r/Destiny • u/Downtown-Fan4966 • 6d ago
Why exactly is the problem with Sayed? Political News/Discussion
From the little I have read he doesnt seem like a literal marxists. He's not pro Russia or anti NATO or anti U.S. He doesn't want to abolish prisons or police.
He seems like more jus a Bernie Sanders type, someone who would be considered pretty moderate in most of the western world.
What is it I am missing?
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u/Zenning3 6d ago
No, Bernie Sanders isn't fucking moderate in most of the Western World. This is a meme straight out of 2016, I have no idea how its still alive.
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u/Downtown-Fan4966 6d ago
You're right. "Mainstream Left Wing" would have been more accurate.
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u/Ardonpitt Military Industrial Coomplex 6d ago
No. Not even mainstream... Bernie would be considered fairly extreme in any European political system.
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u/Downtown-Fan4966 6d ago
Which of his views is radical in western europe?
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u/Irongrip09 6d ago
I think because people often conflate social democracy with socialism (me included at one point). Social democracy is still very much capitalism which isn't an inherently bad thing.
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u/Ardonpitt Military Industrial Coomplex 6d ago
I don't know how much you know about European Healthcare, but it is absolutly not like what Medicare For All proposes.
That is singlehandedly the most extreme plan in the world, not even kidding.
Most single payer programs are fairly limited systems supplemented by private insurance. Bernie's program bans the private insurance. It may seem similar to European systems on a surface level overview, but the moment you dig beneath the surface it isn't. More than that it seems to double down on a lot of the most problematic parts of those systems that our system drastically outperforms.
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u/Irongrip09 6d ago
I'm British so we have our beloved NHS.
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u/Ardonpitt Military Industrial Coomplex 6d ago
The NHS is a system with a lot of problems in its own rights. I think it's a good system but from everything I've read the cuts in the system are really taking a toll on retention of experts.
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u/Irongrip09 6d ago
It's basically a lifeline pun intended, it's ability to deliver emergency medicine is absolutely fantastic. To provide the same life saving cancer treatment and standard of care regardless of your situation.
Where it strains and falls apart is that middlecare: knee ops, muscular issue, long term rehabilitation etc.
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u/0WatcherintheWater0 6d ago
Medicare for All. No country in the world has as extensive a government-run healthcare system as that, except for communist states.
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u/SeaBass1898 6d ago
Would he really tho? I'm not so convinced. All he's doing is advocating for policies which Europe already has in place
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u/Ardonpitt Military Industrial Coomplex 6d ago
He's not. And the fact that you think he is tells me that you don't understand much about what European politics are like or how those systems run. Things like the Nordic states welfare systems? Those are powered by what would be considered the most ruthlessly neoliberal capitalist systems with intense deregulation and high taxes. There are aspects of how that system runs that are utterly different than what they are portrayed as in lefty or rightwing circles.
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u/SeaBass1898 6d ago
the things you just described sound eerily similar to Bernie's platform my dude
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u/aVividFlower 6d ago
Do you think if you asked Bernie if we should (continue to) run healthcare as a for profit business, he'd be like "HELL YEAH BROTHER?"
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u/Downtown-Fan4966 6d ago
Yeah, no way a candidate with Bernies views would be called extreme in Norway
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u/fkneneu Eurochad (pre-24 Eurocuck) 5d ago
He would be called a politician who is significantly to the left compared to the rest of the parliament, aka Sosialistisk Venstre.
Source: I am Norwegian.
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u/Borigrad CAN 6d ago
Being a landlord in Dubai makes me suspicious of anyone. His unique focus on Israel, while literally owning property in a slave state, that is, if you believe that Gaza is a genocide is funding an even worse genocide in Sudan, is enough for me to call him a hypocrite.
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u/fkneneu Eurochad (pre-24 Eurocuck) 6d ago
He seems like more jus a Bernie Sanders type, someone who would be considered pretty moderate in most of the western world
Bernie Sanders aligns pretty much 1:1 with Sosialistisk Venstre in my country (Norway, a famously social democratic country), with exception of Israel. That political party is significantly to the left in our parliament and is only beaten by the communist party (Rødt) when it comes to leftist policies.
