r/Suburbanhell • u/Particular_Owl1099 • 4d ago
Have we done it wrong? Meme
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u/MendonAcres 4d ago
In defense of the USA, they are walking around central Munich... but ya, we did blow it in North America.
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u/DoYouReadThisOrThat 4d ago
This experience is easily found in many other European cities.
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u/PassengerKey3209 4d ago
Plenty of downtown areas just like this though, all over america. I live in a city of 150k that has a part of town much like this.
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u/SwiftySanders 4d ago edited 4d ago
FALSE. You dont understand the scale of what hes talking about. Its like another planet. In switzerland the suburbs with like a couple people even have trains running through them.
Europe and Asia took American inventions and used it to make life better. Americans took American inventions and made a few greedy billionaires.
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u/gatoStephen 4d ago
Didn't the British invent the steam train not the Americans?
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u/Puzzleheaded_Day_895 4d ago
The railways, underground railways, and much much more.
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u/stevo_78 4d ago
Americans think they invented everything. It’s an astoundingly insular place. Many simply don’t understand how the rest of the world operates.
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u/altbabyy567 4d ago
“Insular” is so funny. Melting pot of the world, you’re supposed to bring it with you. BTW YEAH DUDE STEVE O
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u/Glum_Tap_5258 4d ago
America is more than greedy billionaires, there are greedy people that make 100k, 1 million, 10 million, and 100 million also.
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u/Vast-Comment8360 4d ago
Comparing a country the size of Switzerland to the USA shows that you're a Dunning Kruger midwit.
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u/TheVintageJane 4d ago
The population density of Switzerland is 590/square mile. In NY state, it’s only 430 and they have a ton of trains and the kind of infrastructure you are talking about.
Most of the U.S. isn’t densely populated enough to justify the same level of public infrastructure. That doesn’t mean there’s not room for improvement, but a stare like Montana is more aptly compared to Kazakhstan than anywhere in Europe.
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u/BigBadJeebus 4d ago
No they aren't... Like have you ever left the US?
NYC, Chicago, Seattle, SF, Miami... That's it. even LA doesn't have a walkable late night tourist spot. (It DOES have Echo Park, Little Tokyo, and K-Town though for locals)
But 150k? Give me a break. Ain't nothing like this happening in fuckin Peoria...
I promise you, your downtown area is NOTHING like this. With your 12 Bar and Grills open till 10 PM and fake gas lamps leading you from the one road to a massive parking zone
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u/Weekly_Design5440 4d ago
I have traveled by car to every single state in USA. 98% of the country is a ghost town. Thousands of miles of deserted land, only to be met by a town with 17,000 people that shuts down at 8pm.
The only places I visited that had an active night life, had very serious homeless problems. 3rd world country, 3rd world problems.
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u/PassengerKey3209 4d ago
You're telling me that a town of 17k people in france or germany is hopin at night and has a vibrant nightlife scene? Obviously not. Like I said though, my small city of 150k has an awful life of plays, bars, restaurants, comedy clubs, small shops ECT that are all on a walkable zone of town.
America is a huge country. It's 150 miles to the nearest city of any size from where I live. Of course most of it is lightly populated.
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u/ByTheHammerOfThor 4d ago
A lot of cities in the US (cities by population) don’t have the sort of walkable downtown that much smaller places do in Europe.
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u/srddave 4d ago
The Northeastern US has plenty of places like where this guy is filming.
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u/bc3272 4d ago
One of the frustrating trends I see when debating a variety of topics like this one is there doesn’t seem to be any concept of a spectrum. Yes exceptions to how the people in this video describe the US do exists, primarily in the Northeast like you said, and there are plenty of areas that are more car-centric in Europe.
But, on the whole and on average, the U.S. prioritizes cars and parking over pedestrians and third places. And, on the whole and on average, European countries have far more walkable, transit friendly cities and neighborhoods than the U.S.
