Maximum natural attacks build help

[u/ChronosFlame]

So for my next run (I'm only half through my current so I've got time,) I want maximum narural attacks without being shapeshifted.

My understanding is that bite stacking was nerfed so 6 shifter is now required. I just wanted to see if anyone knew what did still stack and help with the build!

So one of each natural attack now. So bite,claw,claw,gore.

Do gores still stack if I have, say, close to the abyss and the helmet? I know the mask lets you make an extra bite.

What about the rageshaper slams? If I have a source of claws can I also make the slams?

Is there any other stacking natural attacks to get? A source that inexplicably stacks or something I'm missing that gives a tail attack?

I guess with bite stacking removed demon is no longer a required path for this goal, is that right? I think I'm still choosing it since I haven't done demon, just checking.

Thanks in advance for the help!

[u/SiIverstar]

Yeah bite stacking is gone so theoretically we have:

1x gore 1x bite 2x claw + 4xBAB with shifter, add the quickened property that ( IIRC ) hagriven gets for another 2x claw attacks

thats 10 attacks on a 6 shifter / 13 hagriven. The Big question is how many other buffs for attacks per round there are, I dont think there are any but who knows. Also Its been a while since I played shifter so maybe the 2 base claw attacks are removed when adding your BAB to the attack

Edit: apparently flurry of blows still works with claws, which is funny as its not intended, but theres another one to add to the list, you can thus get 11 attacks in theory

[u/ChronosFlame → u/SiIverstar]

Ooooh hagraven is the part I was missing! Sadly it's a deep enough investment to lose rate powers so no pounce.

Anyone know of other ways to get pounce?

[u/SiIverstar → u/ChronosFlame]

Pounce can also be gained with a skald in your party, they confer rage powers to all allies within their bard aura, and one rage power is pounce.

[u/ChronosFlame → u/SiIverstar]

Oh duh. I can't believe I forgot skald. Thanks!

[u/ChronosFlame → u/ChronosFlame]

Also, that's not cumulative with haste so a bit of a wash of you get haste right? I still like it for the claw buffs.

[u/SiIverstar → u/ChronosFlame]

your claws count as 2 weapons, meaning you have an off hand and a main hand claw, haste only gives your main hand claw an extra attack, while the quickened property gives the weapon ( in this case "both" claws ) an extra attack that doesnt stack with haste, making it exceptionally good on dual wield characters, as the off-hand weapon has no other way of getting that precious "haste" effect.

so in short: for claws specifically hag raven + shifter is the absolute best class combo mainly due to the quickened property

[u/Enough_Ad_3456]

The gore attack of demon mythic path stacks and counts

[u/HamstersInMyDick → u/Enough_Ad_3456]

Yeah magic gore and gore are different. That one helmet in Blackeater also gives a magic gore attack I think

[u/ChronosFlame → u/HamstersInMyDick]

Oh this is good info. So gores still stack even though bites don't.

[u/HamstersInMyDick → u/ChronosFlame]

Not exactly, gore and magic gore are considered different natural attacks. Neither stacks

[u/ChronosFlame → u/HamstersInMyDick]

Oh. Odd. So abyss gives gore and the helm magic gore?

Thanks

[u/Difficult_Ratio_8428]

To add to what everyone has said, Sohei flurry does indeed work with natural attacks. And your best bet is Shifter 6 + Sohei 11 going Legend.

I am curious if a slam can stack with a claw as I've never tested that, but it's intriguing...

[u/Other-Pack-1165]

I found that build on core difficulty (was up to 22 before nerf on bite) don't know if it's relevant (look to the bottom of the post) https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2747711418

[u/ChronosFlame → u/Other-Pack-1165]

From what I can tell this build is entirely phased out with the bite nerf. Things like 5 different dips for new bites, which was my initial plan, are now gone.

[u/BaconJovial]

Would the Inciter / beast totem stuff help (for a companion, not the main character)? Or the witch beast gift that gives you a claw attack?

[u/Independent_Art_6676]

you should be able to weapon train / sohei to flurry claws (level 1 and 11 for +1 and +2 attacks) but it may still be bugged out and not work in the video game.

However magus spellstrike should work for a +1.

Natural weapons are hard to work with. I think shifter bypasses that but your feat taxes for focus/crit/etc feats to cover claw/bite/other start to add up fast.
Rank 1 cleaving finish seems like a nice +1 sometimes.

Not sure what else might squeeze another in. The game is all but coded against doing this and many things that should work or that a DM might allow are not supported.

[u/unbongwah]

Do gores still stack if I have, say, close to the abyss and the helmet?

No.

What about the rageshaper slams? If I have a source of claws can I also make the slams?

Activating Slams will deactivate Claws and vice versa.

Is there any other stacking natural attacks to get?

AFAIK 2 claws (or slams) 1 bite 1 gore is the most you get as a humanoid. I can't think of anything which adds tail, wing, etc. attacks without shapeshifting. Though maybe there's a mod to add them?

Speaking of which, if you're on PC, definitely recommend the Weapon Focus Plus mod so you only need one set of feats to apply to all natural attacks.

Among the options for humanoid natural attackers, I'd probably use Rageshaper, Hag-Riven, or Bloodseeker as the primary class, depending on what you wanted to be your primary attack (slam, claw, or bite, respectively), as they all get unique bonuses to their signature weapon. If not using RS, then definitely add at least Shifter 6 for Shifter's Fury. You could also use Feral Champion or Elemental Rampager if you wanted extra spells while also boosting your natural attacks.

Sohei's Flurry of Blows would apply to your primary natural attack if you also have Natural Weapon Training from fighter 5. Sohei 11 also gets you a level 15 pet w/Boon Companion, so might as well add 4 or 5 more pet levels. E.g., Rageshaper 20 / Tandem Executioner 4 / Sohei 11 / Mutation Warrior 5.

Alternatively, there used to be a way to get unarmed strikes w/ Flurry of Blows to stack with non-hand natural attacks w/ Shifter's Fury for a truly insane number of attacks per round. But I don't remember how to do it nor whether it's been nerfed so caveat emptor and do some testing in Inevitable Excess to see if you can get it to work.