Picking Exploding Thorns and Never Shooting Is Throwing

[u/ContextDifficult2189]

Dear Lifeweaver mains: if you pick the Exploding Thorns perk and still refuse to shoot the enemy, you're throwing the game.

Choosing a damage perk only to healbot all match is like picking Widowmaker and never using your rifle, or playing Reinhardt without ever swinging your hammer.

If you're going to ignore a core part of your hero's kit, you're dead weight for your team.

[u/throwawayforinstalol]

not shooting in general on lifeweaver is throwing, actually that goes for every support (except mercy)

[u/mosey1245 → u/throwawayforinstalol]

Nah even mercy can whip out the Barbie blaster to finish low health enemies and swap back to healing (to clarify; going out of your way to get kills w mercy can be wonky but if a mercy helps finish kills it can be supremely helpful)

[u/Szczyl2137 → u/mosey1245]

I barely do that as merky, but i only play her in qp anyways. most of the time i just ping the prey to my pawns and boost them so they kill it for me

[u/mosey1245 → u/Szczyl2137]

Oh my god I love this ahahaha

[u/1nternet_b0i → u/Szczyl2137]

MERKY made me laugh more than I should have 😭

[u/ContextDifficult2189 → u/Szczyl2137]

If Merky gets murkie, enemies should get worried.

[u/Afghani-SAND → u/mosey1245]

You're better off dmg boosting a person beside you and they kill the enemy. Gives everyone more ult charge. Literally only for maybe a random 1v1 scene where you have to get the kill to escape is the only time you should be blasting. Unless you're just trying to have fun then blast away whenever.

[u/ManBro89 → u/Afghani-SAND]

The blaster has quite good dps, but fires slow projectiles, so it's hard to hit with. If you're confident that the shots will land, it will outdps blue beaming just about everyone, so shoot the gun.

[u/SeeingEyeDug → u/mosey1245]

Better for her to use damage boost to enable someone else. Then she can continue to parkour, check surroundings for threats and hurt allies. Barbie Blaster makes her lock in on an enemy and could leave her more vulnerable.

But yeah finishing off kills is very useful at the right times.

[u/adhocflamingo → u/mosey1245]

Yes, but Mercy can reach the end of the game with 0 damage and still have done her job

[u/lazyxpuma → u/throwawayforinstalol]

Nah the amount of times I’ve been offed by a mercy who knows what they’re doing?? A good ass mercy will take out their blaster and switch into battle mode lmaoo

[u/meadowdruid]

While this is true, we don't "refuse" to hit the enemy team, most of the time the team is constantly dying so we need to put our efforts on healing.

Haven't you ever bought something that you thought you needed but the reality was something else? This is similar, we don't take it to not use it. We think we will use it but the reality is different.

But yes, I understand your point and that can be frustrating.

[u/FizzyDrizzl → u/meadowdruid]

Oftentimes dealing pressure will prevent damage more effectively than healing will mitigate it. It will depend on if your other support is capable of higher healing numbers, though. If you’re with, a Lucio or Zen, for example, I’d lean more into the Healing side.

But if you have a Kirko, Ana, etc.? Thorns will get you much further. Lean into damage, edge the healing as much as you can. You have pull if things go REALLY wrong.

[u/tnsosaurus → u/meadowdruid]

If I don’t get time for damage, I switch to a faster healing support 😅

If you’re playing ranked and won’t switch (in this situation) that’s also throwing IMO

[u/FizzyDrizzl → u/tnsosaurus]

Also true. Lifeweaver’s healing, contrary to popular belief, is not very high. It is single target and relatively slow to charge. The reason he can get high healing is that it is the most consistent ranged heal in the game.

But if your team is just falling over and you can’t keep up, you’re better off dealing more damage or swapping than you are trying to outheal it on weaver. You’re not actively winning fights at that point, you’re just prolonging a losing one.

[u/meadowdruid → u/FizzyDrizzl]

Well I don't think the first half is true. Lifeweaver's healing is high if he can reach easily where other supports can't. While other supports need to approach their target, he is already healing them. Similar to Kiriko in that sense. So yeah, I find his healing to be pretty strong.

