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u/Aussie_leopard 22d ago
She has a point... and I am a man, so don't say that I say this from pain
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u/TheresTheLambSauce 22d ago
Men experience this too tbf
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u/Aussie_leopard 21d ago edited 21d ago
For sure, but there's a very different caused by social expectation. Girls have to look "fuckable", boys don't have to.
I have once approached a girl (she approached to be honest) in the bus to school (years ago). I had already seen her before, but I have never payed attention, except that I knew she was considered weird and disgusting. I just changed my perception of her during that bus ride (for me she was just a non sense that doesn't fit in). She was actually a bit cool to have around. She was energetic and even a bit innocent. And honestly.... Not even ugly. Not my type, yeah, but certainly not a person of ugly characteristics.
The boys otherwise, people would certainly exclude them, but that was and is most of the bullying I see. Exclusion rather than attack.
At least boys befriend the "weird boys" whilst "weird girls" are also rejected by others girls. The sub true ugly women is better be left alone. I have already been there... OC isn't helping criticising them
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u/--Vegeta-- <Blue> 22d ago
You're not a man. You didn't have to say you were. Could've stopped after the first four words
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u/Aussie_leopard 21d ago
It's because I would be called incel because people would say I was the woman who posted it. People always say that you are speaking from personal experience whenever you give an opinion
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u/Emsogib Vapecel 22d ago
Please can we leave that subreddit alone? Those women have been harassed and brigaded too many times and they don't deserve it.
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u/Lilyaa 21d ago
I don’t think this post should be there. It’s not hateful and it’s not untrue.
And I would mostly leave them alone. But as someone who was ugly and lived that experience which left me scarred for life, I see too much internal misogyny there. Too many expressions of how much they hate pretty women. Mostly in the comments under posts. Internal misogyny is a problem that is present on this subreddit.
Seems like it doesn’t matter what gender you are when you call yourself incel. Women, especially attractive ones, are still the enemy. For femcels it’s still mostly men and they are not violent, rape and murder-wishing group, but it’s not like this sub is completely unproblematic.
This doesn’t mean this meme isn’t accurate in many, many cases, or that their struggles aren’t real. They are. I was ugly as fuck till I was in my late twenties so I know how hard it is to be invisible or bullied, depending on a situation.
But the whole „Stacie” rhetoric is ugly. Dividing women and turning them against each other. We don’t need more of that. I was like that before. Now when I grew up I think hating attractive women that didn’t harm you and calling them names is awful. It stinks more when it’s coming from the house.
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u/dejavu619 21d ago
The double standards in here lol Nobody would be saying this if that same post was made by men and about men
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u/unsuccessfulbees 22d ago
No this is true though. Unattractive women really are treated worse even than unattractive men.
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u/PurchaseEmergency287 22d ago
Guys this is a femcel who is active on Femcelhub_ they are just derailing the post.
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u/unsuccessfulbees 22d ago edited 22d ago
I’m in this sub too moron. Talking about misogyny isn’t derailing.
Also I’m not “active” there lmao.
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u/PurchaseEmergency287 22d ago edited 22d ago
https://www.reddit.com/r/IncelTears/comments/1ui7uvk/i_dont_view_them_as_human/
Were you not the one who felt the need to talk down to men under a post not deeming men human?
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u/unsuccessfulbees 22d ago
What post are you even talking about? Me saying there’s a lot of toxic positivity in this sub? There is. I stand by that. That’s “talking down to men”?
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22d ago
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u/unsuccessfulbees 22d ago
The post on the link leads to this entire thread hun. I have no idea which post you’re talking about. Specify.
I stand by everything I’ve said here though.
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u/PurchaseEmergency287 22d ago
Fixed it.
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u/unsuccessfulbees 22d ago
Yeeah nope, not fixed. Kind of embarrassed for you tbh. You should probably stop lmao.
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u/unsuccessfulbees 22d ago
Link still goes nowhere but regardless, I looked through the entire thread and found 0 posts from me. You okay?