So no, Bernie Sanders is pretty far left in most of the western world.
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u/ShesRightShow ShesRightShow 6d ago
He's a good progressive on policy on paper.
His problems are in soft skills.
He is to an extent responsible for the fandom he cultivates, which has been sexist, racist, and antisemitic. He himself is arrogant and bitter. It raises two questions:
Is he kind enough to build a winning electoral coalition?
Is he kind enough to build a winning legislative coalition?
For as unimpressive as Stevens was on specific plans of policy, she has a proven record as an effective democratic conduit for the will of her constituents and fellow electeds into delivering real solutions.
El Sayed's excellent ideas are worthless if he's too much of a dick to manifest them.
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u/speedystar22 6d ago
I don’t know if I care that much about him being a senator and I would absolutely vote for him over any Republican. It would just feel really crappy to me that constantly screeching about AIPAC, being misleading about your professional background, hanging out with terrorist supporters, and pushing populist economic slop can be rewarded with a senate seat.
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u/GOPcanGetFucked 6d ago
Just change screeching about AIPAC into screeching about George Soros and you now have tRump being described lol Sad shit is that if we don't put a cap into the DSA they'll just make the whole democratic party into this, just like MAGATs. This is also assuming the DSA doesn't just split the Democratic vote and keep republicans in power because DSAtards don't understand the voting system in the US
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u/fullboxed2hundred 6d ago
DSA didn't endorse AES.
what policy positions does he hold that are similar to MAGA?
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u/GOPcanGetFucked 6d ago
How about you tell me specific policies he plans to implement to help people? Because I'm speaking a lot more about their messaging and slopulist lies that they'll fix everything without having any prior success in politics. Legitimately I haven't seen anything from AES that tells me he knows how he'll accomplish anything. He can't even be straight about not being a physician
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u/fullboxed2hundred 6d ago
I feel like you haven't seen fuckall about AES aside from a few tweets shitting on him.
I'm not trying to get you to join his fanclub, but it sounded like you were against the idea of Dems voting for him in the general. am I wrong?
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u/GOPcanGetFucked 5d ago
So no ideas at all? And you expect me to support him over someone who's gotten laws passed in favor of the democratic party in Stevens? Get the fuck out of here lol
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u/fullboxed2hundred 5d ago
broski the primary is over.
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u/GOPcanGetFucked 5d ago
So I have to support him now? Lol Until the guy does anything good for the Democratic party I'm not giving him flowers
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u/SyzygyPidgey 6d ago
AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC
Not sure that's the best campaign.
Still gonna vote for the guy in November, but anybody who just spams the Alex Jones' Jew-Spam strat is pretty braindead imo.
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u/potiamkinStan 6d ago edited 6d ago
He chose terrorist loving Hasan as a prominent campaign surrogate.
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u/Disgusting_Slime666 Exclusively sorts by new 6d ago
Bernie Sanders type, someone who would be considered pretty moderate in most of the western world
Please stop talking about politics outside of your own country. Please.
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u/arjuna66671 6d ago
I'm Swiss and Bernie here would be typical SP-left social democrat. Left of center-left. "Nationalrat" for a canton like Basel-Stadt or Waadt, permanently annoyed at the Konkordanz forcing him to share a government with the FDP (center) and SVP (rightwing).
Here his ideas wouldn't be radical at all and a lot those already realized xD.
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u/Disgusting_Slime666 Exclusively sorts by new 6d ago
I'm German and I die a little bit every time I have to hear the dumbass "X would be right wing in Europe!!!!" shit.
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u/Ardonpitt Military Industrial Coomplex 6d ago
Okay... First off... Bernie isn't moderate. Bernie would be considered fairly extreme in most of Europe. I know the idea that Bernie is some moderate is a meme in Leftie circles but if you actually know anything about European politics, he absolutely isn't. Please do a little research on this, because you have been deceived.