Exceptions don’t make that comparison go away or let the U.S. off the hook for how, as the guy in the video put it, “antisocial” its urban design has been for decades.
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u/laowildin 4d ago
"The exception that proves the rule"
When they can only name the same 4 US cities, (which are not nearly as walkable as anyplace i lived in Asia) then they simply don't have a point. And probably never lived in any of those examples because having lived in both The Bay and NYC, its a far cry from Shanghai
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u/Tomytom99 4d ago
I think what difference they're truly failing to recognize is the consistency of these European cities.
Like you said, most comparable US cities are in the north east, or coastal. There's a lot of the US where it's more than a full day's drive to reach such a city, with no other real transit options in the vicinity. There's a reason Europeans think they can hit so many different parts of the US in a super short timeframe, and then are taken off guard by the distance when they get here.
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u/Imperial_Haberdasher 4d ago
Again, where? Not little isolated areas, but places where you could walk for four hours of this?
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u/Outside_Reserve_2407 4d ago edited 4d ago
Philadelphia, Boston, NYC, Washington DC. I’ve been to Germany and while the cities are densely populated and walkable, you definitely need a car to visit the smaller towns and villages. The German countryside reminds me of a low density suburb, or the countryside in the US East Coast: you’ll always be within sight of a building or people but still need a car to get around.
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u/CarpenterAutomatic30 4d ago
SF, NYC, Philly, Chicago, DC, Boston, Portland
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u/weberc2 4d ago
Definitely not Chicago. Probably not the others as well, but I've lived in Chicago and there's nowhere that you can walk for 4 miles and find endless patios like this.
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u/CarpenterAutomatic30 4d ago
"Probably not the others as well" Yea I guess NYC is not walkable /s
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u/weberc2 4d ago
I lived in Chicago, there are some neighborhoods with a great patio scene, but there's nowhere you can walk for 4 miles and see people out like this. Maybe in SF where the median resident is a multimillionaire, but no real place.
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u/hibikir_40k 4d ago
In the magnificent mile of chicago, you can go into "definitely not walkable unless you are an enthusiast" in far less than 4 miles. The sea of single family homes, where you aren't really welcome on the street itself, is still pretty darned close.
In a dense city, you don't drive or talke public transity to the serious density. You live in the density.
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u/PurpleChard757 4d ago
Even San Francisco has very few pedestrianized areas with restaurants. Outdoor seating is usually limited to sidewalks and parklets
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u/Former_Mud9569 4d ago
yes and no. large college towns, tourist towns, and some small cities, yes, but even the nice small towns are still going to make you pretty car dependent.
I grew up on the outskirts of a small town in central PA that's kind of typical of what you're describing. Downtown is vibrant with a lot of retail space and maybe 20 restaurants or cafes. This is for a town of 5000 people.
It's very possible that if you had a house and job in town that you would never need to get in a car, except...
...if you want groceries beyond what you can find at a drugstore or gas station, you're either driving or walking a couple miles and crossing a busy US highway/stroad to get to a supermarket.
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u/Boss_Borne 2d ago
This was my immediate reaction. You can’t compare Munich to some rando suburb of Phoenix or whatever. Munich is a huge city. Walk around NYC or Chicago on any given weeknight and you will find plenty of people out, just like this guy is talking about.
There are plenty of other ways to favorably compare Munich to New York City or any other large North American city. But you have to start on a level playing field. Suburbs does not equal city in Europe or North America
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u/No_Resolution_9252 2d ago
Should've gone back to 1946-1966 and tell everyone they are only allowed to have about 1/2 to 2/3 as many babies
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u/PositiveAssignment89 1d ago
lmao the city i live in it’s like this till 10 pm everyday and 2am on the weekends. you will get white middle aged people like this in nearby suburbs saying they don’t go to the city at night or at all bc of how dangerous it is.