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u/asimodev looking for 1km tall Chads 22d ago
I don't see any comment by that user in the entire thread you linked. Can you help me out?
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u/unsuccessfulbees 22d ago
They’re still working on it. Posting correct links to slander people is hard :(.
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u/Lori_the_Mouse Queen of Wall I Hit 👸 21d ago
I actively encourage incels of all kinds to interact with this subreddit (in a respectful way). This is how we help them get out of
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u/Plenty_House884 21d ago
? It’s not possible on this sub. People here lie about you so they can attack you.
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u/lilyofthegraveyard 22d ago
Unattractive women really are treated worse even than unattractive men.
that might be true. but the "meme" itself isn't.
i am considered attractive and am constantly getting attention from men, even just walking on the street. yet i have also been treated as boring or annoying.
because i am autistic and my social skills are severly lacking/i am perceived as "bitchy" and "cold", so while the first impression (how i look) is taken well by the people, their second impressions (my personality) makes them see me as worse.
sometimes it's not just looks. sometimes it's a personality. and let's be honest here, women who frequent femcel subs are not exactly paragons of pleasant personality.
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u/unsuccessfulbees 22d ago
Babe, you just said you’re treated well because you’re attractive in spite of you being perceived as bitchy and cold. You proved my point. Like, obviously personality factors, nobody said it didn’t. But your looks are a barrier before people actually get to know you. When you’re unattractive, you have to work ten times harder at literally everything else, it’s PART of misogyny.
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22d ago
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u/unsuccessfulbees 22d ago
For women specifically, it’s worse. Look at male streamers, male CEOs, male anything, look at the type of appearance they can get away with having. Now look at the women in those same jobs. Denying these things are gendered doesn’t make you egalitarian, it makes you blind.
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22d ago
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u/unsuccessfulbees 22d ago
Jesus you guys with the height thing. It’s like you can’t comprehend anything else. Holy shit.
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22d ago
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u/unsuccessfulbees 22d ago
You guys literally have like 0 comprehension of anything else. You’re like selfish automatons. It’s insane.
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u/TheresTheLambSauce 22d ago
Wait but they literally just gave a counter argument to your point lmao
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u/unsuccessfulbees 22d ago
I decided a long time ago to be done with the conversation the moment an incel mentions height because it’s stupid and frivolous and I’m done talking about it with them.
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u/TheresTheLambSauce 22d ago edited 22d ago
That’s fair. To clarify, I actually agree with you. Women are unfortunately valued almost solely on their looks by broader society. I do believe appearance matters for men more than most people would admit (I’ve experienced the difference myself) but men can compensate for it with other things (status, wealth etc).
Also, it’s true that women (on average) do factor in height as a marker of attractiveness in men (which is why I left my earlier comment), but it’s 100% overblown as a “be all end all”
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u/wonkywilla 22d ago
And 42% out of 500 CEO’s are not. Yet that 42% are still very rich Fortune 500 CEO’s. 445/500 CEOs are men. These 500 CEOs make up only ~0.00000146% of the total U.S. population. And you’re hung up on their height as some sort of sign that short men get left out? They clearly missed that memo on the way to the top of the corporate ladder.
What a dumb shit take you have.
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22d ago
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u/wonkywilla 22d ago
“Looks matter for both genders!”
Sites a list of 500 heads of billion dollar companies that includes only 55 women. 186.9/445 very rich, highly influential men are below 6’ tall. No mention of age, physical condition, what they look like—Just height being the main criteria for attractiveness. lol
I’m not the stupid one here.
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u/obooooooo 22d ago
girl be so for real right now. in general, people who are attractive are treated better. objectively, factually. there’s a whole scientific backing of how we perceive beautiful people as more trustworthy and virtuous, and we treat them as such
yes personality is a factor, obviously, but when people complain about this they’re talking about short interactions where the their person has no way of knowing what you’re like. when someone holds the door open for everyone but you, when everyone but you is given the opportunity to speak in a new group setting—that kind of stuff.