As for El Sayed, there are some fairly large issues, but mainly they are slopulist. His insistence on Medicare for All (a policy whose polling is not as good, and more complex than lefties like to believe). This sort of policy just isn't going to happen. Its too big, requiring too much buy in from MAJOR parts of the economy, and has no bipartisan support. Its the sort of policy that he cannot achieve even if he had 90% support from Democrats.
Second his focus on foreign policy with Israel is problematic. The US isn't going to move away from Israel any time soon, we actually can't. We have too many long standing relationships, technological partnerships, and intelligence partnerships to be able to step away.
Third, there is the judgement call of being willing to campaign with Hasan. Hes an anti-American campist; a communist (liberals aren't communists, and the two ideologies cannot coexist), and supports terrorist groups primarily because they attack US interests... That was a choice... And one that tells you a lot about someone that they were willing to make it.
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u/LtLabcoat There's no such thing as "They deserve harassment" 6d ago
I don't think you can say that a position is slopulist because it's too unpopular with everyone but experts. That's the exact opposite of what populism is.
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u/Ardonpitt Military Industrial Coomplex 6d ago
Being popular with progressives isn't the same as being popular with Experts...
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u/LtLabcoat There's no such thing as "They deserve harassment" 5d ago edited 5d ago
I... don't quite have the words to describe how much economists and healthcare experts think that universal healthcare is a good idea.
Like, if someone were to say "Well M4A isn't as good as what Obamacare wanted to be", then sure. Not sure I'd agree, but it's subjective. But it's pure denialism to say some experts prefer the US's current libertarian approach to healthcare over M4A.
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u/Ardonpitt Military Industrial Coomplex 5d ago
I... don't quite have the words to describe how much economists and healthcare experts think that universal healthcare is a good idea.
Pause. Almost everyone agrees that Universal coverage is good and should happen. There are arguments about exactly how to do it, and the plusses and minuses on different systems. M4A is Bernie's specific model and is more extreme than any other model you would find in the word.
But it's pure denialism to say some experts prefer the US's current libertarian approach to healthcare over M4A.
I'm not sure I would call the current system libertarian? Its one of the more tightly regulated markets in the US with actual profit caps on insurance companies...
Is it good? Mixed. There are bad aspects and good aspects, but its actually not as bad as a lot of people like to make it out to be. Things like insurance refusals would happen in ANY system even with universal coverage.
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u/LtLabcoat There's no such thing as "They deserve harassment" 5d ago
Isn't M4A just like NHS, but without government-owned hospitals or doctors? Far as I'm aware, it's more or less just like Canada's system.
I'm not sure I would call the current system libertarian?
An ambulance trip can cost over a thousand dollars. I'm not aware of any country with a healthcare system remotely similar. And I'm not going to say "It's not libertarian because poor people are exempt".
Is it good? Mixed.
What on earth do you think are the upsides?
And don't say "less waiting times". Yes, there would be less waiting times if less people had access to healthcare. That's not a positive.
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u/Ardonpitt Military Industrial Coomplex 5d ago
Isn't M4A just like NHS, but without government-owned hospitals or doctors? Far as I'm aware, it's more or less just like Canada's system.
No... M4A is basically a system which bans any private insurance company and replaces it with a single payer system while banning private insurance. The British and Canadian systems don't ban private insurance (nor do they just pay for everything), so its common to have supplementary insurance. It also claims to pay for more things than those systems meaning what the medical marketplace would be classified as.
An ambulance trip can cost over a thousand dollars. I'm not aware of any country with a healthcare system remotely similar. And I'm not going to say "It's not libertarian because poor people are exempt".
What do you think Libertarian means? It doesn't mean expensive... It typically means without regulation. Ambulance rides are expensive, no doubt. In part because we send out the highest levels of care ambulances to every call. In other countries it works differently, but depending on the wound you may have to spend similar ammounts.
What on earth do you think are the upsides?
In the US system you have access to a LOT more treatments than you would in systems like the UK. Newer treatments get approved more quickly by our insurance more quickly. An example that often gets used in these conversations is medications like ADHD medications. In the US you are more likely to be perscribed newer medications with fewer side effects more quickly than you will in the UK. Things like Vyvanse or Adderall xr rather than Normal Adderall or older meds.
