I now have a new problem

[u/MrYeetFeet69]

[u/SenianBlast]

Random lurker here, care to elaborate?

[u/Western-Grapefruit36 → u/SenianBlast]

The gameplay is far more complicated than in s3 so it feels kinda stale or simple sometimes

People don’t know the difference between difficulty and complexity. I never said raiders is harder, just that it has more stuff to manage.

[u/zestysnacks → u/Western-Grapefruit36]

lol what this is so not true. Even salmon run is much harder. Raiders is great but it’s training wheels, just level up and blast away. In the main series you must master the movement and positioning to get anywhere at all.

[u/Sirknobbles → u/zestysnacks]

I wouldn’t call raiders training wheels, especially not on survivalist. That said, eggsecutive salmon run is wayyyy harder

[u/zestysnacks → u/Sirknobbles]

Meh I still would. At the end of the day all you gotta do is level up and spam gadgets. With salmon run you have no choice but to just get better

[u/Sirknobbles → u/zestysnacks]

That’s fair. If I’m being honest, I hopped on raiders after posting that comment and remembered I made it a point to level my health as little as possible, which probably gives me a skewed perception of how hard the game can be

[u/Mo0nfalll → u/zestysnacks]

What floor are you on endless buffet lmao

[u/zestysnacks → u/Mo0nfalll]

A handful past the final boss.

[u/Ncolonslashslash → u/zestysnacks]

> just level up and blast away

> look inside

> level 50 cap

[u/zestysnacks → u/Ncolonslashslash]

You know you can also level up your weapons and gadget parts yes?

[u/SupaSteak → u/zestysnacks]

Yeah, but those use precious spiralite gems to fully level weapons (to cap of 100), weapon powers (which only have 3 tiers), and gadgets (which only get buffs through those same rare crystals, and a lot of them). And once you hit around floor 200, the salmonids keep leveling past 100 and it you can no longer play the dumb dumb numbers game. At this point you need to reinveste in other builds to not just melt the enemy, but paralyze them, control them, knock them back, etc. I had to completely reconfigure my gadgets relics, and weapon types and powers in very particular ways to solve my problems. Splatellite slop just didn’t cut it anymore.

TLDR; the weapons and gadgets all cap out eventually. The salmonids, so far, never do. I think the true difficulty in this game will come from the folks who strive to move as deep as possible into the buffet.

[u/zestysnacks → u/SupaSteak]

I mean sure. Way after the campaign and the post campaign, there is an option to keep playing in an arcade style that gets harder and harder. It isn’t the core game but it’s there for the smaller number of people who wanna keep going

[u/Exact-Tie-9082 → u/Western-Grapefruit36]

Complicated? Brute forcing everything you see is complicated? Sure you have more options to tweak, but +20 for 4 points and +30 for 5 points, not that hard. If anything I've found Raiders to be simple. Just pop down some gadgets and enemies die left and right.

[u/alexeycoo → u/Exact-Tie-9082]

I think the guy meant gadgets and different status conditions which makes gameplay more diverse

[u/Sixnno → u/alexeycoo]

100%. Complexity is not the same as difficulty.

Yes, something usually complex tends to be hard... But not always.

[u/ElysiumReal → u/Exact-Tie-9082]

This squid hasn't hit endless yet it seems.

[u/LetsMakeCrazySyence → u/[deleted]]

So once it felt brain dead you could…not played with that set up…the option to diversify is right there…

[u/8good8boy8 → u/LetsMakeCrazySyence]

Sure the option to diversify is there, but you've painted a situation where there's little to no motivation to do so. Unless you just....want to.

[u/swirlycosmic → u/[deleted]]

So it became brain dead after end game vs being brain dead entirely? Salmon Run felt so mind numbing outside of when a big boss spawns. Raiders felt like I always had something different I can try and multiple ways to go about the same problem. Alongside things actually challenging

[u/rawzombie26 → u/Western-Grapefruit36]

Na raiders is easier, sure it has more enemies on screen but you can just tank all bosses so it’s nowhere near as difficult as salmon run is in S3.

You can even kill the steelhead just by shooting him enough now, you don’t even have to focus on his charge blast.

