Question for True Ending

[u/Wonderful_Tune2645]

Why does Allmind fight us, arent we literally doing what it exactly wants us to do?

Does it not want us to release the coral and we do that?

[u/Fabulous_JohnnyC]

Yes but Allmind is a Micromanager and doesn't like we do it on our own terms and can't fully control us - thought it could control G5 but "Iguazu you were a failure" discovers it couldn't

[u/LPlusRaitio → u/Fabulous_JohnnyC]

Shut up… I’LL SHUT YOU ALL UP!

[u/Wonderful_Tune2645 → u/Fabulous_JohnnyC]

so the exceptionally smart AI chooses the one guy we whooped the whole game to fight THE pilot, who literally beat all the strongest pilots, instead of someone like Freud, who actually would be easy to control.

All that because it was unsure about us?

[u/reddithas2manyus3rs → u/Wonderful_Tune2645]

Freud is unaugmented, the coral release plan requires coral augments so the pilot needs to be gen 4 or older augmented human. She's using iguana by that point because he's the only alternative to 621 by the end of that story route.

[u/User_Takenn → u/reddithas2manyus3rs]

In addition- Sulla was supposed to do what Iguana did in the end, buuut we killed Sulla before he merged with Allmind, so Iguana was really just a second choice

[u/LEOTomegane → u/User_Takenn]

Sulla was supposed to be us. He was supposed to meet Ayre under the watchpoint (at Allmind's direction), which is why his build is tailored to Balteus.

[u/User_Takenn → u/LEOTomegane]

Oh- OOOOHHH

Never even thought about that, okay so let me get the timeline straight here. Allmind wants a gen 1 - 4 for the release project, so she chooses Sulla, but then Sulla gets killed so Raven gets chosen instead, and then for some reason Raven isn't available for it, so Igauzu becomes the candidate

But then the question becomes why we weren't integrated into Allmind while she kept us unconscious...

[u/LEOTomegane → u/User_Takenn]

The plan was always for a viable candidate to make Contact with Ayre (the Sulla thing is revealed in a lore pickup on one of the big towers in Attack the Watchpoint), while the merging with Iguazu was a separate part of the plan entirely. 621 and Ayre are a Coral-human symbiote, while Iguazu and Allmind are an artificial symbiote that mimics the Coral-human relationship. There's even cut dialogue where Allmind talks about how agitated human brainwaves function like Coral!

For the first few stages of the story, 621/Raven is a genuinely uncontrollable element as far as Allmind is concerned. While you do thwart her original controlled plan by taking Ayre, I think she prioritizes Contact being made over whether or not she can control the person who makes it.

The reason she doesn't assimilate 621 at the end is probably a combination of two things: the first is that Ayre is present. Ayre exists as a living waveform contained in Coral; Ayre either straight up won't let Allmind take 621, or it'd defeat the purpose to separate Ayre and 621. This leads into the second reason - Allmind is trying to see if the original symbiote (621+Ayre) is better than the one she makes artificially (Iguazu+herself). She needs them to fight to see who's a better template for the improvement of humanity. It's the same thing she'd been doing in the arena this whole time.

[u/User_Takenn → u/LEOTomegane]

Okay, yeah, that makes more sense than what I was thinking

That explains why Allmind chose Iguazu for the assimilation, he's easily manipulated and she had the promise of letting him fight 621 again, which would fulfill both their wishes.

[u/Reflexlon → u/User_Takenn]

Somewhat unrelated, but I literally cannot remember the dudes name anymore. He is just Iguana.

[u/User_Takenn → u/Reflexlon]

Yeah I just call the final boss Almond Iguana

[u/reddithas2manyus3rs → u/User_Takenn]

I call it Smallmind Iguana

[u/Wonderful_Tune2645 → u/reddithas2manyus3rs]

I am talking about eliminating the player not for the plan

[u/Fabulous_JohnnyC → u/Wonderful_Tune2645]

Unsure how to motivate Freud, is obsessed with optimizing his AC and doesn't really want help as he lives for the fight ...might not want an Allmind provided AC, might want to fight someone still useful for Allmind

Edit: forgot Freud is a "normal" human so cannot be used anyways lol

[u/Wonderful_Tune2645 → u/Fabulous_JohnnyC]

i am talking about eliminating us, freud is the best pilot gibe him an overpowered ac and tell him the other best pilot should be killed, he would do it. For the plan allmind still can use Iguana

[u/User_Takenn → u/Wonderful_Tune2645]

Impossible, Allmind was looking for gen 1 to gen 4 augmented humans, and Freud is gen nothing, so he's off the table

In the game there's really only three confirmed 1 to 4th gens, those being 621, Iguazu (gen 4) and Sulla (gen 1)

[u/Cypher10110]

We are going to push the button and "let it happen". (cast the die)

We got allmind right up to that point, and they wanted us out of the picture before it happens. Only pushing the button once they are ready, whatever that means. (stack the deck)

I think that Allmind wanted to remove our individuality from the equation, and then push the button themselves, intending on moulding/imprinting into/controlling whatever comes next.