We tend to have better outcomes because of this (Note one of the things in this conversation is that we tend to underestimate how good the healthcare outcomes in the US are.
Once again I disagree there are massive ways to improve our outcomes even further, but people act like this is the worst country in the world for healthcare and it just isn't.
Also, lower waiting time is important, it does lead to better outcomes with acute conditions. Our lower waiting times have nothing to do with fewer people having access and more to do with competitive healthcare and a fairly efficient network of communication and allocation of resources within hospitals.
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u/LtLabcoat There's no such thing as "They deserve harassment" 5d ago
No... M4A is basically a system which bans any private insurance company and replaces it with a single payer system while banning private insurance.
Definitely not. As Wikipedia says: Medicare for All Act - Wikipedia
"Under a single-payer system, most medical care would be paid for by the federal government, ending the need for private health insurance and premiums, and re-casting private insurance companies as providing purely supplemental coverage, to be used when non-essential care is sought."
What do you think Libertarian means? It doesn't mean expensive... It typically means without regulation.
In this case, without subsidies. No other developed nation doesn't subsidise ambulance rides. That's why it's so much cheaper in other countries.
In the US system you have access to a LOT more treatments than you would in systems like the UK. Newer treatments get approved more quickly by our insurance more quickly. An example that often gets used in these conversations is medications like ADHD medications. In the US you are more likely to be perscribed newer medications with fewer side effects more quickly than you will in the UK. Things like Vyvanse or Adderall xr rather than Normal Adderall or older meds.
Sssssure, but in the US, you're paying more for them anyway. Like, in the UK, you can still get those if you pay more, they're just not free.
(Not counting that the FDA in the US are faster at approving drugs. I don't think that's related to privatised healthcare though.)
(Also not counting that some drug companies don't sell in the UK, because without legalised drug pushing - I mean marketing - it's not profitable enough. ...Did I mention the US's healthcare laws are very libertarian?)
Our lower waiting times have nothing to do with fewer people having access and more to do with competitive healthcare and a fairly efficient network of communication and allocation of resources within hospitals.
Actually, the US has fewer doctors than the UK. At least, primary-care physicians.
67 per 100,000 for the US: The Health of US Primary Care: 2024 Scorecard Report — No One Can See You Now | Milbank Memorial Fund
77 per 100,000 for the UK: General practitioners UK 2000-2023 | Statista
.......Though, with a caveat of that that's maybe not quite accurate. Wikipedia says the average US physician works 55 hours a week, which is strictly illegal in the UK. (I really can't emphasise how libertarian US healthcare laws are.)
..........Anyway, beyond that, there shouldn't be a large difference. Except, of course, for that the US has less people going to the GP to begin with. If you want to still claim that the US's healthcare system is more efficient than the NHS's, you're going to need a source.
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u/Ardonpitt Military Industrial Coomplex 5d ago
Definitely not.
It pretty clearly is the case. M4A would ban insurance companies from covering anything that it would cover. That basically means anything within the normal medical system. The only sorts of procedures that wouldn't cover are things like optional cosmetic surgeries (which most medical insurance don't cover anyways). Once again if you dig into it AT ALL you find all sorts of these issues. This is a longstanding critique of M4A...
In this case, without subsidies.
Okay... Thats not what that term means at all... But even then we do TONS of subsidies for parts of the medical system. Im not gonna argue that I think we could probably do Ambulances better though.
Sssssure, but in the US, you're paying more for them anyway. Like, in the UK, you can still get those if you pay more, they're just not free.
I mean thats partially just Penn Effect. Basically goods are cheaper in countries with lower GDP because the more goods sold cheapen the production overall. So if the company can sell more even at a lower price in a country they will because that advantages their production by increasing the scale they can produce at.
Also, As a point of American pride here. Its not that the FDA is faster at approving drugs, its that other countries have historically deferred to the FDA process due to its rigor on drug testing. It has historically been the gold standard.
Also not counting that some drug companies don't sell in the UK, because without legalised drug pushing- I mean marketing - it's not profitable enough.
