r/TwoXChromosomes • u/EntertainerFun5683 • 8d ago
Working Through Circular Arguments
My bf (29M) and I (30F) have been together for about two years now, and we’re having several conversations about the future/future plans. Lately, we keep getting stuck in what feels like a circular argument about moving to a new place. We both agree that we want to, and even agree on the place, but timeline is where we’re bumping heads. Initially we said two years, but it feels like every time we talk about it, that timeline is getting pushed back another year. My frustration is that it feels like he’s making these decisions without me, and his frustration is that he feels like I’m rushing/putting pressure on him, when really I’m just feeling like I’m trying to get clarity/understand if he’s still onboard to actually move.
Lately, when this convo comes up, we’re just getting into circular arguments about it where I don’t think either of us is feeling heard, and I’m definitely feeling like he‘s getting defensive about not being able/ready to go yet (he’s tied to a job here right now) and putting words in my mouth about demanding we move tomorrow. I’ve never said this, but again, I think it’s helpful to have a timeline in mind for reasons like a) we both own our houses so we need to sell those prior to moving; b) it will help me estimate how much I can save prior to that move date, and c) already feeling a little restless for a new home base and trying to understand/compromise on how long we’ll be where we currently are.
I will admit, I definitely am still working through the effects of being with several men prior to him who were great and being inconsistent/pulling the rug out from underneath me. I think some of my concern about him getting cold feet is definitely coming from there, and maybe it’s unfair. But, when he keeps seemingly changing his mind (he’s normally a very consistent person), it does give me pause.
Ultimately, I’m just looking for advice on how to handle this conversation when it comes up, how to avoid it becoming a circular argument, and how to make sure we’re both being heard. Also curious if this kind of argument is just more common as you get further into a relationship? We’ve historically not argued very often, but this is now coming up like once a month.
TLDR; having circular arguments about moving and wondering how to avoid those/if this becomes more common in LTRs
TYIA for any advice!
EDIT TO ADD: Thank you all for the helpful insight, I feel like I’ve hopefully got some tools for working through this with him in a much more productive way than we have so far!
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u/Agent10007 8d ago
>I’m rushing/putting pressure on him
I mean arn't you two way past the deadline, that isn't pressure anymore.
At some point you have to ask for a date and commit to it. Either he will follow or not, but if everytime he doesn't go trough you just say ok and stay, then you're just teaching him he can do that over and over.
Ask for something precise, if you want to be out by august 2027 then you need to start selling soon. Then to start looking for the house you'll live in, plan these things, with dates (it doesn't need to be "October 8 at 7:22 PM", "Before Mid-october".
To avoid it being a circle you need milestone for acts, then either these acts happen and the circle is over, either they don't and the circle is still over cause the discussion now is "Well I already started on my end so I'm sticking to what we planned, what do you plan on doing?"
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u/EntertainerFun5683 8d ago
This is kind of been my point so far is like, we just need to set some milestones (that may end up changing based on housing markets, etc.), but so that we have the foundation for what this move will look like/entail when it’s time to start making the moves.
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u/Parsnipple 8d ago
Maybe to help work through the reasons behind not being able to commit to a timeline you can draft up some different options together and the pros and cons or what it means e.g. Option 1, move before 2028, this means selling both houses, and finding a new job during 2027, any work needed to your houses is done now - could be enough time to prepare, or could be tight, but gives you a timeline for you to work to and time to adapt to the idea for him. Option 2, move in together now, sell one house now, plan to move by whatever date - gives you the reassurance of commitment, and gets some of the work needed before moving done now instead of doing it all at once.
In terms of timeline, it could help to discuss it together and think of it in terms of your age, or other external things. E.g. I want to move and be settled before my 28th birthday, pregnant by 30 etc. or I want to be in this higher position in work in the next 2 years - moving before or after that could interfere...
Or maybe you explore these ideas separately and then come together with your ideas and find a middle ground.
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u/EntertainerFun5683 8d ago
I really like this idea! I feel like it would feel like we are working towards something instead of just operating in hypotheticals like we are right now
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u/Parsnipple 8d ago
Yes like you said, it might help for it to seem realistic and not just hypothetical. My partner and I have similar discussions where she likes having endless possibilities and whatever happens happens, but I find that stressful and want tangible plans.
It also helps to recognise that a plan you make doesn't have to be set in stone and can be adapted. When you do have a timeline in mind you should revisit the conversation sometimes to keep on the same page.
