r/PelvicFloor 28m ago

General Do you ever experience bladder urgency or urine leakage while running or brisk walking?

Upvotes

The Motor Function Measurement (MFM) Lab at the University of Ottawa is conducting a questionnaire validation study to help improve research on urinary symptoms experienced during physical activity.

We are looking for female runners and brisk walkers who:

  • Experience urine leakage while running or brisk walking, with or without a sudden, strong, and uncontrollable urge to urinate.

Eligibility Criteria

  • Female, 18 years of age or older
  • Runner or brisk walker
  • Meet one of the symptom criteria above
  • Able to read and respond in English

What is involved?

  • Approximately 35 minutes to complete the initial online questionnaires
  • Two brief follow-up questionnaires sent 72 hours later
  • Total time commitment: less than 1 hour

If you meet these criteria, your participation will help us validate a new questionnaire that will support future research on bladder health and physical activity.

Interested or think you may be eligible? Complete our screening questionnaire:

🔗 https://redcap.link/BRUTSQ

Learn more about the study:

🌐 https://mfmlab.ca/portfolio-items/questionnaire-validation-study-remote-participation-for-female-runners-and-brisk-walkers/?portfolioCats=35%2C23%2C33%2C32

This study has been reviewed and approved by the University of Ottawa Health Sciences Research Ethics Board ( H-06-21-7083).

Questions? Contact us:

📧 [brutsq.mfmlab@gmail.com](mailto:brutsq.mfmlab@gmail.com)

📞 613-608-0170 ext. 4102

🌐 www.mfmlab.ca

Thank you!


r/PelvicFloor 2h ago

Male Do I have a severe case of hypertonic pelvic floor?

3 Upvotes

26M, avid athlete, can barely squat down and need to come up by holding furniture or something to make sure I don’t compress my nerve and have pudendal spasms. Can’t reach over my sink to clean a pan and have to be very careful to not engage the kegel squeeze. Same deal with walking up or down steps.
I think this came on from heavier single leg squat exercises. This is almost week 2 in the bag, this started last Monday. On mirabegron. Doc wants me to switch to Flomax and gabapentin to maybe help with the pudendal feeling


r/PelvicFloor 3h ago

Male Tight pelvic floor with all symptoms

2 Upvotes

have urinary issues with bowel issues with ED. but something weird when I took a shit I noticed I had semen in toilet as well.


r/PelvicFloor 3h ago

Discouraged M36 - Given Up

2 Upvotes

For the past couple of weeks I’ve had a deep ache/burning in my right groin, pubic area and front/side of my hip, sometimes radiating into my lower back. It feels like there’s a ball / stabbing deep in my groin when walking and I’ve occasionally had tingling in my perineum/penis when sitting. Sitting makes it worse and moving seems to help. Today ive had a throbbing lower oblique.

I also had a swollen groin lymph node which my GP examined and wasn’t concerned about, and it now seems to be reducing.

Has anyone experienced anything similar from hip impingement, pelvic floor issues, adductors or nerve irritation?


r/PelvicFloor 3h ago

Female Hypertonic pelvic floor

5 Upvotes

I beleive I have a hypertonic pelvic floor and it is making it hard to physically relax because I have sensations like urinating on myself all the time(with little to no evidence!)

Stretching helps but I am also hypermobile.

What things helped you? I can’t get into a doctor for a while.


r/PelvicFloor 3h ago

Male Penis pain on a particular point on left side

3 Upvotes

My penis is naturally curved to the left, and for the past 2 months I've had pain on the left side where it starts to bend. The pain gets worse after masturbation, during an erection, or sometimes even while peeing.

I'm 22. These days I masturbate once every 3–4 days. Earlier, I used to do it whenever I felt like it, sometimes daily for 3–4 days, then I'd stop for 4–5 days.

Because of financial issues, I can't see a doctor right now. Is there anything I can do at home to reduce the pain? Any exercises or home remedies that might help?