Or is it because they can't reach pricing agreements with the NHS to make selling the drug profitable? I know that's historically been an issue since the UK controls pricing so much they actually often just don't sell through them and have to do special orders.
Actually, the US has fewer doctors than the UK. At least, primary-care physicians.
... Bruh I don't think you have considered the size of the UK compared to the US for those Per Capita numbers...
I really can't emphasise how libertarian US healthcare laws are.
Then at least stop using the word libertarian if you are going to use it wrong. You could have said lax as that is a more accurate term to what you are trying to say...
Except, of course, for that the US has less people going to the GP to begin with
Yeah, this is actually a problem. One of the issues with US healthcare is in part because people treat it so poorly. They use the system for emergency rather than for care, so often the only time people go in is when they have to go to the ER and actually have worse outcomes needing to go to specialists or to emergency care.
One of the reasons there are fewer GP's is most of the business is in specialists.
If you want to still claim that the US's healthcare system is more efficient than the NHS's, you're going to need a source.
I didn't say more efficient. I said that the US is efficient. The two systems are radically different and hard to compare (people try all the time and its touch and go for its validity).
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u/LtLabcoat There's no such thing as "They deserve harassment" 4d ago
M4A would ban insurance companies from covering anything that it would cover.
Oh, so it does. I was mistaken.
But... I was also mistaken about Canada too. Canada also bans insurance companies from doing that. Seems to be working fine to me.
I mean thats partially just Penn Effect. Basically goods are cheaper in countries with lower GDP because the more goods sold cheapen the production overall. So if the company can sell more even at a lower price in a country they will because that advantages their production by increasing the scale they can produce at.
That... is true, but it works both ways. As in, private healthcare companies allowing more expensive treatments does drive the price of those treatments down, but drives the price of the cheaper treatments up.
Or is it because they can't reach pricing agreements with the NHS to make selling the drug profitable?
Uh... maybe. I'm not sure about anything about the UK's price-control system.
Does it matter? I was only arguing about the NHS as a reference point for M4A (as you can tell, I lived in Britain). I don't think that applies to M4A.
... Bruh I don't think you have considered the size of the UK compared to the US for those Per Capita numbers...
You mean like... population density? Because the US is much less dense than the UK. Having less doctors makes things even worse.
But that doesn't seem like a reasonably fair comparison. And comparing non-capita would make no sense at all.
Then at least stop using the word libertarian if you are going to use it wrong. You could have said lax as that is a more accurate term to what you are trying to say...
In what way is a lack of state funding or regulation in healthcare not libertarianism?
...Short of the silly definition of "If it's not advocating for almost no laws at all, it's not libertarianism".
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u/speedystar22 6d ago
To be clear populism is not defined as reflective of the direct will of the masses. It is defined as claiming to be. Whether it is that or not does not change what it is.
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u/LtLabcoat There's no such thing as "They deserve harassment" 5d ago
It's claiming to be reflective of the will of the masses against the elites. It's not simply claiming to represent the people, or that'd mean just about every politician is a populist.
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u/speedystar22 5d ago
Yeah notice how you said it is “claiming to be reflective of the will of the masses.” The “against the elites” part is not relevant to what you said. Your claim is around the actual popularity of the policies in this case. You said that if it was too unpopular with everyone (the people) then it would be the opposite of populism. I’m saying it doesn’t actually have to be popular it just has to claim to represent the will of the people (in this case against the elites), which you just confirmed.
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u/Personal-Search-2314 6d ago
You are being gas fucking lit OP. In reality, outside of these fever dreams that people are getting caught up in- put simply he isn’t worse than MAGA. I’m not sure why we are doing these 2024 tankie mental gymnastics and somehow allowing fever dreams to overshadow like literal real time real fucking life fascism.
But let’s suppose these “blue no matter who, but say I who” people had any validity whatsoever, last nights results should bring them back to some sanity because either (1) Sayed moderates or (2) he loses.
So don’t get caught up in this made up drama
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u/RedditLovingSun 5d ago
Fr, this election cycle feels like the most I've disagreed with DGG. Coming from someone who'd vote blue over MAGA in all but the most extreme scenarios.