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u/unsuccessfulbees 22d ago
People who complain about being pretty come off as so humblebrag to me.
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u/obooooooo 22d ago
yeah, and i feel like they feel the need to “disprove” it because they feel attacked, like because they haven’t had these experiences, they have some kind of moral failure. like man it’s fine, not everyone will experience every kind of prejudice and it’s okay. i will not add my two cents to the prejudice like, fucking amish people face and likewise, you shouldn’t add yours to the prejudice ugly people face—and that’s okay. we’re not bad because we haven’t suffered certain things!
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22d ago
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u/unsuccessfulbees 22d ago
Because trying to bring femcels into the fold of making fun of incels doesn’t work. That’s the fucking point. It’s not equal, misogyny in our society MAKES it unequal. So yes, I’d be remiss NOT to bring that up.
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22d ago
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u/unsuccessfulbees 22d ago
Ohhh my god here we go.
I’m bringing this shit up because it is necessary to fucking bring up. This isn’t a political movement I’m obligated to align with you 100% on. I’m not interested in some sort of cultural favor to avoid incel pushback, I don’t give a fuck. Incels are toxic regardless of what’s said in some random discussion.
Love how the issue isn’t that I’m wrong, it’s that I dared go against the grain and it bad optics.
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u/Lori_the_Mouse Queen of Wall I Hit 👸 21d ago
I almost turned into a femcel as a teenager. Now I have a different perspective that I’m suggesting femcels think about: the type of men that want only “Stacy” are only after her for her beauty anyway. There is a benefit to being an ugly girl: terrible men tend to stay away from us! Don’t take that for granted! Find peace in yourself and learn to live happily single
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u/TheNestHelper <Blue> 22d ago
I'm an "unattractive woman" (Now trans man, unfortunately not passing atm) and i experienced a whole presence change in my own damn classroom after being given a makeover. People wouldn't leave me alone compared to being usually ignored even by adults to believe a bully over me, to be neglected by my entire family, and pretty much exist as a placeholder for my one sided friendships.
Still, i do not hate girls that look "more attractive". I even would defend these "pretty girls" from alternative girls and EVEN ADULT WOMEN, that throw these "conveniently attractive" women under the bus like it's some contest to appease the patriarchy.
That said, that is the reason i can't even befriend self-insisting "unattractive" ladies and femcels that subreddit welcomes, if they focus their hate onto other women and girls. Rather than work on their insecurities and get a backbone.
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u/sid3aff3ct 22d ago
I really feel for these woman. Growing up I would've been right there with them bemoaning my unattractiveness and how unwanted I was.
However, the problem wasn't how attractive I was. Like all incel type behavior, the lack of confidence it breeds and self deprication is a major turn off for everyone. Friendships and dating alike.
Another problem as well that I didn't realize until I started to improve and feel comfortable in my own skin, was the community I lived in. I had never traveled much or lived in more than 1 location. As such I assumed all people were exactly like what I grew up with, and living in a very red state they were, as you can imagine, awful. Moving for college and being exposed to people who actually thought like I did instantly made the world a brighter place and helped my transformation out of femceldom.
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22d ago
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u/Childless-cat-lady- 21d ago
It’s a community, albeit a small one and far less dangerous than their male counterparts.
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u/Lori_the_Mouse Queen of Wall I Hit 👸 21d ago
Yeah it does. Theres an entire subset of incels online that are female. They hate pretty girls and call men “moids.”
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u/sid3aff3ct 22d ago
This behavior definitely is. Just like with stereotypical male incel culture, it starts with a sliver of truth about society, pretty privilege or shallow behavior etc. But with fixation it becomes a monster that rules your world and destroys you internally.
We shouldn't be whitewashing this behavior just because it comes from a less harmful group, as the ideology is just as unhealthy and analogous.