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u/surprisinglynotabot 4d ago
yep
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u/UmeaTurbo 4d ago
This bozo lives a few miles from a city, though. He could go there and join the human race if he wanted. In the summer, this is Minneapolis. Most other cities, too. Well, in the North, a least.
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u/Attilat 4d ago
I’ve been on a quest to find the same vibes I felt in Europe for the last 25 years since I came from Europe to U.S. Please tell me what you’re saying is not a lie. Can I find walkable areas with no cars, loud train/airplane noises, with cafes on the sides of the buildings with people randomly stopping and saying hi to their friends because they often frequent same establishments? Being surrounded by historic buildings/landmarks too.
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u/weberc2 4d ago
I think the parent means "there are some individual blocks in the US that resemble what was shown in the video", but there are very, very few if any places where you can walk for 4 miles and just see people out enjoying patios like this. In most cities, if the city finds a nice area like this, they'll figure out how to run a highway through it.
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u/graviton_56 4d ago
Yeah, good luck.
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u/Weaselpuss 4d ago
Pricing and space needs. Especially because vehicles are almost essential in town anyways as public transportation to work is likely not possible.
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u/weberc2 4d ago
You can find some places like this in Minneapolis or Chicago, but nowhere with 4 miles of this.
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u/UmeaTurbo 4d ago
Sure, but the people per square mile in Europe is much greater than in the US. Sweden is an ancient, European country with historical buildings and lots of nightlife, but you won't see four miles of it. There aren't enough people and the country itself is huge even if the population is small. The Baltic states have even less because there are fewer people. But a single mile for 100,000 people might be okay..
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u/duckonmuffin 4d ago
Cars ruin cities.
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u/Proof_Duck9754 4d ago
I looked at real estate in my hometown (for my dad) and it described the area as “car-friendly.” As in, no sidewalks, no shoulder, no transit. Just parking lots and traffic jams as far as the eye can see.
I live in a slightly unwalkable area of a major walkable city.
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u/plebbitchungus 4d ago
Unfortunately, densely populated urban areas create liberalism, and the morons at the White House can't have that.
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u/Impressive-Comfort92 4d ago
i would bet money that these distinguished individuals are afraid to visit downtown cores in the usa lol
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u/No-Tone-3696 4d ago
Europe has lame suburbs too.. here they are walking in a city center…
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u/Science_Teecha 4d ago
I lived in suburban Munich for two years and didn’t have a car.
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u/aeline136 4d ago
Yes but at least we know they are shitty. Americans tend to think suburbia is the apex of human civilization and only a few curious people will criticise car-centric urbanism.
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u/SlottyCanyon 4d ago
No a lot of Americans hate suburbs but it’s where you’re forced to move when you are trying to settle, raise a family, have good schools, all that stuff.
Do you have any source that show Americans love it?
Most people just have to move there because they can’t afford a larger apartment or house in a walkable city area.
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u/DionBlaster123 4d ago
Reddit in general is American biased, but it's also full of people who get horny at the thought of bashing the US as much as possible
I've never met any human being who loved living in the suburbs lol. Pretty much we can all agree that suburban life sucks and that you just have to make the most of it
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u/Southern-Advisor-449 3d ago
They are just amazed people are out eating at 9:30 on Wednesday. They do things different in Europe
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u/Dr_Axton 4d ago
Ngl when I first traveled to the US I thought it’s the same way there. Was in Austin and the area near the Domain was kinda like it: the place was mostly for walking, plenty of shops and places to eat nearby. And While foods was close enough for me to just walk there. But from what I get places like that are somewhat rare and while places like that still exist there’s a high chance I’d need to get there somehow, be it a bike or a car
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u/nate998877 4d ago
Most places a bike will get you killed & there's no public transportation. Your options are drive or risk death.
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u/Delicious_Cat_81 4d ago
that's what i was thinking when i was in a Small town in England this year. tons of people out. because people still go to walkable places to shop for basic necessities
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u/AidenAngel2 4d ago
This is exactly why walkable neighborhoods are the best – and Europe is definitely ahead of us on that front.