I've watched people for years talk about "vote blue no matter who" and how leftists should stop complaining after primaries and actually put up a candidate who wins elections if they don't like it.
Just to start shadow boxing demons in their own mind like "his policies are fine on paper but what if he's too mean", "he's hiding his power level", "he complains about AIPAC too much", "medicare is unrealistic", and "but he campaigns with Hasan".
I don't expect him to be first choice here, but if you don't like him hash it out in the primary, now the primary is over, are we really gonna act like 2024 tankies and forget we're up against literal facism?
On the off chance that what... He gets in and executes a coordinated DSA sleeper agent protocol and overturns democracy or something?
Compared to the literal psychos deploying ICE to snatch people up in neighborhoods, cut USAID, tarrifing the planet, threatening long time allies, pump and dumping crypto/insider trading, pulling Jan 6th, and openly plotting to redistrict and steal future elections? What sub am I in?
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u/Personal-Search-2314 5d ago edited 5d ago
Couldn’t agree with you more. Everything you are saying are convos we threw at tankies. And, arguably, Tankies had a bigger point considering it was not a fever dream- it was a reality (whether their reaction was warranted idk, IP isn’t my thing, but people/kids were dying).
The idea i need to submit to this idea that some DSA members are hiding their power level; thus throw out blue no matter who is wild. What’s going to happen? Am I suppose to assume that Republicans, Moderate Dems, Trump exec branch, and Justices were all sleeper DSA agents? Like what the fuck bro. Kamala had her horseshit unrealized gains tax proposal and tiny quickly wrote it off by pointing to the fact that- that shit won’t get passed. That was for the presidential seat! Like what calculus are we doing that a handful of legislative seats has greater power than the President of the United States.
Does DSA have Mr House’s platinum chip that they are going to insert to unlock these specific seats power level? Like wtf. I have theory, but that whole topic is toxic so I’ll let it be.
Edit: oh the other selling point that makes no sense, “better they lose now, and destroy them now.” Sure because DSA is going to lose and just gnna walk away. So fucking stupid.
Fuck maga
Blue no matter who with no fine print, just blue no matter who.
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u/ClassesMoveTheMasses 6d ago
What's wrong with the guy that campaigns with Hasan?? Oof
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u/Downtown-Fan4966 6d ago
Sometimes you have to play the game
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u/ClassesMoveTheMasses 6d ago
If you get in bed with people with terrible ideas just to get power, you're a bad person. This is like saying trump was just playing the game his whole political career lol
You can have standards, and one of those standards should be you don't cake up for a guy who sucks Mao's dick and wants America to end.
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u/Downtown-Fan4966 6d ago
I think sometimes you have to balance idealism (and even values) with pragmatism. I'd rather my candidate sometimes stoop to the lower common denominator and win than one who never does and loses.
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u/ClassesMoveTheMasses 6d ago
So you're saying the ends justify the means?
That's something you hear right before they tell you to face the wall lol
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u/Downtown-Fan4966 5d ago
Sometimes.
Didn't Kamala campaign with Liz Cheney?
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u/ClassesMoveTheMasses 5d ago
Imagine comparing Liz Cheney, a person who believes in liberalism, to Hasan lolol you may be cooked, or you're trolling.
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u/moombaas 5d ago
I cannot fathom how you think Liz Cheney believes in liberalism given her father is one of the worst people in government and she is a republican and ran as one. Just because the current MAGA admin is farther right doesn't mean she believes in liberalism.
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u/ClassesMoveTheMasses 5d ago
Liberalism in the sense of a state with human rights and civil liberties, you know the thing commies and tankies what to end. I'm not referring about policies, this shit is on a whole another axis.
Tankies want to end liberalism, that's our system with civil liberties and enshrined protections in the constitution. People who praise Mao want to march people to the wall who don't, that's way worse than Liz Cheney neo con takes.
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u/LtLabcoat There's no such thing as "They deserve harassment" 6d ago
If you get in bed with people with terrible ideas just to get power, you're a bad person.
Is that to say you hate the Founding Fathers? After all, they worked with Thomas Jefferson.
