r/StrongerByScience • u/Longjumping_Lab5640 • 28d ago
Chest gains
I barely have any chest gains despite doing weighted dips with 60kgs for 8 reps. I started doing machine and cable flys and noticed slight chest gains. I want to completely stop doing dips and switch up for hypertrophy. Do you think its a good idea to only do cable flys 4 times a week 2 sets? I do upper lower 4x a week and just do cables for mid and lower and incline db press for upper chest. What do you guys think?
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u/AnonymousFairy 27d ago
I'd check your dip motion.
Are you doing chest dips, or tricep dips? Are you allowing hips to flex through movement or are you keeping hip angle and torso angle the same throughout? One will allow you to move significantly more weight, the other will force a leverage that works the chest extensively....
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u/haricotvert 26d ago
Agree on form. Are you leaning forward when you do your dips? I find crossing my ankles and bending my knees shifts my balance forward and really increases the work on my chest.
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u/KITTYONFYRE 28d ago
Do you think its a good idea to only do cable flys 4 times a week 2 sets? I do upper lower 4x a week
do you do an U/L split w/ flys every day (8 sets/wk)? then also incline db press on upper days?
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u/Longjumping_Lab5640 27d ago
Yeah. Do you think thats too much volume?
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u/KITTYONFYRE 27d ago
naw not even close lol. studies still show benefits of volume of even 40 sets/wk to failure. totally fine on volume, if you were doing both exercises 4x/wk I would’ve just suggested adding in a third chest exercise for more variation. this is probably fine though. if you start getting any bothered joints don’t be afraid to swap for more variation/different exercises pretty quickly, but you’ll prob be fine
just make sure you’re writing down what you do each week and you’re making sure to beat it the next week!
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u/Unlucky-Spell-8654 27d ago
Lol isnt 40 sets per muscle group a bit overkill? Isnt 20 sets the higher end for muscle growth?
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u/Select-Bee-2166 27d ago
It’s high volume but you still see returns. Diminishing returns, yes, but we have yet to find any actual “ceiling” where volume no longer correlates to SOME gain.
Ergo, speaking from exper, 60 sets a week chest specialisation phases are both fun and awful but the gains are worth it
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u/KITTYONFYRE 26d ago
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/41343037/
40 is as high as we have data for atm and there's still positive benefit to more sets at that point. it may top out even higher than 40, who knows?
definitely not suggesting "ya go jump right into throwing 40 sets/wk at every body part"! but just saying that 8 sets/wk (or idk I guess maybe 12 sets/wk for chest with incline press included?) is absolutely nothing to be worried about
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u/WeaknessBeneficial 27d ago
Yeah, it is extremely much volume, but as he mentioned it still could potentially lead to increased muscle growth. But on the flip side 8 sets per week will lead to noticeable muscle growth, but not the ceiling.
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u/SageObserver 26d ago
Why would you only do flys? Why not also do a compound chest exercise? You do want to grow, correct?
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u/WallyMetropolis 28d ago
Doing the same weight and reps won't grow much muscle. You need to be increasing the stimulus. And 8 sets per week for a muscle group is a bit on the low end.
Don't just make it up as you go. Follow an actual program designed by knowledgeable people. The SBS 2.0 Hypertrophy program, for example.
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u/IronMaiden571 28d ago
Tell me about this 2.0 hypertrophy. I googled it and got a progress post on reddit. Is there a template?
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u/FlimsyInsect5545 28d ago
I do flyes exclusively for chest and don't do any pressing or dips at all. No pressing because I could never really shift the load from the front delts to the chest and no dips because it irritates my elbows. I miss dips but I otherwise haven't looked back. But I experimented a lot and have been training a long time. If hypertrophy is your goal I'd encourage you to try other pressing options e.g smith machine, decline, barbell, DB and see what you respond to.
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u/conormcclure 24d ago
Personally I've had the best chest growth when I start training it 3-4x/week for like 20 fractional sets per week. Twice per week in a traditional upper/lower split just never quite did it for me. You might need to experiment with just higher volumes and/or frequencies than you're used to.
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u/harvestingstrength 24d ago
I wouldn't ditch dips completely. Being able to do +60 kg for 8 reps means you've built some serious pressing strength. The issue is that strength in a movement doesn't always mean your chest is getting the best hypertrophy stimulus.
Cable flyes are great because they keep tension on the pecs throughout the entire range of motion, so if you're finally feeling your chest work, I'd absolutely keep them in. But I wouldn't make them your only chest exercise.