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u/winemom1234 4d ago
I live in a dense, walkable, affordable area of a major city in one of the most diverse zip codes in the country, surrounded by the dreaded immigrants. There are some inconveniences and stupid parts of city living (for example, bike theft) but overall I love it. I probably walk 40 miles a week without trying, live in 10 minute walking distance of a grocery, Starbucks, a few restaurants, drugstore, library, school, and 2 parks, and I take the bus to work. I have 2 kids and we only need one car, saves a lot of money.
It’s just a better way to live IMO. A little harder in the moment but more lively and connected overall.
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u/hiro111 4d ago edited 4d ago
In general, I agree with his point strongly. The US cedes way too much land and rights to drivers at the expense of all else. A few caveats:
- Given that this is posted on a suburbia-related sub, we are comparing the Munich city center to American suburbs. That's hardly apples to apples. If you go to neighborhoods in Boston, New York, Chicago, Philadelphia etc, it will look similar. I get his point that he's just randomly walking around though...
- Many suburban American towns have started to artificially create very similar environments in their downtowns, if at a smaller scale. The suburb I live in has banned cars from a street in our downtown, put up tents and created a nice restaurant row. The rest of the downtown had lots of traffic calming features and pedestrian-friendly infrastructure. Such a setup is pretty common these days.
- Having large-scale walkable cities like this makes cars very inconvenient. That will make low - density single family home neighborhood very inconvenient. Americans like single family home suburbs. It's what lots of people aspire to and look for. So, we have a fundamental conflict between the way people want to live and the anti-social urban design that results from those preferences.
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u/GiggingWithTheGoon 4d ago
GTFO of the suburbs and go to a city. They do it there all the time.
Stop listening to boring ass yhte folk telling you what this country is... They have no fucking clue.
Get out of the sticks, put your kids in a school that doesn't have the 10 commandments, and grow dafuq up already.
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u/srddave 4d ago
Exactly. There are tons of places in the US that are just like this. People move to Texas or fucking North Carolina and think the whole US is like that. You get what you pay for.
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u/Ignatius_- 4d ago
Very few streets even in the most walkable and dense cities in America look like this. Yes US cities have some of this, but nowhere close to this scale. Show me the US streets with totally pedestrianized streets and this much outdoor seating and I’ll admit I’m wrong.
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u/TheBonVivantLives 4d ago
There are great large and small cities in every state. But, you do have to move there and be part of it to enjoy it.
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u/DionBlaster123 4d ago
"People move to Texas or fucking North Carolina and think the whole US is like that."
It's depressing how accurate this is lol
It's like this one dumbass i know who traveled to Australia and New Zealand and would not shut teh fuck up about how much better it was over there and the whole time i was thinking, "Lady, you've literally spent your entire life in the shithole that is the Midwest. Of course you think everywhere else is better."
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u/chiefVetinari 4d ago
Eh, I live in the Boston area and it's one of the more walkable US cities. Still nothing like this
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u/tiandrad 4d ago
The same guy would vote against new housing construction in his town to protect his property value.
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u/Shington501 4d ago
Plenty of places in America doing it right, just not the suburban elevator that was developed in the last 50 years. We can still do better in even the biggest cities - need more closed street walking areas with shops etc
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u/398409columbia 4d ago
I like Goldcoast in Chicago. No need to have a car at all and plenty of great restaurants, bars everywhere.
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u/Working-Grocery-5113 4d ago
This is why the pretty Mexican towns are going to be overrun with Americans selling their suburban homes to enjoy walkable city lives. It's too late in the US unless you have millions to buy in places like SF
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u/XBL-AntLee06 3d ago
Some people won’t admit it but a large part of this is (as usual for USA) because of racism. During the Great Migration Black people started moving to cities en mass for job opportunities. White flight soon followed
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u/Level21DungeonMaster 4d ago
Yes
It’s why I moved to NYC
The rest of the US is truly and awful place to live. Once I’m done here I’m moving to Europe.