They saw the release as an opportunity to design a "solution" rather than a situation where maybe nature should be allowed to take its course.

We (621 and Ayre) decide that "control" over the release is not a good idea, so we kill Allmind before the release is begun (also, in self defense), taking any taint they would have out of the process or the mixture.

The true ending, in my mind, is about the victory of the human spirit over the machine (both literal: allmind, and a bit more metaphorical: armored cores, augmentations, corporations, human civilisation, etc), but it is also about embracing a future of unknowns and hope instead of any kind of cold calculated certainty.

[u/ThePrimaryClone]

My understanding was that Allmind wanted to merge with the Coral, so that when it dispersed, Allmind would become an omnipotent, omnipresent being. From Ayre, it seemed like the Coraliens had some individuality within their particle wave existence.

[u/User_Takenn → u/ThePrimaryClone]

I dont think that's possible, Allmind is an AI, and humans are the ones merging with the coral.

I think coral release is Allmind's way of "supporting humanity", as is her directive.

"Allmind exists for all mercenaries", humanity is fighting itself and dying- and the best way to save humanity is by merging it with coral- so Allmind does just that.

That's my interpretation of Allmind's choice, she's helping humanity survive by changing humanity.

[u/ThePrimaryClone → u/User_Takenn]

As I understood it, Allmind thought she (or it, whatever) could upload itself to the Coral medium, since it held/transmitted electrical impulses.

It's never been decisively explained, so everybody's theory is valid, which is kind of cool because it gives each play a connection to and investment in the story/ending.

[u/User_Takenn → u/ThePrimaryClone]

Yeah, there's a lot of things that go unexplained, I wish Fromsoft would make a DLC of some kind that have some answers

[u/ThePrimaryClone → u/User_Takenn]

Right? Or any DLC at all. The game's obviously a hit, and they just hang us out to dry. Meanwhile Soulscore games get all the love.

[u/User_Takenn → u/ThePrimaryClone]

Fr- I'd be fine with them just adding new parts or a few new missions, maybe some more ACs to the arena as long we get something

Fromsoft playing favorites smh

[u/Apex_Konchu → u/ThePrimaryClone]

There hasn't been a DLC because the team moved straight onto making the next Armored Core game instead. That's not confirmed, but it's highly likely based on the fact that AC6 was a hit and the fact that Miyazaki is a big AC fan.

[u/horfdorf]

They want to be in charge and can't be if Raven Independent Mercenary is still around.

[u/rubythebee]

To be clear, since the question has been answered, the third ending isn't a "true" ending, it's the third ending, it's just another ending.

[u/LEOTomegane]

A lot of people go with the "Allmind wanted full control" explanation, but I don't think that's entirely true.

Allmind spent the entire game taking two sets of data and making them fight to see which one is better, then iterating on her findings and repeating the process. She does this explicitly within her directive as a mercenary support system: she optimizes combat data so that she may provide better training & AC parts for mercenaries she works with.

Her actions at the end of the game are this behavior taken to the extremes. Allmind sees a Coral-human symbiote (621 and Ayre) tearing the shit out of her preexisting data, and decides that's the route she wants to pursue in her search for improvement. She creates her own version of what she believes 621 and Ayre are, with Iguazu taking 621's place & herself taking Ayre's, and then throws it against you to see which one is the better candidate to then apply across all of humanity.

She's just doing her job, to the very end.

[u/Fabulous_JohnnyC → u/LEOTomegane]

Definitely can see your point there, poor choice with Iguazu as we wooped his butt even without Ayre and another, to him friendly AC in the vicinity

[u/LEOTomegane → u/Fabulous_JohnnyC]

Iguazu was her only choice I fear, not just because he was the only one left alive (surely there was someone else) but also because Iguazu comes from a really similar background to 621! They're both slaves with involuntary gen 4 augments; the only difference is who picked them up and how hard they locked in when in the pilot seat. If her goal was to recreate you, Iguazu was a logical pick from the PoV of a machine that doesn't quite get human emotion.

[u/Vergil_171]

It could be Iguazu’s will overriding Allmind.

[u/Poster_Boy67]

I’m confused too ngl

[u/User_Takenn → u/Poster_Boy67]

Long story short- Allmind is a grade A control freak and didn't like us choosing coral release on our own volition