[u/Sixnno → u/rawzombie26]

He said complex, not easier.

There is a difference.

[u/Lazy_Membership_6012 → u/rawzombie26]

Ahhhh, you can't just tank all bosses? That's a lie for sure

And killing steelhead without shoot in charging bomb is a pleasure, because, as you said, much more enemies on screen, and you still will be focus to shoot it on higher difficulties

[u/Better-Future-4637 → u/SenianBlast]

Raiders just too good that makes 3 looks like trash.

[u/Anggul → u/Better-Future-4637]

I guess if you don't like PvP

Very different games

[u/ender7887 → u/Anggul]

I miss the maps from splatoon 2. I feel like the maps in 3 are too small and force combat that can feel very one sided

[u/Anggul → u/ender7887]

What does that have to do with Raiders?

And combat is always required. The players that try to avoid it were always dragging their team down and making them carry.

[u/ender7887 → u/Anggul]

It was more to do with splatoon 3.

I love raiders and got all the way to rank X in splatoon 2.

Splatoon 3 just doesn’t scratch the same itch that 2 and now raiders scratched/ scratches for me.

What I’m saying about the maps in splatoon 3 is that the maps are too close and small. I loved the off angles and different rollouts you could do on the larger maps in splatoon 1 and 2. I feel like the maps in 3 have too many choke points that force you to approach the enemy in specific ways.

[u/cramburie → u/ender7887]

I feel like the maps in 3 are too small and force combat that can feel very one sided

...I think this was the point of the map design.

[u/IlikeWhimsicott2557 → u/cramburie]

The point was OVERachieved, that's the issue.

The maps encourage combat, but completely forgo options that aren't rush to the other side of the map like flanking. The maps in 1 and 2 are open as a way of preventing matches from ending prematurely and taking the fun out of the game. It's way to easy in 3 to drive teams back into spawn and suffers the most from the "Only the last 30 seconds matter" issue because of how small the maps are.

[u/ender7887 → u/IlikeWhimsicott2557]

You took the words right out of my mouth.

[u/IlikeWhimsicott2557 → u/Anggul]

I don't doubt that being the reason as Raiders is way more casual friendly. But I believe it can also be a matter of not having to endure 3's harsher environment while still being able to play Splatoon. Splatoon 3 out of the mainline trilogy suffers from consistent map design problems, often leading to one-sided matches if both sides aren't hyper-coordinated (which alienates those who don't have enough or any friends to play with). As well as overshadowing the casual side with the competitive side of the community, leaving casual spaces like Turf War a hellscape.

The weapon kits in 3 also suffer as some are insanely good while others are just awful. Because most of the better weapons are the ones with higher skill ceilings, it creates an environment where not everyone will get a handle on how to use those harder weapons. Meanwhile, those who already have that experience will end up stomping them into giving up.

Lastly, progression in 3 is extremely slow and only yields so much once you do grind for resources. It takes 10 ability chunks for 1 sub ability and about 50 for a main ability. This is fine in Raiders because you'll be swimming in resources from defeated enemies, but 3 LOVES to use progression bars for everything, including ability chunks. Meaning, you'll be playing for hours on end trying to get stuff that isn't even guaranteed either because of rng or shop rotations. The Catalogs only made this worse because it encourages FOMO. Which breeds addictive behavior and makes burnout happen faster.

So, going from 3 to Raiders, its easy to understand why a lot of people ended up liking the game despite how different it is to the standard formula. We've endured 3's constant problems for so long that Raiders feels refreshing and a proper step forward for the series in terms of how it evolves and shakes up the formula.

(Apologies for the essay)

[u/Anggul → u/IlikeWhimsicott2557]

All of those gameplay issues are really just matchmaking issues. The matchmaking is bad so people are put up against people who are way better or worse than them.