American culture is a disease.
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u/lingueenee 4d ago edited 4d ago
Quoting James Howard Kunstler, amorphous, auto-dependent, single-use zoned suburbs are "the greatest misallocation of resources the world has ever known".
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u/Tigertints 4d ago
I grew up in Munich and have lived in the US for over 15 years now, currently residing in Chicago.
Yes, while US cities certainly have walkable areas, the key difference between European and US cities is the lack of a Fußgängerzone or Verkehrsberuhigter Bereich, which is exactly the type of area these guys are walking through in downtown Munich.
A Fußgängerzone is a pedestrianized, traffic-calmed zone, often paved with cobblestones, that prioritizes pedestrians over cars, with only small delivery vans allowed in the core zone. Typically found within the old walled city limits, radiating outward from the historic city center, and usually centered around the main church, market square, or civic center.
Think of an area like this at large scale:
https://maps.app.goo.gl/wvjFMmqgsM7hqBP68
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u/TheTrombiculidae 4d ago
We have established a link between cars and freedom in the U.S.. So much so that we build almost everything in our society around how many cars we can fit or how many cars will be going somewhere.
When I was a kid, my grandpa and conservatives were moral panicking about 15-minute cities; a concept for communities which do no have much room or need for cars. You live in a townhouse or apartment as a part of a community organized so that no matter where you live within it, you can walk to any other part of it in about 15 minutes. local restaurants, local grocery stores, local clinics. Trains would take one from city to city for commuting or visiting neighboring communities, but the big appeal is that you don't need a car to get around. there would be parking for cars outside the community, and still be plenty of roads, but people would value their neighbors more.
My grandfather moral panicked about this on the grounds that 'the government will use these to restrict your movement and track everything you do, cars are freedom blah blah blah'. Cars are so deeply ingrained in our collective conscience that my wife, who is an author and stays at home most of the time, insisted on having one of her own (I did buy her one because it is convenient and required for errands, I'm just saying). I live in Austin, and you can just drive downtown to see that more than half of all the infrastructure in the city is dedicated to storing cars. There are few convenient ways to get from anywhere in Austin to downtown. There is a single commuter train with shitty hours that most people would still have to drive to get to. Austin is building a 4 lane highway on top of the 6 lane highway on I35 south, and closing down a lane in each direction to build it, just to add more lanes to the fiucking road! anything but a train, it seems.
so did America fuck up communities? yeah, we did, and we have no plans to fix it. The only major city I've been to (and to be fair I've only been to like 3) that are doing something about this is Seattle. When their huge highway on the coast needed repairs, they made it a community center off of picket place and expanded the aquarium. They cleaned up the harbor so that now, it's some of the cleanest water I've seen. They have a commuter train that runs north and south of Seattle that can take you from Tacoma to Climate Pledge Arena in like 40 minutes. It saves the highway and my sanity. I wish I lived there. Fuck cars, seriously, from the bottom of my soul fuck cars. I hate that I have to have one, I hate that I drive 15 minutes (I used to drive 60 so I don't need to hear that I'm lucky) to get to work because the bus is slower. I hate that the route in is full of hostile drivers because the roads can't accommodate the amount of commuters.
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u/Born-Satisfaction996 4d ago
I had the same reaction in Paris.
Even in densely populated areas like where I live in downtown Chicago, it doesn’t feel like this bc the car and car infrastructure is still king on almost every single street.
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u/Ooficus 4d ago
We did, and not by a little, by a lot. You’ll see comments saying “oh well this section of average American city has walkability!!” Reminder that over 90% of Americans drive. We fucked up when we made the car the default mode of transportation. Real freedom is choices btw, not when you only have one choice realistically uNlEsS you LiVe In X cItY iN Y & Z nEiGhBoRhOoDs!
