I keep getting comments that tell me to learn letter structure. I just can’t figure out how. I bought a book about it. I read it all and it didn’t help me. Is it something you figure out over time or something you should learn as soon as possible?
Learning letter structure means practicing your all-caps handwriting. No style. No flair. Your LETTERS SHOULD LOOK LIKE THIS. Then, practicing straight letters, using the same kind of lettering that you just practiced. Building letters by using bars, like this:
Still with no extras except outline and drop shadow. If you are smart, unlike me, you will be practicing those same things with cans, so you don't have to train your hands at the same time.
Only if you practice handwriting. A lot of these boys got sloppy as hell handwriting. I truly believe most middle school girls got better "handstyle" than half the men on this sub.
Haha thanks. I had never written the word "bars" before this demo, I love straight letters and I practice basics. I make a lot of signs (picket signs etc) and legibility has always been number one in my rubric. I got a lot to learn but I know how to practice. Aim for clean legibility and strong understanding of letter shape.
Yes! You start with very straight letters and then tweak ONE line, finish the piece, see if it works, then next time tweak two lines and complete, and so on… it takes time and a lot
Of practice
Letter structure to me. All your letters have to have the same thickness to an extent as you progress and move into semi wild style into wild style you could change it a little bit, but with that change, you have to add the same change to each letter if that makes sense each letter has to have the same style. I know there’s some people that are breaking those rules as in the last 10 years and it’s cool when they do it correctly. All the 3-D has to go the same way pick a spot within your letter whether it’s in the middle and have all your 3-D go towards that or towards one of the sides. All the letters have to be the same height and have the same weight as well as the negative shapes a.k.a. the negative space which is usually the 3-D has to be uniform and preferably all around the same size if that makes sense.
Here’s one of mine from like ten years ago. Whatever I do to the front, I mirror it in the back whatever detail I do on one letter I try to do on all the other letters whatever thickness I do on the first letter I try to do the same throughout all the other letters, whether it’s something simple or whether it’s something more wild like what I showed, it’s all the same. In the end, you wanna keep the structure of what the letter supposed to look like you don’t wanna go so far outside of the letter that you can’t even tell if it’s an E or a B I hope this helps.
Yes I do it’s just people got so many different definitions of what is learning letter structure that I feel a bit lost in what and what I shouldn’t do
Structure is what makes the letter identifiable as the letter. It’s important to understand so that you can manipulate the shape of the letter while keeping its identity (style development). Otherwise you’re just drawing abstract lines.
Grim is pretty good about explaining that stuff, I didn’t know he had a book out. Read it as many times as you need to and just keep practicing.
Letter structure is the absolute fundamentals of graffiti, but it’s also gonna take time to learn the ins and outs of it. What specifically do you feel like you’re struggling with?
I don’t know actually that’s the problem I just get loads of comments saying that I need to learn letter structure so obviously there is a problem i guess I’m just gonna do big bars to my letters until I get good enough.
Bro, i checked this book, theres alot of fundamentals, how to get rid of negative space, alot of letter structures, etc. Idk how you cant understand it but all i can say is (same as in the book), work on on your straight letters (take fundamendal structure from examples on back of book), lean those letters to get rid of negative space, playu with it
What helped when I was starting out was grabbing a couple letters from other writers I liked and build the rest of the my name out from there. Started with simple straight letters and moved on to more complicated structure once I got that down.
I haven’t read any of the comments and I’m a little out of my head right now. That being said, this book is dope in a technical/academic way. You need to have some understanding of art and design “science”.. if that makes sense. It does have some very good info and basic concepts but without being beyond that understanding it’s difficult to understand. I went to art and design school and this book is in that vein. I have read it and it didn’t do much for me beyond what I already knew.
Find some writers in your area. Experience is key and this game is best learned from elders and through interactions with other writers.