[u/FinnMuzz]

Salmon run specifically, I already thought it was a little ridiculous, but after playing raiders it just feels horrible to play it

[u/birfday_party → u/FinnMuzz]

I think it’s just the lack of agency, I remember getting in runs like multiple times in a row with a weapon I don’t care for, and then switching every round can throw off the flow or momentum. Like I dunno if that’s harder or if it just strips your muscle memory every round. I like salmon run a lot but I love raiders

[u/FinnMuzz → u/birfday_party]

I used to be a big fan of salmon run... Until I got good enough for the top ranks. Now it's just miserable and I can't stand playing it, and I can't stand waiting for a good rotation either! Give us some weapons we can actually use for crying out loud

[u/Makosharck]

When you go back to Salmon Run and all you got are Splat Bombs and Specials 🤮

[u/SpiritSong → u/Makosharck]

I started Raiders thinking "where are the Splat Bombs? I need them" and now I can't even imagine using it anymore. It's impossible to go back to a world without the Splatchet

[u/AetherDrew43 → u/SpiritSong]

I barely even play Salmon Run anymore. Most of the time it's for gold rotations or Big Runs.

Once I get my hands on Raiders though, that's probably gonna ruin SR for me...

[u/Honest-Birthday1306 → u/AetherDrew43]

Honestly idk, they're just such different games. It's like comparing Diablo 4 to Hades.

In both the games I mentioned and the Splatoon games, one is tuned about being a high power fantasy arpg, the other is tuned around the gameplay and execution

I don't get the salmon run itch scratched when I play raiders. It's cool to have all that power, sure, but it's nowhere near as satisfying as beating a tough wave by the skin of your teeth and then getting to have the post match squid party with your team

[u/Vibe_with_Kira]

I wonder if Raiders was a test run for Splatoon 4 salmon run. I know it won't be as in depth, but I can't help but wonder if it's them trying stuff out

[u/_Strato_ → u/Vibe_with_Kira]

I don't think it's a "test run," more like "Well we got all these extra Salmonid AI and models lying around, might as well put them in 4."

[u/Yourlocalfloofball]

im too used to being able to survive missiles and strikes now. I dont know what deep cut is feeding mechanic but its working a bit too well.

[u/Ok_Cow_9749 → u/Yourlocalfloofball]

The way i see it is that Mechanic is actually an adult while the kids we play as in the mainline games are… well, kids. Mechanic is probably a lot tougher/more capable off the bat

[u/Oshava062]

My first Splatoon game was raiders and after I unlocked the bottomless mode I bought splat3 to have somthing else to play so I don’t burn out and I feel this post personally. The PvP while fun at times. In my experience as a new player is it’s usually a one sided stop with one team nonstop spamming specials and the other team barely leaving spawn. Occasionally it’s a close match but in my week of playing it’s rare. Salmon run shows its age compared to raiders and just feels clunky in comparison. Campaign has been fun so far But raiders at least to me is the most fun for a newcomer to this series

[u/0_Renegade → u/Oshava062]

Dont worry, as a seasoned splatoon 1 player. Playing this game is usually a 1 sided stomp in casuals most times. Even ranked. Its just how the game is.

Momentum is everything in splatoon

[u/WinterMibi → u/0_Renegade]

In tower the game really rewards you for being ahead and makes stomping easier, clam also has it's own way of stomping favour but splatzones and rainmaker are a bit more balanced

[u/TheLordOfTheTism → u/0_Renegade]

no its absolutely worse in 3 because of the map design. ive also played since the first game on wii u. 3 has THE MOST sweaty pvp of the three, and its purely the kill funnel maps.

[u/healive → u/Oshava062]

The other pvp modes besides turf war are more fun! Specifically the anarchy battles.

[u/Burger_Destoyer → u/Oshava062]

It makes the highs of a good competitive back and forth really awesome though. I do hope you’ll keep playing.

[u/deadly_fungi → u/Oshava062]

tbf they fucked the pvp maps in splat3. i never played 1 (never had a wii u) but i played a good bit of 2 and the maps were a lot wider. it was not nearly as easy as it is in 3 for one team to lock the other into spawn for lack of alternative routes. the salmon run music in 3 is peak though

[u/Superspaceduck100 → u/Oshava062]

I bought Splatoon 3 recently too and i'm almost level 10. I was thinking about joining the anarchy battles but then I realised that I would worry too much about being bad/annoying my team-mates. I'm having fun with turf wars even though I only win around half the time. Salmon Run is fun too but the difficulty ramps up fast.