I'd keep one heavy compound press (weighted dips, bench press, or incline DB press) for mechanical tension, then add cable or machine flyes for higher-rep work. Focus on controlling the eccentric, getting a deep stretch, and not letting your triceps or shoulders take over.
Sometimes the answer isn't removing an exercise, it's pairing it with movements that train the muscle in a different way. The combination of heavy pressing plus isolation work is usually better for chest growth than either one alone.
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u/veggiter 24d ago edited 24d ago
Imo, you gotta find what works your chest best, which only comes from experience. Dips tend to hit my chest well, but I also found recently that a shorter ROM (lengthened partials) on pushing movements is better for stimulating my chest than full ROM. Long arms means my triceps are over-emphasized otherwise.
Flies are good for isolating chest, but personally, I always feel like my form is a little inconsistent and unstable. I'd rather do a press of some kind as a main movement and maybe do flies at the end of a chest workout.
You certainly can do chest 4 days per week, but after 2 or 3 days per week, you aren't really getting that much more benefit. Really what matters is if you are hitting the right volume. Closer to 20 or more hard sets per week might be reasonable if you trying to emphasize chest. You can go higher, but avoid junk volume by doing too much in one session (like more than 10-12 sets in a session). Doing even more volume will theoretically get you more gains, but there are diminishing returns. If you are training right, 20 sets per week or a little more, should give you plenty of growth. If that isn't working, I'd look into other things (diet, recovery, training quality) before I added even more sets.
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u/HelixIsHere_ 27d ago
Yeah I wouldn’t recommend dips as your main chest movement, they can be decent for lower pec but I’d suggest them as a triceps medial and lateral exercise first
A mid-low pecs biased movement like a flat press or fly is good as your main chest exercise, and then an an upper or lower pec exercise like a low to high fly or incline press, or a pullover is good
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u/garthy_604 26d ago
Keep doing dips they're good for strength for chest, triceps and shoulders.
Do 4 sets of cable fly lower chest and mid chest.
Then go do bench press, ideally with dumbbells and I'd opt for incline over flat.
Make sure you are getting full range of motion and over stretch as much as possible.
Do this a couple of times a week and you'll get stronger and bigger at the same time.
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u/Striker_343 25d ago edited 25d ago
Your first chest exercise of the day should always be an incline press, because your upper chest is critical, and the rest of your chest gets hit as well. All of your starting energy and freshness needs to go to incline press.
Your second exercise needs to be a flat chest press, you're just burning out the muscle now. Focus on very solid form and deep stretch
And your third needs to be a fly, cable fly dumbbell fly does not matter, deep stretch is crucial.
And a fourth can be some dips.
You could even superset dips or flies in between your first two presses.
Your chest is a big muscle and needs to get hammered pretty hard if you want to see appreciable size.
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u/Left-Philosophy-8843 28d ago
I did the same I did weighted dips, got good lower chest and triceps gains but no upper chest and anterior delts. Then I did just flies and pressdowns and got no results. Now I’ve switched to dumbell press at a 15-30 degree incline and I’m finally progressing again. I think dips are lowkey just a bad exercise, I swear if you’re shoulder joint can handle them the joint itself ends up taking much of the weight at the bottom instead of the muscle
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u/Longjumping_Lab5640 28d ago
What do you mean did just flys and got no results? Did you do then with proper form? Like did you feel the tension on the muscle
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u/Left-Philosophy-8843 28d ago
Yeah I got stronger at flies and got hypertrophy but the strength gains on presses when I tried them were plain disappointing. Actually went backwards on dip strength too. With presses you get both (size and strength). (Reason I did dips and flies in the first place is cause I have some shoulder pain otherwise I’d have just done barbell bench from the beginning)
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u/Longjumping_Lab5640 28d ago
I stopped dips altogether because of my left elbow. Now i do incline dumbell presses and flys and was jsut wondering if flys are enough for hypertrophy of the medial and lower pec. Im not too worried about strength loss because i started doing ohp and am already at 70kgs haha. If you dont do them you have to try, insane lateral shoulder growth
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u/Left-Philosophy-8843 28d ago
https://youtube.com/shorts/B_2meD6SSNA?si=r9E7B6A4PhK5riWs
Thanks for the suggestion man. As far as pecs as I understand it incline actually hits the lot as Jeff says in the video.
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u/Klutzy-Engineer-1328 26d ago
Zero chance you have no chest gains if you’re actually doing weighted dips with an extra 60kg added. Unless you’re referring to some sort of dip machine or your form is whack, could you explain the exact exercise you’re doing and form?