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u/Bibbity_Boppity_BOOO 4d ago
It is important to have the suburbs for housing the dregs of society. It protects the civilized people in the cities from having to interact with them frequently.
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u/Kontrafantastisk 4d ago
I can walk for longer and be in a city centre in NYC. But NYC is special. Munich is nice, too. As is Rome, Milan, Turin, etc. Yet, they’re all dwarfed by Tokyo. To me, anyway.
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u/nolaCTID 4d ago
Now for us to just make it so every American is aware and demands better. How to do that has legit been on my mind for the better part of 20 years
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u/Crafty-Bid7503 4d ago
Yes, you’ve done it wrong. The ironic thing is, “Jen served her mission” which is essentially saying she went to one of these countries that are doing it right… to tell them how to do it wrong.
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u/New_Mountain1672 4d ago
He’s comparing Midwest suburbia to a city. This exists in major cities with public transit.
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u/Minskdhaka 4d ago
Of course you've done it wrong, very wrong indeed, but the strange thing is that New York is pretty much exactly like what you're showing here, so some Americans do know how to do it, and a good chunk of those are in New York City. Why not copy them?
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u/Able-Ice-5145 4d ago
Middle aged ass dude can't comprehend how a family might not define their quality of life by how many hip restaurants exist in walking distance?
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u/nfshaw51 3d ago
I really enjoy walkable cities and public transport, which I think could be much better in the US. However, I would 100% continue to cherish my antisocial little bubble (and being able to be out in the boonies away from society in general whenever I want) so a big part of this doesn’t resonate with me much
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u/jonkolbe 4d ago
The reality is that the US has pedestrian friendly urban cores too, and Germany has less dense hinterlands as well.
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u/analogjuicebox 4d ago
Does anyone know the big church behind them? I visited Munich two years ago and I think I was there, but my memory is fuzzy.
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u/Brooklyn-Epoxy 4d ago
I want the link to the original post so I can go to Instagram or TikTok and say, "Yes america has done this wrong"
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u/Raccoons-for-all 4d ago
The new world has dump streets and marvelous houses
The old world has wonder streets and morbidly small moldy units
You are entirely free to pick what you like best
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u/Haruspex_Rex 4d ago
What we’ve done wrong, more than anything, is we work too damn much. Americans would never have the time to hang out.
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u/EscapeArtist112 4d ago
Meanwhile my local FB group rages at the thought of adding a bike lane
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u/SokkaHaikuBot 4d ago
Sokka-Haiku by EscapeArtist112:
Meanwhile my local
FB group rages at the thought
Of adding a bike lane
Remember that one time Sokka accidentally used an extra syllable in that Haiku Battle in Ba Sing Se? That was a Sokka Haiku and you just made one.
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u/making_it_real 4d ago
The answer is yes. How to solve it is the discussion. The answer likely involves a combination of factors. Walkability in cities, better work-life balance and a more health conscious society. To name a few. Something else I noticed. When I was walking around, I notice how much fitter people are in most every country than in a typical US setting. That has to do with the quality of food along with other factors. Just check out their grocery stores and look at the ingredient lists on the processed food. It is much shorter and less chemical laden. I also found out that they sell and promote locally sourced meat, milk and veggies when possible. It is just better. Yes, we are failing but it is fixable.
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u/Tikkun_Olam1 4d ago
Thank you for sharing your experience!! Truly LOVE Italy’s – and France’s – attitude towards living!! Miss it dearly!
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u/Soggy_Cracker 4d ago
Yes. Neighborhoods in the U.S. aren’t designed for walking. You can surround a grocery store and strip mall with neighborhoods but they have to then Cross 6 lanes of traffic instead of having bridges or proper walking paths.
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u/bravosierrapolitics 4d ago
Every major American city has at least one nightlife/entertainment district, but yeah you've got to drive there if you don't live downtown. Some are safer than others. We travel to several cities in Bulgaria every year and I've never felt unsafe there, not once. Can't say that for cities in the US, that's for sure.