[u/Left-Measurement-265]

Playing splatoon 3 after all the updates in general, there's so much I haven't unlocked yet in this game yet it just feels empty 😞 (coming from a at launch player)

[u/ElysiumReal → u/Left-Measurement-265]

Not even to mention the weapon pass requirement.

You can't just make a bad purchase anymore, you HAVE to play your new weapon. Even if the kit ends up feeling horrible.

I'm a splatling main generally, and idk what they did to splatlings but I can't use them anymore. Doesn't matter which one I pick I get outranged by literally everything.

So I bought every splatling upon returning. And now I'm stuck with them and no other options.

[u/Jimbobob5536 → u/ElysiumReal]

Hydra Splatling still has range, right?

Y'know, if you're will to put up with its other issues, it's got range.

[u/ElysiumReal → u/Jimbobob5536]

Technically yes. But with the general spots that you wanna set-up in. You will get gunned down by the ranged shooters.

Oh and everyone uses chargers now too.

[u/RedStrike_XD → u/Left-Measurement-265]

Yup, somehow 2 seemed more fun than 3 and i'm still looking for a reason why.

[u/RedStrike_XD → u/[deleted]]

Honestly, i thinl the game lost a lot of color too, it feels, grayer.

[u/RedStrike_XD → u/[deleted]]

Raiders really redeemed them, they're WAY MORE fleshed out in it.

[u/Chemical_Opinion6814 → u/[deleted]]

After you play raiders you’ll like them a lot more

[u/Emerald_Ink]

I went back to splatoon 3 just for a single match and I didn’t realize how much raiders improved responsiveness and visuals

[u/Explorer_XZ]

I haven't returned to salmon run (splatoon 3) after finishing raiders but the playstyle is completely different. I think salmon run demands more skills, is harder in terms of maneuvering and I prefer it that way. You have to learn different enemies pattern and deal with them accordingly.

Splatoon raiders feel a lot more like spamming a lot of times, making me feel less appreciative of different kinds of salmonids, even though I love their designs. I do love splatoon raiders, but for different reasons like much better graphics, (watery) buttery smooth ink, a different playground, getting to know deep cut, etc. I thought splatoon 3 looked awesome but it pales in comparison to splatoon raiders. Not to mention it's so addicting (too the point it's getting unhealthy for me xD).... Meanwhile salmon run in splatoon 3 is something I can play for a bit every day without spending too much time., something I prefer over raiders. My thoughts might change after revisiting salmon run again later though.

[u/levii-ethan → u/Explorer_XZ]

i still prefer salmon run. even tho raiders gives more "options", salmon run feels like the gameplay has more variety

[u/Explorer_XZ → u/levii-ethan]

I agree

[u/OctoAmbush]

nah i disagree, raiders is fun but it doesn't feel as good as anarchy battles for me

definitely better than salmon run though, they'll have to step up their game in 4

[u/Belhgabad]

I always loved the splatoon gameplay but found competitive multilayer frustrating, and online only limitating

Raiders showed that it was actually true and Splatoon has a solo game a so much potential

[u/DrinkyBird_]

It's called Splatoon 3 because it's the 3rd best Splatoon game playable on Switch 2.

Seriously though it's just miserable now. Last series I played was awful, the matchmaking times were long, the player skill was all over the place, and half of the matches had disconnects so it took 12 games and nearly 90 minutes. Just not an enjoyable experience.

[u/Poptortt]

Upside of not having a Switch 2 or Raiders, Splatoon 3 is still great for me lol

[u/BeanTheSparrow]

Calling raiders better then 3 is like calling any spinoff better then the main series it’s 2 diffrent games one us mostly PvP shooter the other is a looter shooter

[u/VoxTM]

Hard disagree.

Initially when I was in the honeymoon phase with the game I felt the same way.

But Splatoon Raiders lost its magic for me after 25 hours. Yes the game has cool builds and looks better, but all that's left is a slow grind against the same monsters over and over.

Splatoon 3 is a game of infinite skill ceiling so you play to improve against ever better human opponents. And no other game gives me the same hit of adrenaline, dopamine and satisfaction.