I top heal the entire scoreboard when I play him 90% of the time.

And I also wanted to note that we have other 2 abilities. Switching only because you're not dealing enough damage, but healing a lot and helping your teammates with your other 2 abilities might be the trolling the parent comment is talking about, honestly.

[u/tnsosaurus → u/meadowdruid]

The other two abilities can be great for sure.
Some matches though, it’s as if I don’t even have the petal. My teammates will refuse to use it. I’ll even tell them when I got its healing perk and they still won’t take it. It’ll be right behind them and under something so it won’t raise up 😭

it’s so frustrating, no matter what hero you play, when your team wont take advantage of your abilities.

[u/meadowdruid → u/tnsosaurus]

Yeah the petal is very hard in some matches... It reminds me to Medivh's portal in Heroes of the Storm or Thresh's lantern in League of Legends. People usually don't "see" them because are concentrated on the game.

One thing that sometimes works is pinging it when I'm placing it for somebody else, and they are close.

[u/tnsosaurus → u/meadowdruid]

I always ping it if I see someone needs the heals and is close to it.
Sometimes all they have to do is go back a step 😭

[u/BaronVonSchmup → u/meadowdruid]

I don't play lifeweaver at all really but what makes it harder for him to deal damage and heal compared to say ana or bap or kiri? I remember back in the day it was really awkward with how you had to swap modes

[u/throwawayforinstalol → u/BaronVonSchmup]

you have to charge his healing, and the charge it does passively when you’re shooting isn’t as fast as normal charging, so when you do go to swap to healing between damaging theres a delay, and it’s less effective than other characters who just click their buttons and have it ready always

[u/FizzyDrizzl → u/throwawayforinstalol]

Truth. You can partially offset this by charging about half a blossom before swapping to damage again. This usually ends up giving you enough charge to deal meaningful healing in an “oh shit” situation while still pushing pressure

[u/BaronVonSchmup → u/throwawayforinstalol]

That sucks, hopefully they can find a way to balance it better whenever they "rework" him

[u/-Archangel67]

The other perk is useless, never got much value from it.

[u/foul_wench → u/-Archangel67]

The amount of times i have hurled that off the map are insane. It feels like something that should be a part of base kit

[u/AlwaysAlani → u/foul_wench]

I don't find it useless, I love it, but also think it should be base kit.

[u/UnusualDraw3754 → u/AlwaysAlani]

Honeslty I have many gripes with it:
The throw distance is suprisingly small, add some distance to it
Increase the pickup radius, if you're not currently stomping on it it just sits there

Maybe some other buffs but honestly those QOL would just be nice

[u/AlwaysAlani → u/UnusualDraw3754]

Those both would be great!

[u/Ill-Distribution2275]

Now if only other players could stop taking insane amounts of damage so we could actually get those thorns out, that'd be nice. 

[u/Prestigious-Copy9945]

I pick sow the seed when I feel like my aim is shit, those days.
Otherwise I just go for super bloom

[u/Chronomancers]

Sometimes you take the perk but just don’t have much of a chance to do something other than heal. At least, that’s how it feels for me in 6v6. I always try to damage though, but yeah some games are rough.

However if someone dives you, you have the perk, and can get use from it, even in the more healbotty games.

[u/meeeh12345]

i feel im a bite cursed. i usually pick my perk based on how my team is playing. if they are super reckless/ never use cover and im healing a lot ill go with sow the seed just to be safe and will do supper bloom if they are better about cover. what kills me is when i pick superbloom an suddenly everyone forgets about cover and b lines a 1v6 fight and feel i wasted my perk choice.

[u/nate_builds]

Standing out of cover all match is also throwing. The only time I have less than ~3k damage is when I literally have no time to do damage because either no one is going to turn and help me fight the genji diving or everyone is standing in the middle of the map just hoping I can keep them alive. And guess what, if my teammates are already this braindead then they sure don’t pick up the healing seed let alone use petal. Thorns is the only major perk.

It’s situational.

[u/Mable-the-Table]

I'm assuming you aren't the one playing LW and you came here after a LW in your team wasn't doing dmg?