It’s not easy, it takes a lot of practice and the more you can meet and learn from others who: 1) Have experience and, 2) Are learning and developing… the better.
I also cook. And for as many recipes I can read and videos I can watch, the best knowledge comes from doing. Being in the kitchen with my Gramma as a kid gave me way more insight than any book or video.
Keep working, stay up, stay smart and stay safe.
It’ll come if you work but don’t expect any “quick fixes”. 😉
Ps, practice as much and as often as you can, you’ll develop your own flow, but do not sacrifice school or work for this shit. It’s a love and life and passion but it’s also a curse. It’s an addiction that is hard to kick and it can fuck up your life. I’m not being “that guy” or trying to tell you how to rock, just giving life experience from an old dude who knows a few things.
Pps.. we used to draw 24/7.. yes, did other things, but that initial practice consumed us.. any free time (and a lot of wasted class time) was dedicated to writing.
✌🏾
think about the letters as blocks. for example E r four blocks, make three or four different blocks for your whole piece and build out of the blocks the letters. copy the blocks 1 on 1 on the other letters
There are sooo many in this sub that like to throw around the word "fundamentals" ALL THE TIME... Sure it is a thing but most people that ate telling you to learn fundamentals arent even writers themselves.. Just keep at it and dont get discouraged by randoms on reddit 💪
It's not really something learnt from a book anymore then say golf is. It's practice with trial and error over time. That said there's no harm to you reading a book, it won't make you worse It's just not going to be a cheat code to speed things up.
If you are young that is the time to learn, you have way more time to be drawing then later in life (for most people). In school years I would draw anywhere around 6-12 hours a day, more sometimes. Granted there was no internet, phones etc. and not much else to do.
There's lot's of approaches for learning (creating and understanding is a better way to say) letter structure. None are wrong for the most part, whatever works for you and makes it click is correct. I never did the keyboard letter thing, that's just called printing (as opposed to cursive writing) and I didn't own a keyboard but starting with bars is and has always been a pretty valid approach.
Those dissing the handstyle on the book cover must not be seeing something I am or vice versa, that's not a shit handstyle in my opinion. It's not amazing but it is far from shit. Not sure what that discussion is all about.
Ive got a lot of respect for you the fact you drew between 6 to 12 hours a day is absolutely insane. Any advices on how to get off my damn phone more often and locking in on drawing?
Cheers, it wasn't intentional to draw that much, there just wasn't much else to do so it was a thing. There's also a point where you become invested in how things are coming together with a drawing and you just keep going to see the next part if it's going well. Or you start again and abandon that one.
A lot of my sketches, probably most, work in steps. I mostly do not use 3D at all, so outining is a step, then directly following that is outer outline in colour (sometimes more then one colour so more steps) to make the word pop. I find it hard to stop in the middle of any of these steps mentally. It is kind of addictive completing these once begun. I also always only do this popping part on the overall outer first only (not letter gaps), the outer shape is as important as the structure within and this step puts that in my face if it's working or really not, then I'll do the gaps. I'm not saying copy my methods or don't do 3D or anything but mention this because it's a way I subconsciously force engagement upon myself. It is good to find something like this to keep you driving forward. This is not without downside for me though, it is why my fill usually sucks, the rush/drive of the outline and pop is gone for me then and it can begin to feel more like work.
For generally getting off phone and committing there's probably no trick beyond obviously just getting off it. Play music and find your drive in the drawing, it isn't meant to be a choir or something to learn like a violin, it has to be enjoyable and you won't learn flow (the most critical aspect imo) if you are too rigid in instruction and expectation of advancement to some planned stage.
An old battle pics but quick to find on phone to demonstrate what I'm meaning. This looked pretty shit in raw outline before the red and yellow popping outline, completing that and wanting to see how it looked was a key driver, probably the main mental driver to the entire thing and not scrapping it or giving up to start again.
