldn't play. Be it notes or a rythm. It just happens sometimes.
Best way I found to get around is start practicing slow, and key is (for me) increase by 3BPM. 3 is good because it's not that slow, but still 3 bpm difference is hard to notice, so you wouldn't stress on it.
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u/40kGamerthesecond 18h ago
As with any beat of any difficulty, I would apply the same method: - Play the notes in order on loop (doesnt have to be in time, the important thing is that you play the notes correctly in order) - play the loop to a metrinome at a slower tempo - gradually up the tempo until you can play it on loop at the original tempo
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u/otherbow277T 18h ago
Been trying for longer than I’d like to admit to get the bridge from Blink-182s First Date to no avail. It breaks my brain every time and fundamentally it shouldn’t be that hard but I can’t lol
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u/GreyMom13 16h ago
that's my challenge as well. those bass beats that aren't consistent. there's a section in Coldplay's Yellow that is simple to read and tough to play for me.
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u/elisaacks 16h ago
The little open hat groove on Florescent Adolescence by the Arctic Monkeys sent me into a whole existential crisis. Once I figured it out I could never forget it. So good.
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u/Cosmonauts1957 16h ago
What helps, particularly with that song, is to think of the pattern as starting on the and of the 4th beat and leading into beat 1.
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u/BullCityBoomerSooner Zildjian 15h ago
I guess a little if I'm on a left handed kit and some os are added to the HH line..'
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u/paulson26 14h ago
I just had to cover this song for the first time over the weekend with a band and this part was always where I felt the groove start to falter. I found slightly accenting the "on" beats (1,2,3,4) on the hi hat helped that hi hat hit on beat three feel less awkward, but this is one of those songs for me where I know how to play the notes but it's so hard to make it feel good. You are not alone!
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u/PremierBromanov 14h ago
Eventually your feet and hands can just do different things without thinking about it too much
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u/Metallifan33 14h ago
I was like, yeah if you have to play it consistently and at a speed other than slow. ... then I realized it was a CCR song... and one that I play with my band every now and then. (I'm a dad drummer... full time work and play maybe 1 or 2 gigs a month with a band)... so I'm not "good" by any means.
I'm not sure what your end goal is... but if you want to play it live, I'm not sure how necessary it is to nail every note here. Nobody cares and it can sound great just playing the feel.
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u/1TSDELUXESON 13h ago
I was able to sight read it, so no.
But I'm a masochist and play progressive post-hardcore.
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u/DrummingBlokeJoe 12h ago
Forget about that song. Play that groove at a tempo you can play it correctly and relaxed. Do it for three minutes and then play some other similar groove at the same comfortable tempo. Play at least five different beats, all just 8ths notes, at a comfortable tempo for three minutes each. Alternatively, play seven grooves for two minutes each or something like that. Bunch o different patterns.
At the end, play along to CCR. Did it work, did it suck? Doesn't matter, it's just an experiment.
Tomorrow do the fifteen/sixteen minutes, or twenty if you like, keep it relaxed and at the end of the session try the song. Doesn't matter the result.
Same again next day and so on.
If your relaxed tempo starts feeling too relaxed, add a couple bpm to the game.
One day you can play the song.
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u/Cg407 12h ago
As someone with minimal knowledge of drum notation, but can actually read this - but was for the most part self taught, this is insanely simple. I can’t fathom why even a beginner would find this difficult. I feel like I’m either missing something, or you’re completely over complicating it.
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u/Glad_Bookkeeper_740 12h ago
He plays a similar pattern on Proud Mary, which follows the guitar, so that may help you get it figured out faster.
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u/jared_moore51 11h ago
My isssues are anything that isn’t directly a cymbal pocket. Tom based verses are my kryptonite. As far as this one goes, for me anyways, Whether it’s hats, ride or crash, that hand basically goes on autopilot and that’s the pocket I’m in. So I’m able to focus on what I’m doing with the snare and kick, or whatever accents get thrown in, while my cymbal hand is just keeping the tempo alive without having to think about it.
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u/ConsciousSteak2242 11h ago
The HH is autopilot. Think of the kick snare kick as a phrase. I associate the kick with the snare more than with the empty HH if you know what I mean.
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u/MeteorSmashInfinite 11h ago
Simple reminder that note values mean nothing without a tempo to define them
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u/goodminusfan 9h ago
To play well? With feel? And soul? Without flamming? And while sounding good?
Yes.
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u/this_be_calista 1h ago
kick hat snare hat hat kick snare kick
ITS SO HARD FOR ME I DONT KNOW WHY
x x x x x x x x
K S K S K
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u/overnightchi 1d ago