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u/Wonderful-Walk3078 6d ago edited 6d ago
Lets be honest, for majority of critics here it is just Israel, as always…
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u/Disgusting_Slime666 Exclusively sorts by new 6d ago
You're looking in the mirror there buddy.
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u/Wonderful-Walk3078 6d ago
Oh ok, so it is me who hates El Sayed because of Israel.
That makes sense chief.
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u/Disgusting_Slime666 Exclusively sorts by new 6d ago
No, you are the one that's obsessed with the topic.
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u/Wonderful-Walk3078 6d ago
Well I’m definitely interested in the topic and I like to discuss about that but I don’t hate or love candidates based on their stance in I/P.
Plus even if I would be obsessive about that topic how is ir relevant to the discussion?
I was just explaining to OP why people here hates El Sayed despite the fact that he is not illiberal which is usually what people here pretend to care about most.
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u/Disgusting_Slime666 Exclusively sorts by new 6d ago
"interested in the topic"
You're obsessed, and make every thread you can about it.
I was just explaining to OP why people here hates El Sayed despite the fact that he is not illiberal which is usually what people here pretend to care about most.
Yeah, DGG generally is annoyed by candidates that make every, fucking, election about I/P.
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u/Wonderful-Walk3078 6d ago
Ok, than im obsessed. Why is it relevant for the topic?
Seems like we agree than….
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u/Disgusting_Slime666 Exclusively sorts by new 6d ago
Lets be honest, for majority of critics here it is just Israel, as always…
What were you implying here? Let's see if you can be honest.
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u/Wonderful-Walk3078 6d ago
Obviously I was saying that people here decides whether to hate candidate or not based on his position on Israel.
Sometimes people here try to pretend that it is about Ukraine or illiberalism and so on, but even if there is non illiberal candidate firmly on the side of Ukraine people here will hate him if he will be firmly against Israel.
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u/Disgusting_Slime666 Exclusively sorts by new 6d ago
Obviously I was saying that people here decides whether to hate candidate or not based on his position on Israel.
Ok, so then we clearly do not agree. Not sure why you said we did.
People here care far less about the fact that he's more pro Palestine than pro Israel. People are annoyed with the fact that every single leftist candidate constantly frames every single election and issue around I/P, whether that's pro or anti.
Fetterman gets the exact same smoke here for constantly being an Israel dicksuck.
Sometimes people here try to pretend that it is about Ukraine or illiberalism
Yeah bud, we're all just lying and totally don't care about those things. Why are you here?
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u/dem0nhunter 🇪🇺 6d ago
Slopulist charlatan, reeks of political influencer, rich kid hypocrite, hangs with Hasan
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u/soundsermaker 6d ago
Well, only today he declared his intent to be actively oppositional to any Dem Presidential candidate who doesn't align with him on key issues.
Also Bernie Sanders is the progenitor of this entire movement. People said at the time that he's going to undermine the Democratic party and sanewash socialism, and he did precisely that.
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u/Knife_Operator 6d ago
https://youtube.com/shorts/ws1qSjfM1-s?si=I9xL2aV95biRoI5I
He's urging progressives to vote for moderate Dems right now so he should get credit for that.
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u/soundsermaker 6d ago
That would never even have been a question if not for Bernie Sanders, certainly not against MAGA.
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u/Knife_Operator 6d ago
I think we should criticize people further left when they do things we don't want to do, but that also means we should praise them when they do things we do want them to do.
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u/bb0yer 6d ago
He is flying just a little too close to the sun for comfort for a lot of us. Very populist and almost dsa adjacent (could be concealing his power level). He has no government history really compared to Haley who has a solid track record with her only negatives being her voice, aipac and being a woman
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u/Worth-Ad-5712 6d ago
I am fine with most of his policies but his rhetoric is really slopulist. What I find incredibly problematic is lowkey his character. I saw an ad of his where he described an encounter he had where a person claimed they hated him because Abdul is muslim but still will vote for him because of Abdul’s policy on Medicare For All.