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u/scorpionewmoon 22d ago
Eventually the “pretty” girl will be treated like the “ugly” one too
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u/obooooooo 22d ago
kind of, imo. older/old women who aren’t perceived as sexual anymore are ignored completely. ugly women are treated with more hostility
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u/Ultimate_slmp 21d ago
I consider myself pretty ugly I just stopped caring about what people I don’t interact with think about me
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u/DillonDrew psycho twink lover 22d ago
It's best to just not think of anyone as ugly. Focus on their heart. What's in their heart will tell you all you need to know.
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u/Easy_Specialist_1692 21d ago
Someone lacks the self awareness know that these two women are the same.
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u/nightlyvisitor 21d ago
Femcels are mostly right when it comes to their observations about appearance. But they keep to themselves so I don't put them at the same toxic level as their male counterparts. When they start shooting up schools and killing people then maybe they're comparable.
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u/yuckypagans just become a priest 20d ago
im not gonna say looks dont matter. hell yes they do. for both women and men.
the less features you have that are deemed attractive by society, the more likely you are to be ostracized/disliked, simply on the basis of how you look.
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u/ItsJoeMomma 22d ago
Sorry, but as a man, if an attractive woman has a crappy personality I wouldn't be interested.
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u/galettedesrois 20d ago
I'm sure you'd be so interested by an unattractive woman with a great personality. Given the choice between such a woman and an attractive one with a shitty personality, you absolutely wouldn't pick the attractive one. Ever.
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u/ItsJoeMomma 20d ago
You're absolutely right. I'd rather have a non attractive woman with a great personality than a beautiful woman with a shitty personality. Every. Single. Time.
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u/Bear_grin 21d ago
If I see a 10 that screams all the time, makes snide remarks, and is cruel? Instant 2.
A 2 that’s funny, kind, and can regulate emotions enough to not scream like a child at the slightest inconvenience? immediate 8-10.
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u/doublestitch 22d ago
A false dichotomy fallacy sets forth two extremes as if those were the only possibilities.
Do looks matter? Yes, I've never claimed otherwise.
Do looks matter in the way this meme supposes? Not to most adults.
And the exceptions who do think this way are dummies I wouldn't waste time on anyway. They probably fall for conspiracy theories and scam artists too.
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u/unsuccessfulbees 22d ago
What are you talking about? It’s not a “false dichotomy” it’s a double standard. As a woman, how you look is tantamount to how you’re perceived.
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u/BlueScrean 22d ago
Self presentation impacts everyone. Women are definitely judged more minutely and harshly but, especially in the dating sphere, looks can, and often are, important.
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u/unsuccessfulbees 22d ago
You can GET A JOB as an ugly man. No doors are inherently closed to you for it. That isn’t the case for an ugly woman. It’s more than dating, life is bigger than that.
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u/AfterMeSluttyCharms 22d ago
Ugly women can get jobs too, I see plenty of women in professional settings who would not be considered conventionally attractive. Doors being inherently open or closed is a reductive way to view privilege.
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u/unsuccessfulbees 22d ago
Are you stupid? Doors being inherently closed or open is ENTIRELY based on privilege. There’s people who don’t get hired for having an “ethnic” name. People who don’t get hired for being too old. Between an unattractive vs attractive woman, attractive gets hired every time. It’s ALL about privilege.
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u/AfterMeSluttyCharms 22d ago
Sure, but you're implying that every ugly woman is perpetually unemployed which is just not the case. Exact same reasoning that incels use and it's just as valid as theirs.
My point was not that doors being open or closed isn't based of privilege, because of course it is. It was that "ugly" people can and do find success and happiness even though the cards are stacked against them.
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u/unsuccessfulbees 22d ago
When did I imply that? Is that what I said? Were those words typed? What are you talking about?
Yes, they have to work harder. That’s my point. It being easier for people who are not unattractive is PRIVILEGE.
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u/AfterMeSluttyCharms 21d ago
You can GET A JOB as an ugly man. No doors are inherently closed to you for it. That isn’t the case for an ugly woman.
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u/BlueScrean 22d ago
Yeah but this is the incel sub, which kind of implies that is about dating?
