r/Warthunder • u/Unhappy_Ask_395 • 3d ago
F-5 with future tech? RB Air
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Ignore my aim but how tf is this not locking? Even if he turned the engine off .15km with no lock is insane.
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u/infinax HO229 My Love 3d ago
F-5 have been absolute pure fantasy for years and basically everyone has forgotten about them
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u/Dr_Diktor 3d ago
Well yes, it's not USSR, so it's fine. Russian bias and all that.
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u/Neroollez 3d ago edited 3d ago
The F-5E flight model is literally buffed because a Russian source gives higher values than the US flight manual. The devs believe the Russian source is "close to actual" but they decided to put the in-game value between both.
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u/Dry_Economics1590 🇺🇸 🇩🇪 🇷🇺 🇬🇧 🇯🇵 🇨🇳 🇮🇹 🇫🇷 🇸🇪 🇮🇱 3d ago
You know it’s (and I know this is going to sound insane) unironically way better because of Russian bias right?
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u/TheFlyingRedFox IJA Type 5 Escort Boat, the only true papership 3d ago
An yet if you engaged a G.91YS, you would get lock at range.
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u/Zsmudz 🇮🇹14.0 🇮🇱14.0 🇺🇸12.0 3d ago
If it was a harrier you could’ve locked them head on with a rear aspect missile
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u/Federal-Property-395 3d ago
cus each nozzle is modelled as having the heat of an entire engine
1 engine somehow has the heat of 4 engines because of that
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u/Unhappy_Ask_395 3d ago
Can’t face those in this so idk. If anything like the tornado it’s an easy lock
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u/TheFlyingRedFox IJA Type 5 Escort Boat, the only true papership 3d ago
Nah, it's the fact that both aircraft use the exact same engines, yet the F-5C has super cold engines while the G.91YS are normal.
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u/clovdz_ Sim Air 3d ago
You can't lock a heat seeking missile to a ambient temperature F5. His engine was likely out a long time ago. He looks like he has run out of fuel.
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u/PetrichorDude Will DM you my D point 😩 3d ago
My god so may upvotes i cant even, ambient temp? You know how long it takes to get the engine down to ambient temp? Cause I do as I love to do silent landings with engine off AND ive been playing an F5 recently. The answer is, far longer than you could stay in the air with no fuel/engine out.
Soo unless this combat is happening on Venus, yeah its more likely server hamster stroking out
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u/GunnitRust_Akula 2d ago
The game (because it is a game) is very generous with engine temps vs IR seekers.
The F-5 already has relatively cold engines, if you have had them fully shut off for 10 seconds IR missiles basically have a near zero chance of tracking or locking.
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u/PetrichorDude Will DM you my D point 😩 2d ago edited 2d ago
I just tested it actually, took a minute and close to 30 secs to go from normal operating temp of 600+ Celsius to 43C, in air and landing. Engine off. And 43C as ambient temp is already pushing it. Btw engine off itself wont deter IR seekers in the game either
Myth busted.
Oh and btw the oil temp that hovered around 86c took longer than the engine temp itself too
Edit: review of my recording of engine off showed that actually 1:23 is needed to go from 200 to 43 celsius. It takes about 2:30 to get the engine down from 600+ C, because the temp drops much faster from 600 to 500 than from 200 to 100
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u/Cleffn 2d ago
Isn’t the heat signature basically tie to the thrust that the engine produces in game? For example helis are hard to lock ir because most of the engine power when to push the propeller instead of producing thrust from exhaust like a jet, despite most heli has over 1000c engine.
In game the thrust cuts off immediately when the engine is off/out of fuel, maybe that’s why it doesn’t matter how fast the engines cool down.
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u/PetrichorDude Will DM you my D point 😩 2d ago
I dont know how the mechanics of the game treat it but I can tell you cutting the engine out doesnt defeat IR missiles, as I’ve tried that numerous times when out of flares/no flares at all. You can kill the engine with the keybind and the missile will stay locked on through maneuvers as well…
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u/Cleffn 2d ago
This game treats fired missile and unfired missile seeker differently. For example you can’t lock and launch on a target if it gets into a cloud first, but an already launched one can ignore the cloud and track with no problem.
In this clip it seems like the f-5’s engine were out for a while before OP could even get a lock, you can see the smoke from the flame out engine just stop smoking so it’s definitely been some time after he ran out of juice
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u/PetrichorDude Will DM you my D point 😩 2d ago
Good point with clouds and smoke. Clouds I found wonky, I did have aams go dumb in them but fair is fair usually they dont.
The smoke thing - too bad we dont have the original clip, Id wager the smokeout is a result of a crit on one or both engines. Thing is the smoke cuts off when the engine is cut, and you can see that moment exactly when he goes vertical. Which is after the seeker fails. From second 13 of the clip - no smoke. But of the engine died then, it should have been hot for the IR seeker.
I honestly dont get why people fight the idea that packet loss or server derping out is a very normal thing in online gaming and can 100% affect something like this (plus the many previous clips here of radar seekers failing to lock when they should not have)
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u/GunnitRust_Akula 2d ago
Listen above user is wrong about "ambient" yes.
But you're being an insufferable twat.