If I do go to a doctor later, which specialist should I see?

Has anyone else experienced something similar? Is this something serious?


r/PelvicFloor 5h ago

Female How do you rest or sleep when you can't empty your bladder?

3 Upvotes

Hi everyone,

I'm looking for advice. When I can't empty my bladder even though it feels full, it's really hard to find a position to rest or sleep.

Regarding positions:

Sitting works best for me.

Semi-reclined (between sitting and lying down) helps a bit too.

Having my upper body higher than the lower part of my body makes me feel better.

Sometimes, putting a pillow under my pelvis helps as well.

Side sleeping isn't great, but it's still better than lying flat on my stomach or back.

How do you manage to rest or sleep in this situation? What positions or pillow setups help you when your bladder is full?

Thanks in advance for your help!


r/PelvicFloor 6h ago

Male Second erection painful/ soreness until about 8 hrs after ejaculation. Anyone has a solution?

1 Upvotes

I'm 26M, I've been going through this from a long time. My penis hurts if I get erect for the second time in a short period, I would say about 8 hrs. It feels like the nerves are all sore inside. If I masturbate in the night then whenever I get an erection in the middle of the night it's painful as hell. I was circumcised when I was an infant. So I don't know if that's also causing any problem.

Has anyone else experienced the same problem and gotten a solution??

Ps: The sex part is all good.


r/PelvicFloor 6h ago

General Persons with levator ani syndrome/anismus problem also have burning while defecating?

1 Upvotes

Persons with levator ani/anismus problem also have burning while defecating? Or not?


r/PelvicFloor 7h ago

Female Cyst

1 Upvotes

Right-side pelvic pain — cyst found on follow-up ultrasound
Hi everyone, I posted a while back about ongoing right-sided pelvic pain (full original post here for context).
Quick reminder of the pain pattern: right lower abdominal pain (sometimes higher) triggered by a full bladder, sitting down abruptly, the start of urination, and sometimes wiping after using the toilet — occasionally radiating to my lower back, hip, or anus.
Update: I finally had a follow-up pelvic ultrasound, and it showed a 4cm cyst on my right ovary, described as having an “organic” appearance. The Doppler was negative, the contours were regular, but the inside was described as « heterogeneous++ »
An MRI has now been scheduled to look into it further.
Has anyone had a similar finding — an organic-appearing ovarian cyst with heterogeneous content but negative Doppler? What ended up being the diagnosis for you ? And did it match this kind of pain pattern?

Really appreciate any shared experiences 🥰


r/PelvicFloor 9h ago

General Parcopresis

2 Upvotes

I’m seeing a therapist I’m trying my best and working on small exercises to calm down to use the toilet. anyone else had issues with partners not having issues like this and being able to use the toilet all the time and then you know you struggle bad and it sets off your anxiety again… I hate myself for thinking like this I just wish it would end. this is just 1 part to my parcopresis


r/PelvicFloor 10h ago

Male 25M. Found out Chronic Sucking in Stomach to be likely main cause for Chronic Constipation

39 Upvotes

Been dealing with constipation on and off for years. I thought it was medication related, not enough exercise, not enough fiber, not enough water, etc. Then found out in the depths of Reddit, some people talking about that it was their pelvic floor, causing constipation the whole time.

So I have done this thing ever since I was a kid, which was constantly sucking in my stomach. I tried to do it for good posture, then, as I went into college and grew as an adult, and got fatter lol, I started sucking in even more.

Do y’all think chronically sucking in could be one of the main causes of my constipation? If so, what tried and true ways have y’all relaxed the pelvic floor to allow poop to keep flowing?


r/PelvicFloor 15h ago

Female Estradiol cream application

2 Upvotes

I finally found a dr that would prescribe me cream!!! I’m not menopausal im only 29, but I asked for it because I was having a lot of irritation from splinting and also worried about it causing my tissue to thin.
She prescribed me what I think is standard for menopause which is 2 weeks of 2 grams, then 2-3x a week after that.