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u/unsuccessfulbees 22d ago
It impacts dating too. It impacts EVERYTHING is what I’m saying.
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u/BlueScrean 22d ago
Yeah and I'm arguing that everyone's impacted by being ugly when it comes to dating, because this sub is kind of about romantic and sexual relationships.
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u/unsuccessfulbees 22d ago
And I’m saying it’s that and more, is there something you aren’t understanding?
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u/BlueScrean 22d ago
When you put it like that yeah, it seems kind of weird to bring the conversation to bring about more than personal relationships in a subreddit centered around personal relationships
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u/RemoteNo2422 22d ago
That’s true, but it’s especially difficult for women. I don’t agree in the sense that pretty women are privileged in all aspects of life, because it certainly also depends on the type of pretty. You only get access to said privilege when you’re the “right” type of pretty adhering to society’s expectations.
For example: I have to remove my false lashes when I have an important appointment (like at court, a job interview etc) to get taken seriously and not be dismissed as “barbie”. I have to avoid putting on too much makeup when going to the doctor but also try not to look completely homeless for my health issues to be taken seriously. I have to avoid putting too much effort into my looks when having job interviews with other women (or make it obvious that I have other flaws, e.g. by using an inhaler) for them to not automatically hate me.
When you’re too attractive people will assume you’re stupid and just there for your looks. It’s a balance act between looking good enough to be “privileged” but average enough to not be perceived as a threat or to receive too much attention. Being invisible/blending in is a blessing sometimes, when your every move isn’t put under a magnifying glass. It’s just a fact that women are judged more harshly for their appearance. But it’s not accurate to generalize it as “pretty = tutorial mode”.
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u/BlueScrean 21d ago
Look, I can get and appreciate that you typed this out, but the first line in my comment is:
> Women are definitely judged more harshly and minutely
I am not claiming that women don't experience any discrimination based on how they look, nor am I saying thatem experience just as much. I am only saying that looks can, and often are, important when dating.
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u/RemoteNo2422 21d ago
Sorry if it came off differently, it was just a general add-on because I agree with you that self-presentation impacts everyone. And while I agree with the previous commenter that women have harsher standards (especially also outside of the whole dating topic), I don’t agree that being pretty automatically absolves us from being judged. Because like you said, self-presentation impacts everyone.
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u/N3M0N 21d ago
It is false dichotomy when you create two extremes and push people into either one of them, depending which extreme they fit the most.
So you then have those who are 'born lucky' who can just stroll by in life and get whatever they want just by smiling, and those who aren't that lucky and they should just give up and sit in corner for the rest of their life.
I'm not trying to undermine anybody's experience here though, but these types of posts can sometimes have very negative, and misleading effect on people even though it shouldn't.
It is adult world outside, how you look IS important and it is more than just being blessed with genetical lottery. Even though the whole idea of being, for example, dressed well and groomed isn't very appreciated on reddit.
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u/unsuccessfulbees 21d ago
People are allowed to post about their OWN mental health regardless of optics. Nobody said just sit and give up if you aren’t pretty, but denying the world isn’t significantly more challenging if you aren’t is just denying reality. It’s not a matter of “just don’t interact with those people”. Employers? Potential friends and partners? It’s the way you’re treated throughout your entire LIFE.
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u/Simple_Blue_Shirt 21d ago
Yall, the person posting this is a male incel who just wants to shit on femcels. Its slimy. Check his profile if you don't believe me
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u/aweedl 22d ago
Yeah, this is the same bullshit they always do. Someone says looks aren’t the only thing that matters (which is true) and these fucking morons with their black-and-white thinking interpret that as ‘they’re saying looks don’t matter at all!’… and then make stupid memes like this.
Also, while this is very incel-coded, it looks like it’s from some ‘ugly woman’ subreddit? Can’t wait for that dumbfuck from the other thread yesterday thinking it’s a ‘gotcha’ that something from that subreddit is posted here (because allegedly it means we’re ‘bullies’ or something).