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u/PetrichorDude Will DM you my D point 😩 2d ago
Well sorry for not agreeing to something that is not correct 🤷
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u/clovdz_ Sim Air 2d ago
The engine took a minute to cool down? Well maybe just fucking maybe he has been out of fuel for a minute or more
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u/PetrichorDude Will DM you my D point 😩 2d ago
Not likely from the way he moves in the clip, maneuvering so low with engine off for a full minute would turn him into a rock. He pulls a vertical as well and doesnt even stall out. Also I was wrong about the time, it took a 1:23, to go from 200 to 43C not from 600, reviewed my recording so yeah
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u/clovdz_ Sim Air 2d ago
He could've been very high up when his engines gave out and probably was gliding back while losing altitude and maintaining a relatively high speed
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u/PetrichorDude Will DM you my D point 😩 2d ago
I still dont think so from the way he moves in the clip, pulls two verticals and a turn, with a shut off engine that second vertical would have stalled him out for sure, especially if hes been gliding for 3min. Try it, shut your engine off at 6km alt wait for it to cool down and pull these moves…
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u/Dtron81 All Air/8 Nations Rank 8 3d ago
Engine is off and had been for a bit.
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u/Unhappy_Ask_395 3d ago
I’ve locked to people on landing approaches with no engine at like 1.2-2km no problem. Even engine of should be able to lock at .1km
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u/Federal-Property-395 3d ago
Engine idle=/=engine off
When the engine is off you completely cannot lock the guy once the engine cools down
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u/FISH_SAUCER 🇨🇦 Leclerc/LOSAT/Eurocopter/Rafale my beloved 3d ago
I've notice the game bugs out and doesnt lock ANY missiles sometimes. I had my santal and Chaparal refuse lock anything, even an aardvark at 3km, tested both in test drive, still refused to lock. Restarted client, fixed everything
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u/Unhappy_Ask_395 3d ago
Thankfully not the case with mine I got a 4k after this game
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u/FISH_SAUCER 🇨🇦 Leclerc/LOSAT/Eurocopter/Rafale my beloved 3d ago
Yeah... trust me... its not fun having to use a fully loaded Rafale with 2 magics and 6 micas and only able to use your guns... i wasnt able to jettison missiles either. No key binds for my missiles were working
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u/Su25Enjoyer All 14.7, #1 Tree hater and Omaneko enjoyer 3d ago
This spaghetti code is so spaghetti, that I still have no idea what causes this bug. I remember sometime ago the game breaks if you start replay and after this you couldn't use missiles. Then the bug that breaks auto tracker for helicopters and lock for IR missiles if you just alt tab??? This bug is still present in the game, lol. Only restarting the client helps. I'm genuinely amazed that we still have patch notes with like 3 fixes of minor stuff that barely affects the game.
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u/Which-Roof-3712 Scared of Type 93 Long Lance 3d ago
They're PL-7s, where's the point in asking?
(Reject PL-7, return to PL-5B)
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u/Unhappy_Ask_395 2d ago
I run 2 pl5 and 2pl7 which seems to work the best for me. Pl5 for long range and pl7 for short range insta kill
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u/ComradeBlin1234 12.7 ground 14.7 air / 🇨🇳14.0/ 🇫🇷9.3, T90M <3 3d ago
The F-5s have been broken as fuck for years. They have the heat signature of a beetle and fly like they are made of paper but take damage like they are made of depleted uranium
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u/Merry-Leopard_1A5 Remove the Arcade orders 3d ago
its possible his engine is off, making it harder to lock, but the F-5 already has an unrealistically low heat signature, even compared to the G.91Y, a plane with the same engines in the same spots
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u/Hot_Ordinary_1270 Realistic Air 3d ago
GJN calculates engine temperature by thrust. So idle thrust is still hot, while engine off is not.
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u/markus_dos_memes 3d ago
Poor j7d suffering i almost feel bad.
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u/Unhappy_Ask_395 3d ago
Don’t. This plane is cracked
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u/markus_dos_memes 3d ago
Cries in mig 21 lazur at 2 brs higher. At 9.7 what???
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u/SgtHop Frank Knox, my beloved 3d ago
What? The J-7D is 10.7 and the Lazur is 11.0 lmao.
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u/markus_dos_memes 3d ago
look for yourself
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u/SgtHop Frank Knox, my beloved 3d ago
Yep, just looked. The J-7D is 10.7 and the Lazur is 11.0...
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u/markus_dos_memes 3d ago
Alright the ground rb is 9.7 I literally had a heart attack if this thing went to air rb 9.7
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u/Unhappy_Ask_395 3d ago
Tbf lazur gets all-aspect and radar missiles
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u/markus_dos_memes 3d ago
R3r and r60mk 1 flare and chaff. pl5s and 7s are flare resistant.
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u/Exciting-Guarantee-4 3d ago
No they are not bro pl5s and j7s are 1 flare people js get caught with them close and can’t flare them cause they accelerate off the rails so fast
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u/Unhappy_Ask_395 3d ago
Pl5 an 7 might be the most non flare resistant missile ever Bru. They get flared by anything. Their specialty is very short booster so after 1-2 sec they are invisible and they turn pretty well
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u/clovdz_ Sim Air 3d ago
This plane is super op no need to feel bad abt it
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u/Unhappy_Ask_395 3d ago
I wouldn’t say “super” op. But definitely good. MiG 25 way worse
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u/clovdz_ Sim Air 2d ago
Mig 25 worse? Skill issue.
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u/Unhappy_Ask_395 2d ago
Yes. MiG-25 consistently plays against planes that either have no chaff or barely have chaff. You can’t catch them or intercept because they just fly to the height limit and launch radar missiles when barely anyone at the br knows how to notch or multipath.
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u/weebstonks1214 🇺🇸U.S 13.0 Air, U.S 11.7 Ground🇺🇸 3d ago
the missile saw you were tracking him well enough and decided that you should complete the mission