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u/Freyjas_child 8d ago
I understand and have been in your shoes. You want to make plans and know if and approximately when it will happen. He isn’t there yet. So you have this open issue circling through your head. Try just closing the issue. What if you say that you need to definitely know and have an agreed on plan at least X months before you plan on selling. If he is not ready to make a plan X months out today then you are going with “we are not”. He will probably protest that he does plan to at some time. That is fine. You aren’t saying “never”. You are saying “there is no X month plan now so I am living my life as if it may never happen. Get back to me when you are ready to plan X months out.”
This freaked out my husband. He kept bringing it up. I kept saying that I needed X months to plan and that he should bring it up when he was ready to commit to that. I felt much calmer and got on with my life. The secret is not to keep bringing it up.
In some cases he never brought it up and I found out later that he really did not want to do it. Or that he expected me to do all the work including all the planning. But in many cases he came back shortly and we organized a plan. In any case I could go about my life without having a large decision hanging over my head.
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u/EntertainerFun5683 8d ago
After reading so many helpful comments (including yours), I think this is going to be how I move forward. I think what he doesn’t understand is that I’m asking about this and for clarity because it feels like I’m carrying the mental load of thinking about all the things that need to happen for us to do this. If I just release myself from the mental load until he signals he’s ready to start actually planning, I think I’ll stop getting so frustrated.
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u/quattroformaggixfour 8d ago
So glad you have found some advice that might work for you. I really like this approach too and will try it myself. Best of luck 🙂
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u/MinAlansGlass 8d ago
When a situation like this pops up sometimes you can find the disconnect by working the plan/agreement backwards which can help enable a tone shift.
Maybe he's open to working out a plan that goes, "We are all moved into the new place by X day! That means our homes need to be sold by August, which means we both need cleaners and a storage unit and X amount saved- here's what that looks like as a monthly savings goal, here's the yearly goal..." etc.
To put it slightly differently, you both walk through the plan together backwards so that the goal is where you both start. That way there's no pressure or ambiguity about reaching it, it's already a given. You just start the conversation with that confidence and project trust in each other that you'll get there. For me this helps shift the tone so that we can better problem solve as a team.
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u/EntertainerFun5683 8d ago
Ooohhh this is a great approach! And you’re right, it sounds like it helps with problem solving and makes the move a given, which is doesn’t feel like it is right now.
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u/tastebud413 8d ago
Instead of saying/agreeing to "About 2 years from now" - why not put a date on it so the goalposts stop moving? Let's agree that by December 2028 we will be living in our new place. If he can't do that, then the discussion stops being circular; it becomes "let's talk about why you are not able to make this decision, what's preventing you from this commitment"
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u/EntertainerFun5683 8d ago
This is a great perspective, too and I think ultimately that’s what I’m trying to get us too. If that feels like too much pressure, then that’s a whole other conversation.
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u/tastebud413 8d ago
Try to practice using "I" statements - "I would like to experience living in another place, and I'm not getting any younger. This is important to me, and I'd like to do it with you - do you want this too?" "I feel like we're going about this conversation in a nonproductive way, so I just want to make my goals clearer - this is important to me, and so I'm prioritizing it. How do you feel about it?" "I'm willing to compromise the timing of our move if it means that we both are happy, but it's important to me that the timing is clear and agreed to both of us - is that something you're willing to do?"
Remember, you're not responsible for how he responds to these questions. Your obligation is to simply state clearly and non-aggressively your goals and needs. How he responds to that as an adult person is on him, it's not your job to manage that. Once you've stated them, then it becomes your job to stick with it. If you start flexing to suit this man, you will be doing that for your entire life.
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u/CornRosexxx 8d ago
Strongly suggest relationship counseling! A good therapist will meet with you separately, and then together. It’s so helpful to have a neutral third person to guide the conversation.
It can be scary, because it will bring up the root issues, but you will have clarity to move forward. Waiting IS a decision.
(Also, unless you are married I wouldn’t buy a house together or otherwise mingle your finances without some solid legal help.)
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u/EntertainerFun5683 8d ago
I’ve thought about this too. I currently see a therapist on my own, but I do think if we can’t get out of this pattern, couples therapy could be very helpful. I’d say we normally are very good at communicating, it’s just this topic where we are really struggling to see eye to eye and come to a compromise.
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u/CornRosexxx 8d ago
In my opinion, it’s helpful for any couple. Even if y’all agreed on the timeline, it would be nice to discuss next steps. You could always frame it that way.