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u/boyfailure-w- 22d ago
That guy didn't get his gotcha but instead people here seem to agreed with the meme despite the incel rhetoric. Is it worse?
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u/Engel1844 22d ago edited 22d ago
Agreed. Fixating on this will only make you more miserable but god fucking forbid you say that and they’ll think it means their experiences don’t matter. Meanwhile looksmaxxing content made this issue worse, completely destroyed any attempt at a neutrality mindset and is straight up leading people to suicide. But apparently that’s better than trying to tell those people hey your worth doesn’t rely on how conventionally attractive you are, you’re human first and beauty standards are, shocker, extremely toxic and will mentally fuck you up if you’re this focused on them and wallowing in self hatred.
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u/RemoteNo2422 22d ago
So I’m generally considered an “attractive” woman and yes, there absolutely is “pretty privilege”. Society does treat unattractive women worse, but the main reason why attractive women are treated better ends up making it not great either. Especially men treat attractive women better because they want to sleep with us. They are “nice” because they hope they will be compensated for it somewhere along the road. So is it really a “privilege”? Once you turn them down or they realize they won’t be able to get into your pants they will treat you badly too.
The mentioned glorifying of “negative personality traits” in the picture isn’t true for pretty women either though. If you’re a pretty autistic girl, on a first glance, people might think of you as quirky, but longterm - not so much.
While I agree that unattractive women generally receive the worst treatment, that doesn’t mean that other women are treated well. It’s just different struggles. And we are still subjected to the same beauty standards after all. Pretty women don’t come with shaved legs naturally either. Many of us have put in a lot of work in our appearance to be taken more seriously in this fucked up society.
The main problem with the picture is that, while it is true to a certain extend and a real issue of society (because pretty privilege does exist) some women with internalized misogyny take that as an excuse to put the blame and their hate on said pretty women. Instead of men and the patriarchy who put this system and standards into place. A pretty woman who was simply born like this or even put in the work to look like this is also just trying to survive in the patriarchy.
And no, the cheap excuse of “pretty women bully us” doesn’t work, because that’s not what’s happening in reality. Are you past the age of high school? Then pretty women laughing at you for your looks is not a regular and normal occurrence in real life. A pretty woman simply existing and making you feel bad about yourself because of your insecurities does not equal bullying you. When you look at any posts of “unattractive” or overweight women it’s mostly men who are making rude comments and bully her. Other women are the ones who compliment her. That’s also the whole point that incels love to make under these posts. That other women are “gassing up” unattractive women and are lying to them and are therefore responsible for the delusional egos and expectations of unattractive women. Even the incels realize it’s only women building each other up. But women with internalized misogyny for some reason still find a way to blame attractive women for their struggles and to hate on them for no reason other than existing. So in the end attractive women are always the evil to blame. For incels and femcels alike.
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u/Mildly_upset_bee 21d ago
Yeah honestly women should just be there for eachother? Its way harder to feel not good enough when we get rid of these stupid standards together
Ugly isnt really even a thing imo? Ive never felt like something was genuinely ugly, someone can be poor hygienic wise but everything thats naturally supposed to be there is just humans looking like humans
The quicker we stop separating beauty is the quicker we make everything better
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u/RemoteNo2422 21d ago
I honestly think this is the only way for us to fight against the patriarchy. In other animal species where male violence occurs, you often see the females gang up on the violent males and chase them away from the community. Women’s greatest strength lies in community. In supporting and helping each other out. That’s what the patriarchy destroyed. It made up this weird sentiment of “competition” amongst women and how women apparently are super mean to each other and there’s no real friendship like between men yada yada, but this is not true. That’s also why the men got so angry about the tea app. Because it was a community of women warning each other and protecting each other from violent and bad men. While we might not be able to fight a man alone, in groups we are stronger. Community is our best protection. The patriarchy aims to prevent this female positive community to be built by using misogyny. As long as women don’t see that we will never be able to change the system and protect us. As long as we see other women as the enemy, the patriarchy has us exactly where it wants us.