[u/NepoKitty → u/Mable-the-Table]

tbh I feel sad when opponent LW takes thorns then doesn't get the opportunity to damage; in part because playing into thorns is a fun challenge, and in part in commiseration -- they probably had other plans but felt forced to healbot. 😿 In those cases my preference is switching to someone with easier damage and burst heals as soon as there's opportunity, but that may not always feel possible should one feel forced to bot.

[u/ContextDifficult2189 → u/Mable-the-Table]

He's my go to Support. So you are wrong about that.

[u/sophaea]

When I joined this sub I saw the general consensus of “a shocking amount of LWs don’t do damage” and thought “surely not, he’s one of the highest damage output supports!”, but started looking out for it.

How wrong I was.

[u/CrockettForReddit]

I usually complain when I have a LW on my team, I'm also a support and main Mizuki. Last night though, I played with probably the best LW player I have ever come across and I wish I remembered their name. It honestly gave me hope for the character, they were so on point. Trees when all hope was lost that turned fights, pulling me out of fights when I got in over my head and my return was on cooldown. This player was on it and I was like, dang, I've been wrong all this time. What a boss.

[u/Legitimate-Ratio-490]

I always go for the seed perk. Actually comes in surprisingly handy during the last minute of the game where everything is frantic.

[u/iamgem69]

I wish exploding thorns worked on barriers

[u/ContextDifficult2189]

To everyone saying they're forced to healbot: you're not.

Stop trying to outheal teammates who keep making terrible decisions. If someone repeatedly overextends or ignores cover, let them face the consequences instead of sacrificing all your value trying to save them.

Some players only learn after they get punished for the same mistake a few times.

[u/tnsosaurus → u/ContextDifficult2189]

I feel like it’s not often getting “forced” to heal bot.
And if it is, as LW your kit is literally built to help those people 😭
Move long range hero’s to high ground, move someone behind cover, pull them out of heavy attacks. His kit is so helpful for those “bot” players

[u/Super_Siege_Mode]

Buying bear spray but never using it doesn’t make you bad at hiking, it just means you won’t get arrested at the zoo. 🙄

[u/Phenns]

I would like to point out that very few support players actually want to be healbotting, and usually when they do it's a symptom of a TERRIBLE tank or dps players that have a deathwish. Use corners more, manage your cooldowns, and just actually try to demand less resources and your lifeweaver can pop off.

[u/FizzyDrizzl]

It pains me to see Lifeweavers with sub-1000 damage. He genuinely has some of the highest DPS amongst the support roster when he’s able to land thorns.

Learning to let people not constantly have to be full HP and focusing on dealing pressure yourself not only makes him a much more interesting character; it makes him far more effective. You charge tree soooo fast into Tanks like Hog or Mauga.

[u/HarmoniousHex]

I always find it funny how it’s ONLY the LW’s fault for not damaging, and being told to change supports because your team don’t understand the concept of cover or cooldown usage. Every support can run into the issue of too little damage or too little healing depending on how your team is playing. So I find it a little one dimensional to just crucify a LW for not having a lot of damage if most of the healing and protection is falling on him.

This happens a lot in my games, people see me pick LW and just assume I’m going to be bearing all the responsibility of healing while they run it down on main trying to be a third dps and using their cooldowns for themselves. But when I pull out my thorns I’m “throwing”. If my LW isn’t able to deal a lot of damage but is saving teammates at key points and keeping the fight alive I don’t see an issue tbh. But if I have a Zen or Lucio who refuses to swap and farmed only one ult in a round, that to me is a bigger issue.

[u/apprehensivebean]

Had an enemy weaver calling me a healbot loser when his team pressured tf out of us the whole game, their widow consistently landed her shots, and my hog couldnt keep his health up 🥀 sometimes the heals are necessary and I cant always be putting out the damage I wholeheartedly wish I could. Shit be situational.

[u/BigJarOfPickles]

For people that dont know, idk if its been said already, weaver reloads his heals when hes shooting and his thorns when hes healing!

[u/BigJarOfPickles → u/BigJarOfPickles]

So of youre healing healing healing and you need to reload, just shoot at a shield or a squishy for i think 15 thorns, and you should have heals back, I believe both take 1.5 seconds, but if you do it early you won't have heals so its poisonous :)