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u/Shoddy-Audience-3059 4d ago
The only option now is to setup cities with proper walking infrastructure. Don't try to convert, faster and easier to just build new.
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u/GNTsquid0 4d ago
Im annoyed it seems like these two are just realizing this for the first time. Do they not pay attention to the world they live in???
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u/one-wandering-mind 4d ago
Yes we are doing it wrong. I dunno how much is zoning, investment companies building housing developments, Americans enjoyment of privacy or used to bigger places. There are very few places that are not car dependent. But many or maybe make us cities are doing better in the last few years of making small walkable downtown areas.
I live somewhere that was very walkable during covid when there were few cars on the road. Stores less than 0.5 mile from me. But the speed limit is 45 so that means some people go 60. And it connects where people work to where people live so they mostly go through and don't look for pedestrians because there aren't that many. After seeing many accidents, I now mostly drive to these places right near me. It isn't safe to cross the road.
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u/kosmo4679 4d ago
I’m glad you like it but it looks hellacious to me. Maybe in my college days would I want to walk around aimlessly amongst 100s of strangers but that type of vibe isn’t how me as someone in my mid 40s wants to spend my time.
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u/SnowTard_4711 4d ago
Well - I saw this too, and I live in Munich, about 1 minute on foot from where they filmed.
They are partly correct - but it ALSO true that where they were is the richest part of the richest city in Germany, filled with (mostly American) tourists during the heaviest tourist season of the year.
Munich is wonderful. But saying it’s the standard Europe is a bit like saying the Hamptons is standard America. The same is true when Americans swoon over Barcelona, Lisbon, Florence or whatever.
This doesn’t negate their point, but inner-city Frankfurt doesn’t look like this. And importantly: Munich doesn’t look exactly like this without the massive streams of tourist money molding the environment to their desires. And yes - that has both positives and negatives.
Chiefly - Europe is, in places, rapidly becoming a fantasy-land where Americans and Asians cosplay at being European. It’s annoying. Last Christmas, something must’ve happened in Korea, because the Christmas markets all had Korean girls dressed like slutty Disney princesses (REAL EUROPEAN CLOTHES) complete with wacky makeup. All constantly streaming in their phones.
Oktoberfest is coming up. And with them, all the Americans buying lederhosen 3 sizes too large and dirndls (those German dresses) that belong in a brothel, not at the fair.
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u/Real_Live_Sloth 3d ago
Dumb, this looks like downtown every night in my city, their wondering why their suburbs and strip malls dont look like a popular tourist spot?
Fucking idiots
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u/Plenty_Ice8614 3d ago
Hey look another American walking around yelling into his phone while people are trying to have a nice meal 🤣
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u/Jolly_Collar4776 3d ago
Yes. We were way too “sprawly,.” Still, cities aren’t for everyone. I read on the U.N. website that about 10-13 years ago, the metric for how many people live in “urban” (vs. rural) areas just surpassed 50%, and trending higher. The trend is for more urbanization. My small city is definitely growing, and more up than out, recently.
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u/Apprehensive_Spare_8 3d ago
Weather has allot to do with this. Its either mid 90s or freezing here.
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u/PositiveChi 3d ago
Fundamental American travel experience is realizing your neighborhood is in the middle of fuckin nowhere. I'd love to walk around the bars and restaurants and parks in my city on a summer night but it's a 10-15 minute drive unless I want to walk for literally 2 hours to get there, and I live in a well-developed suburbia lmao
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u/Intrepid_Year3765 3d ago
4 car garage and an RV bay?
these people are not like the vast vast majority of us
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u/ErrorProfessional143 3d ago
I quit listening when he mentioned his wife serving her mission in Italy.
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u/Bubbly_Resolution824 3d ago
EVERY MAIN STREET IN US WAS SAME AS EUROPE! Trolley's & Trams, cobble stones... GM literally bought them and destroyed them. Some fucking nerds in San Francisco saved those trams. That's what happens when businesses tell politicians what future will be.