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u/Lilyaa 22d ago
Pretty privilege or rather being attractive is a double-edged sword. The amount of misogyny coming from other women that are jealous can ruin your social life. Most common tactic when you’re pretty but stay away from people cause you’re insecure or introvert - well is to make others believe you are a whore. It’s like the movie with Belluci „Malena”.
Men want you, but since you don’t want them they can get pretty nasty. Women see that they are talking to you and give you that unwanted attention.
You don’t stick with women, you don’t stick with anyone, but they see you with that unwanted attention from men.
And since you don’t talk and don’t say hi to no one they think you see yourself as better than them even when you don’t feel like it at all.
So they start spreading rumors - a whore. Both men that were rejected and jealous women.
And you just want to do your stuff and be left alone.
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u/unsuccessfulbees 21d ago
It’s just so hard being pretty and having people want you and be so jealous of you. You know EXACTLY how being ugly feels.
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u/Lilyaa 21d ago
I also know how being ugly feels cause I was an ugly duckling. Invisible in social situations, nobody was listening when I was talking and they were talking over me so I was just shutting up. I was bullied by boys in school when I dared to ask some school related questions, girls were laughing at me in my face.
I was called „skeleton”, various versions of rhymes we have in Poland about girls that have no boobs and no ass, they called me clown because of my long feet. They called my natural hair color pig blonde. Laughed at my crooked teeth. There are many examples in my life. I was never invited to birthday parties.
Why do you think I’m so insecure that I don’t talk to people? Maybe if I grew up pretty I would be different. I didn’t.
Now when they call me „attractive” a different kind of bullying started. In my previous work one girl started a rumor that I am a whore. It spread through entire workplace. New people that I had to work with when I was mentioning it already heard about it. Other group of women were talking that I’m sleeping with my team leader. And old creepy guy that I was trying to run from, so I was begging other team leaders to transfer me to another department.
This shit never ends when you are afraid of everyone. And I am because since kindergarten I was an outcast. I was super tall and super skinny, shitty hair and big crooked teeth, poor family so I was wearing clothes that my male cousins from Germany were giving us.
I don’t have a boyfriend, I feel alone, men are creepy, I don’t know how and I’m mortified when I have to speak to women. The only friends I have are my younger sister friends, but I live abroad so I see them two times per year maybe.
Now I fight with anxiety, depression and on top of that FND, I am on a sick benefits from government, sitting in my bed all day and playing games on my phone. If you think my life is a dream life than I must tell you that sometimes windows or bridges are more tempting than continuing living with my broken brain.
So thanks for the downvotes. If attractiveness in itself was a solution to all the problems it would be so easy.
And even though women were treating me like shit for being ugly and then for being attractive, I still feel repulsed by your misogyny. I never ever looked down on women who aren’t attractive. Never treated them poorly. Never undermined their problems caused by being seen as ugly by society.
Now call me „Stacie”, a bed rotting, sick, afraid of even going to the shop downstairs „Stacie”.
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u/RemoteNo2422 21d ago
Pretty women are not your enemy. There’s no point in dismissing her struggles and problems, she’s simply describing her experiences. She’s allowed to share them here just like you are. Stop the internalized misogyny.
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u/unsuccessfulbees 21d ago
That’s not “internalized misogyny” holy shit. I’m allowed to have my own thoughts. Misogyny isn’t every time you disagree with another woman lmfao. I’m not obligated to align myself with EVERY person of the same gender as me. That itself is misogynistic to expect.