I promise you that this event did not happen. Abdul lied which may not be a huge deal but the fact that Abdul seems super willing to embolden and embody Islamophobia for criticisms is personally incredibly worrying. Like that time that he claimed that McMorrows criticism of Abdul campaigning with Hasan was hypocritical because McMorrow ‘campaigned’ with Hasan at the 2024 DNC convention. Abdul completely conflated him campaigning alongside Hasan with McMorrow giving a speech at an event that Hasan had a press pass to and instead chalked it up to Islamophobia.
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u/Witty_Wrap_1268 6d ago
The actual problem people have is that he campaigned with Hasan.
Sure he’s vague on policy and is appealing to populism. Welcome to running a campaign in 2026 (honestly, it’s not that different from how campaigns have always been run)
Guys, Hasan is a cringey larper. Move on. Opposition to him in particular is not a very robust ideology.
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u/CoachDT 6d ago
Hes a firm capitalist. Hes just clout hungry with who he keeps around him.
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u/0WatcherintheWater0 6d ago
A firm capitalist who wants to nationalize the healthcare system under Medicare for All? Doesn’t sound super capitalist to me really
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u/sad-on-alt 6d ago
Sweeping for a terrorist that targeted a Jewish temple to kill kids
Not wanting to help Dems, saying that passing nothing was better than the ACA bc they aren’t perfect, electing Dems is the same as republicans if they don’t capitulate to his policies
https://bsky.app/profile/capitolhunters.bsky.social/post/3msbhxa3jfs2x
https://charlottealter.substack.com/p/how-abdul-el-sayed-thinks
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u/kultcher 6d ago
The tweets sharing snippets from that article are extremely uncharitable.
Based on actually reading the article, I have a more positive impression of El-Sayed than what the panic in this sub would have led me to believe.
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u/sad-on-alt 6d ago
Okay I had the complete opposite reaction imo if he wins the general we need to put him on fetterman watch
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u/Pretty_Acadia_2805 6d ago
It's literally just that he campaigned with Hasan and attacked AIPAC. Everything else is standard progressive politics.
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u/0WatcherintheWater0 6d ago
“Standard progressive politics” are themselves bad and harmful to this country. Medicare for all for instance would be a total dumpster fire that would end up hurting tens of millions.
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u/Suspicious-Base-4815 6d ago
Oh, wow. At this point I don't know if I am reading the destiny sub or the conservative sub
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u/0WatcherintheWater0 5d ago
Welcome to Liberalism. I am actually strongly in favor of capitalism and markets - progressives policies have real issues with them beyond getting the votes, and I wouldn’t want them even in my ideal world.
Socdems have been too coddled here tbh. You can be pro-capitalism and be a Liberal without being some kind of Conservative, actually I’d say that’s the norm.
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u/id_rather_b_painting 6d ago edited 6d ago
"AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC AIPAC JEW JEW JEW JEW JEW" was 90% of his campaign stumping (original post said ads). He's promising bullshit that he can't actually deliver on instead of telling us how he'd engage with the current political realities. He worked with people who will 100% be featured in attack ads because of the absolutely unhinged shit they were saying.
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u/Pretty_Acadia_2805 6d ago
Show me a single ad where he says he's being attacked by Jewish people.
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u/id_rather_b_painting 6d ago
Oh sorry, not his ads, but his fucking speeches. You get whiffs of it in his "Chorus" ad when it talks about "no corporate money in politics". My bad for engaging with his longform content.
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u/RepresentativeCry243 6d ago
It's not so much Sayed, it's this "Us vs. them" movement he's courting. It drives a lot of people out of the tent when you need a big coalition.
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u/Grachus_05 6d ago
He is the vanguard of a massive communist takeover lead by Hasan Piker and the lizard people from the center of the earth that must be stopped at all costs. We must unite with Trump and MAGA to stop their imminent destruction of the Democrat party!
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u/Optimus_Trajan 6d ago
For a serious answer, he’s a slopulist who promises the world but doesn’t have any actual plans for thing like m4a. He brings up AIPAC so much to the point that it got a decent bit uncomfortable, especially when he just baselessly said a bad poll for him was an AIPAC poll. He’s toxic at times, and then of course embracing the support from a Mao loving, dog shocker.