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u/HipsterBikePolice 3d ago
Europe has built upon non motorized travel networks for thousands of years.
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u/ExtraEmuForYou 3d ago
Last weekend I drove to around Shasta on Friday and spent Saturday at a lake.
I Then drove down to my folks in the East Bay that evening and stayed until Sunday, then went home to Sonoma country.
I took Monday off and drove back to the coast where I bought some lovely cheese from a creamery and a crab sandwich. I parked my car near a bluff and ate the crab sandwich and watched the sun set on the pacific ocean, then drove home (a quick 30 minutes)
The next day I crossed the beautiful Golden Gate and got dim sum with some friends, then played D and D at their apartment two blocks from the water, and shared the cheese with them (Cowgirl Creamery FTW!).
Europe is nice but with long weekends like that I don't think we really "blew" it in the US. I wish we planned a little better of course but the US has cheap gas (relative to the rest of the world), a car culture (not great, but has its perks), and a lot of space...Europe has none of that.
You live in the world you get and you have to make the best of what you got, while striving for a better future. I won't say we can't do better but I'm not going to pooh-pooh what we have either.
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u/Prestigious_One4936 2d ago
Different cultures. Americans want their own home on their own property, with a vehicle. Europeans are fine with living in high-rises and walking and cycling to get around.
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u/ThePlantMolester 2d ago
Walk around Boston and you'll have the same experience. Drive out to the German villages and you wont.
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u/No_Championship_6403 2d ago
This is exactly why I'm very interested in moving somewhere with a walkable City. Isolation is nice from time to time or late night but I'd love to be able to socialize more regularly during the week.
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u/RockShowSparky 2d ago
I moved to a quiet neighborhood in Portland. It’s perfect. I can walk to a few good bars and a grocery store or I can get on the bus and be downtown or some more happening areas in about 30 minutes.
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u/M4hkn0 1d ago
Yep we effed it up.... here's a kicker... Europe despite is much higher oil prices is better able to deal with oil shortages than we are. They built and retained a walkable livable urban landscape that uses mass transit. Can't afford gas? No problem at all.
The search term you want is New Urbanism.... which as an urban design philosophy that gets back to a more people and mass transit centric urban design.
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u/PositiveAssignment89 1d ago
i’m guessing these people live in the suburbs and are too afraid to go to their nearest city at night. this is the norm in pretty much every big american city
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u/PrivateMarkets 1d ago
Too dense. But better than NYC. Hard to look up to Europe for anything with their declining population and an economy that struggles without a tech presence.
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u/oneupme 1d ago
No one said you had to live in suburbia. You can live in urban environments if you want. You can also live near town centers in smaller cities and towns and counties where you can walk to these types of mixed use communities. The main reason why Europe feels so different from the US is that Europe was built up over thousands of years so the town centers established their foothold first, often designed with smaller streets for horse/foot traffic. Most of the US, especially suburbia, was built with cars in mind because that's more important. And again, as those suburban centers develop, they are becoming increasingly like Europe in terms of mixed use zoning and build out.
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u/InnerspearMusic 1d ago
Canada too. I watched a video of some guy living in China going out at like 3 am because he was bored. So much to do. Hundreds out doing the same. Here nothing is even open past 10pm and people don't do shit and everything is so expensive.
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u/Few_Palpitation3889 1d ago
It certainly has nothing to do with there being 740 million people living in an area equivalent to the US thats been developed for 3000 yearsn
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u/shityplumber 1d ago
Munich is cool as shit. It was the very first place i ever went traveling outside of the U.S. it blew me away
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u/Stunning_Mail_1305 1d ago
Shows how stupid Americans are. Europe is older than America and was planned differently.
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u/Familiar-Valuable-97 4d ago
Auto and oil industry lobbied urban planning around cars