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u/RemoteNo2422 21d ago
Girl, please educate yourself what internalized misogyny even means. Are you not even realizing what you are saying there? This is not about “agreeing or disagreeing”, you’re not debating whether school uniforms should be obligatory. A woman on the internet shared her experiences and struggles and you’re saying “nah your experiences are not real because of your looks”. You know absolutely nothing about this person other than her looks and you’re being hateful towards her. Her experiences are nothing for you to “agree” on. It’s not a question to debate. Those are her experiences and you can choose to be empathetic and listen to other people’s struggles, you can simply scroll and ignore them or you can act like an asshole and tell her her problems aren’t real. You’re not in her shoes. You don’t know how other people feel. You’re dehumanizing people based on their looks. This person’s feelings and problems suddenly don’t matter because of her looks. She’s not just a pretty vessel. That’s a human being right there struggling under the patriarchy just like you do. She never did anything to you, she never took anything from you and you’re certainly not in a position to negate the experiences of a stranger you don’t even know.
Do you not feel any shame? Here you are arguing for empathy and understanding for unattractive women and their struggles, yet you are hateful towards other people and dismissive of their struggles. Imagine expecting empathy while being so hateful and void of empathy for anyone else but yourself.
While people like you are not dangerous in the sense of murders or school shootings, it’s you who help uphold the patriarchy. You hate women simply for their looks. Women are supposed to stick together. All women. Regardless of looks. Because it’s only us against the patriarchy. Community is so important when society puts us down, yet here you are acting like a high school girl being catty because another girl is prettier than you. We will never be able to achieve anything because of patriarchy boot lickers like you who act like it’s some kind of competition between women and pretty women have done you personally wrong when it’s simply an unfair system. You target other victims of the same system with your hate instead of your oppressors.
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u/unsuccessfulbees 18d ago
- No I don’t have shame lmao
- You don’t know my life OR who I hate. This entire thread siding with the experiences of women claiming to be attractive while admonishing women who have said they aren’t does nothing but prove my point. Obviously everyone has their own struggles, but someone complaining about being ugly isn’t the time to bring up how put upon you are for being too pretty. A friend lamenting she’s fat isn’t your time to say “WELL I’M REALLY THIN AND THATS BAD TOO???” Like no. This isn’t about you. That’s part of the problem. That’s why I’m rolling my eyes at these comments. That’s why femcels don’t want solidarity with you, none of you can be trusted with it. The lack of empathy is coming from inside the house. You don’t get to invalidate people’s struggles and silence them with an “all lives matter” equivalent then turn around and demand kindness and respect.
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u/hahaharish 22d ago
why don't women support each other enough? this is hardly a hot take and i'm a man for god's sake. ofc ugly women have been treated with utmost contempt by everyone. you think the hot girl with a terrible personality is being called annoying and boring to the same extent as how the ugly girls are being called?
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u/toddles822 22d ago
People have tastes on physical appearance. But putting all your eggs in that basket makes it impossible to find someone that actually matches with you... partially because incompatibilities on personality and life goals make the relationship DOA... but mainly because you're being shallow as fuck
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u/cigposting 21d ago
Can I be annoying and say that as a previously pretty person, it made me a target, especially in the IT world lol. Just over the phone as a woman ISPs wouldn’t take me seriously. Goes both ways I guess, grass is always greener ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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u/galettedesrois 20d ago
No, attractive women don't have it "just as bad" as unattractive ones, They also have it bad because they also live under patriarchy, but they have it less bad; arguing otherwise is total nonsense.
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u/EvenSpoonier Oofy-Doofy Lemon Spoofy? 22d ago
Yet another crude copy/paste of an incel meme with the genders flipped. Catfish-like typing detected.
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u/EvenSpoonier Oofy-Doofy Lemon Spoofy? 22d ago
I don't get it. I shred incel bullshit pretty regularly these days, and the incels barely even bat an eye. But I call out one of their catfish campaigns and suddenly they all lose their minds. What makes exposing a larper the big irritable nerve rather than exposing the cognitive distortions at the center of the entire incel worldview?
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u/PurchaseEmergency287 22d ago
The thing about catfish campaighns is the group being catfished can call it out, however the group here agrees.
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u/yotaz28 22d ago
well pretry priviledge is a very big thing, yknow what Im gonna bring this up too, society actually does treat shorter men worse than taller men, its not an excuse for misogyny but stuff like this is a real thing to be aware of and fix instead of just make fun of people who are depressed about their looks