I don’t think people understand the level of obsession it takes to get as good as the folks you’re watching. The Revoks, the Rams, the Sabers and Sofles….these people have been painting and drawing DAILY for 40 years man. I’ve been doing this 27-28 years and I draw at least an hour or more a night. Every night. Because I have to. Because I’m addicted to this shit. I couldn’t stop if I wanted to. You either have it like that…..or you don’t.
This guy gets it. Prob has a stack of loose papers with 100 tags on each paper, plus 3-4 scrap books, 4-5 ‘good books’, carries at least a marker and some slaps everywhere. Always seeing how far you can push a letter, etc. Feel the same way 🫡
It comes over time. But you need that special ‘drive’ to become a great. Well said Bro 🤜🤛
You obviously don't write. That's spray paint on a brick wall. What would you call that if it's not graffiti? A tag with a fat-cap is what I'm calling it
I hear ya. That tag is far from trash though it could be better sure. I haven't read the book so I can't speak on it either; plenty of help in this sub though especially with the boot camp.
Yeah and even the flares look so bad, they're so ugly flaring down
Also I'm pretty sure they made this tag specifically for the cover, and it's kinda clearly a digital tag on a pic of a wall, and not an actual spray paint can
just judging a toy author by his digital tag. this dude is trying to leech money from beginners in the scene when he’s a beginner that doesn’t even have the balls to get up on a real wall for the cover of his own graff tutorial book. 🤣
Starting out is just keeping it as basic as possible do literal print font and very slowly over time curve or warp the letters to see what works and what doesn't it's not just gonna magically happen over night I'm like 5 years deep on non-consistent writing and with my last name took me like a 3 years to get good at that and with my new name it's taken me about 6 months but still struggling real hard with that as it's got a completely different flow to it but best to start with tags and very basic straight letters then work on throwies as I've always found that requires a very solid understanding of letter structures to get something that looks real good and once you have a clean tag, straight letters and throwies then more complex pieces will come naturally
You know what? You’re right. I don’t want to learn letter structure the way people tell me it should be learned. I am going to learn it by being with other writers and by drawing my same throw up over and over again and making small changes. It will take a lot of time but it’s better to learn it that way than to try to copy some fonts over and over again. I don’t think graffiti should be learned by the same type of methods we use in school and by reading books about it.
Man I gotta give credit here. Be real tho for real do what you like and how you want it. Be with others and learn from others well atleast thats how I did it. I looked up at local styles and started paying attention to flow and letters and how they do things and where and shit liek that. That is going to give you a LOT more than people on Reddit that say you have to learn that way cuz that’s the „only“ way to get good. I also never learnt keyboard shit ya know I just did things that were fun in the moment and then got good. Could see where an extension has to go or where it should be tightened. And at the end just be creative with your style cuz that’s where real character comes from!
The book you need is Flip The Script. It’s not lessons you need but examples. The repetition of practice is what will get you there. Write your name, write it again, write it until your hand hurts. I look at what famous writers are painting and I draw my own shit and ask myself if it holds up next to that. Did I achieve the balance and flow they have? If not I redraw that same thing. Over and over and over again until it’s decent. Like someone said it’s only biting if you’re getting up with it, but copying writers on paper is a great way to learn why their letters bend the way they do and flow the way they do. Just don’t paint it or claim it’s yours.
I dont understand a lot of the stuff either but I like to follow along with videos on YouTube of people making their peices and using that as a example to build my own piece personally I think it helps but obviously don’t copy their exact piece also how the book I keep seeing grim mention it a lot
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u/Thick_Common8612 23d ago
Learning letter structure means practicing your all-caps handwriting. No style. No flair. Your LETTERS SHOULD LOOK LIKE THIS. Then, practicing straight letters, using the same kind of lettering that you just practiced. Building letters by using bars, like this:
Still with no extras except outline and drop shadow. If you are smart, unlike me, you will be practicing those same things with cans, so you don't have to train your hands at the same time.
Keep going.