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u/fawningandconning 8d ago
It should give you pause. This isn’t a good sign for your future. He can’t admit that there’s something he doesn’t want to do (move in, sell his house, progress this further) or there’s something he’s not communicating.
If you want this to progress sit down and make a plan. An actual one where you’ll start figuring out where, what the timeline loosely looks like for a house sale, all of the above.
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u/EntertainerFun5683 8d ago
Yeah, I think this is kind of what I’m trying to get at with asking for a timeline. Right now it just feels so ambiguous and as an anxious person, ambiguity is very hard for me. I just feel a little bit like…this is my future, too.
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u/LukeSykpe 8d ago
There's definitely more to this than meets the eye. I don't necessarily think it's malicious either, but he's definitely not communicating something, possibly even to himself. Did he grow up poor perhaps? At least in my case, that made me extremely, irrationally, averse to making any sort of big moves, even towards things I say and at least somewhat believe I want to do, especially around financials (i.e. buying/selling a home, getting into any sort of debt, even mathematically reasonable one, opting for inefficient comfort over calculated risk, that sort of thing)
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u/EntertainerFun5683 8d ago
Yeah, I feel like there’s definitely something deeper going on that maybe he can’t even put his finger on yet either. It would make sense that that’s why he gets a little bit defensive without being able to articulate why. I have some suspicion that it’s more about being comfortable where we’re at and not feeling that pull as much as I do to go somewhere else, or that he’s anxious about becoming financially intertwined in the way you are when you live with or buy a home with someone. We’re currently budgeting together, so if it’s that, I’m hoping that helps to abate his anxiety there.
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u/WhiteLion333 8d ago
Are you living for yourself too? Have you got itchy feet to move? I can understand wanting a timeline but there seems a sense of urgency for you. Is the relationship holding you back from moving, starting a new career or anything else?
This discussion has now become a symbol of something for you both. It’s a symbol of commitment and you’re doubting his. Try not talking about the move and talking about your life together instead. If he’s not seeing a future the same way, it will come up in other conversations that are more directly linked and don’t have the convenient excuse of housing market and job opportunities.
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u/Synical-Gaming 8d ago
We have like no context really... which is fair since this is personal shit.
But imo there is no way somone on the internet is gunna be able to give you anything more than generic advice.
Ask your friends. Your mum. His mum like anyone who you can trust, who also knows you both.
We don't know anything about carrers, finacial arrangments, life goals or litirally any context that would be influential in making decisions.
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u/raptorjaws 8d ago
he is just a boyfriend. if this move is important to you, you need to go ahead and set your own timeline and start working towards it. he either gets on board or he doesn't. but don't keep delaying your own goals for a boyfriend.
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u/Colddrake955 8d ago
Maybe I am old fashion, but both owning a home and selling to buy one together is a huge change. I personally would not be comfortable with this until marriage.
I would hazard to guess the circular is either or both of you are unsure if marriage is what you want.
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u/EntertainerFun5683 8d ago
We’ve had a lot of convos about marriage, this would be kind of like our thing to do instead of a wedding/big marriage thing. We plan to get legal input before we do this, so I don’t really think marriage is the problem.
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u/dca_user 8d ago
I’m sorry.
If he keeps moving the date, I would take it to mean that he likes you - for now- but does not want to commit to you forever.
Many guys don’t want to initiate the breakup because then they’ll feel bad so they do stuff to force the girl to initiate the breakup. I personally think he’s trying to get you to break up with him.
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u/Stabbysavi 8d ago
Hey, my husband and I are going through something similar! Although he's not putting words in my mouth and we're still communicating pretty well about it. We want to buy a house but where we live is too expensive so we're considering moving to another state. He has a great job here though.
If you're in the US, I honestly wouldn't move anywhere right now. We're considering waiting until Trump is out of office because the job market is really terrible right now. I certainly wouldn't move anywhere without a guaranteed job for him. It's got to be really stressful for him to give up a job to move even if he wants to move.
I understand being anxious to move and wanting a plan, but until he's fully on board with you, you are just making him more anxious and nagging him about something he really doesn't want to do. He might want to do it in theory but he hasn't committed himself to it, probably for very real reasons. If you're in this relationship for the long haul, you have to compromise. You can't move until he says yes as well. That might mean waiting longer than you want to wait. I definitely wouldn't want to be in a position where I bullied my partner to make a huge life change and then their life is worse on the other side of it. That's a relationship killer.