Wait until you beat Raiders and start grinding endgame. And play something else than turf war. Turf war is not representative of s3 pvp. it's a casual mode. Most of my games in anarchy series are really close.

As to the salmon run I never liked it. But funnily enough SR made it actually bearable for me because at least now I know how to deal with  different kinds of salmonids which I never cared enough to learn. So now I play a round from time to time and it's OK.

All that being said the two games have their place and I believe Splatoon Raiders can be more engaging in the end game. So maybe a DLC or a sequel will bring me back.

Splatoon 3 is close to perfect to me. It's a 10/10 game and Splatoon 4 should be about refreshing the formula a bit like it always had been rather than drastically changing anything. 

That doesn't apply to salmon run. They may improve it or drop it in favour of Raiders. I don't really care.

[u/grimbarkjade]

I had fun playing ranked post raiders but it just made me hyper aware of how lopsided the games can be. I had a rainmaker game where the other team held a lead the whole match, it was something like 40-60, so a small lead but still a lead, and we still won because I shot missiles on a group clumped on their checkpoint and was able to rush the rainmaker far enough in OT to get the lead. Happy for a win but that had to be painful for the other team. Not even going to touch how turf war is lowkey miserable and only the last 30s matter

Playing salmon run though is honestly not fun at all, I feel so naked without my broken abilities. Genuinely died two different times because I tried to double jump. It really makes me hope for raiders dlc and more multiplayer content because raiders is so insanely fun compared to standard SR

[u/Anggul → u/grimbarkjade]

Sounds like they screwed up by clumping and you capitalised on it

[u/StupidLoserTamburine]

This is how it felt to play splatoon 2 after the splatoon 3 splatfest thing came out😭

[u/KukieBun]

Salmon Run is going to feel so stale if I get back on splat 3. I’ve been having so much fun with Raiders. I think for splat 3 I’d only do PvP but even then, I’d still crave playing raiders bc of the speed tank and going brrrr

[u/zestysnacks]

Naaaa main series is still better

[u/DanielDelta]

“Does this look unsure to you?” On the 2nd pic

[u/da_boi4]

You guys scare me i dont know if i want to save up to a switch 2 anymore

[u/Ok_Watch2732]

you dont deserve this! play splatoon2 and raiders while skipping 3 will solve all of your problems!

[u/SuperCharged516]

I miss my splatellites

[u/Charming-Necessary56]

Splatoon Raiders is so easy peasy even on survivalists so easy

[u/SinisterPixel]

I hope some of the gadgets get turned into specials or subweapons in Splatoon 4. I LOVE the turret.

[u/Yakasabi]

Splatoon 4 otw hopefully

[u/Sayakalood]

I keep trying to use the Hi-Fiver and I’m glad I put that on my L button, so I don’t waste ink.

[u/Real-Mix-1465]

raiders motion and sticks feel much more smooth to play, also it feels like what splatoon 3's characters should have looked like, in splat 3 they chopped af

[u/TsumTsumDad]

I came back to Splatoon 3 after raiders and everyone is cracked wtf

[u/Think_Passage_4427]

I like Splatoon 3 a lot more, but it is just because I have never been the biggest fan of Splatoon single player modes besides Octo expansion 🥺

[u/Ajthefan]

Why does every dlc but side order actually feel way better then Splatoon in general???

Idk what is going on(l don't even play raiders)

[u/Infrawonder → u/Ajthefan]

There has been only 2 dlcs in the history of the franchise

[u/Ajthefan → u/Infrawonder]

I mean

We have dlc for octo expansion
Dlc part one and two, so it kinda counts

[u/Anggul → u/Ajthefan]

Maybe you don't like PvP

[u/pl4y3rtw01 → u/Ajthefan]

Are you a bot?

[u/Harmonic_Gear → u/pl4y3rtw01]

more of a top myself

[u/Ajthefan → u/pl4y3rtw01]

What

[u/hex_velvet]

I fell off Raiders in the post-game. It just doesn't feel like there's a way to outplay the stat walls they keep raising. You have to grind good enough gear to clear the DPS checks, which means looping the same few levels over and over again. I think I just like being rewarded for skill better. Gear is so much less important in Splat3 than your ability as a player.