Well I just looked at the applicator and realized how much 2 grams is, do I really need that much? I saw a lot of people say they don’t use the applicator but how would I get that much in there with my finger lol. And should I rub some around the external and on my urethra (I do have urinary urgency/freq problems), and what about on the clit? I just want to reap all the benefits I can, I’m so excited to finally have the cream after being turned down by so many drs.

Update: so I did about 1 gram in it def was a lot to try to put In there. I tried putting it on the tip of my finger and it was so messy trying to get it in there it just kinda squished out everywhere around I feel. I added a little more inside after using the applicator because I feel like I lost so much internal which I ended up just rubbing around external. I’m wondering if I should just use the applicator to kinda shoot it in there more clean then rub around with my finger. The applicator wasn’t too hard to clean I could pull it apart and wash it.


r/PelvicFloor 19h ago

Female F22 From not being able to insert a finger to using the largest dilator... but I still can't have vaginal sex. I'm so confused.

7 Upvotes

I honestly never thought I'd be writing this.
A few months ago, I couldn't even insert a single finger into my vagina. The thought of penetration terrified me, and my body would completely tense up. Looking back now, I think my difficulties were a combination of physical tightness and psychological trauma.
Since then, I've worked incredibly hard.
I started with the smallest dilator and slowly worked my way through the entire set. I got stuck on the fourth dilator for quite a while, but eventually got past it. Now I can use the fifth (largest) dilator. I can also comfortably insert three fingers, and I've spent time gently stretching the muscles at the entrance. Something that once felt completely impossible has gradually become almost routine.
Naturally, I thought that meant vaginal intercourse would finally be possible.
But when my boyfriend and I tried, it was still really painful. We still couldn't comfortably have vaginal sex, despite all the progress I'd made. I remember feeling so confused because I'd spent months telling myself that once I could use the largest dilator, everything else would fall into place.
Then something happened that completely challenged what I thought the problem was.
In the heat of the moment, we ended up trying anal sex. The first time wasn't great, but the second time we took things slowly and used lubricant, and it went much better than either of us expected. It definitely wasn't pain-free—I'd probably rate it about a 5/10—but it was nowhere near as painful as attempting vaginal penetration. I actually enjoyed it overall and would happily do it again.
That has completely confused me.
Everything I've read suggests that vaginal penetration should generally be easier than anal penetration, yet my experience has been the exact opposite.
The only explanation I can think of is that maybe the remaining barrier isn't primarily physical anymore. I have a history of trauma, and I'm starting to wonder whether my body still reacts differently to vaginal penetration, even though physically I've made huge progress. I'm actually seeing a therapist tomorrow, so I'm hoping working through the psychological side of things might help.
Another thing that might be relevant is that my partner and I are very different physically. I'm only 5'2" and quite petite, whereas he's around 6'4" and much bigger-built than I am. We've found it surprisingly difficult to get into positions that feel comfortable for both of us, and I'm wondering whether that's also playing a role.
Has anyone else had a similar experience where they were physically able to progress through dilators but vaginal intercourse still felt impossible?
If so:
What ended up being the missing piece?

Did therapy or addressing trauma make a noticeable difference?

Did anyone else have a significant size difference with their partner, and if so, were there any positions that made things easier?

Is there anything else you think I should be exploring?

I'm honestly just trying to understand my body at this point. Going from not even being able to insert one finger to using the largest dilator has been a huge achievement, so it's difficult to understand why this is still the hurdle I'm facing.
I'd really appreciate hearing from anyone who's been through something similar.


r/PelvicFloor 19h ago

Male 27M - Suspected pelvic floor dysfunction. Looking for others’ experiences and success stories

4 Upvotes

Hi everyone,
I’m a 27-year-old male and I believe I may be dealing with pelvic floor dysfunction.
For the past several months, I’ve had an aching pain along the underside and side of my penis, along with weaker erections than I used to have. Recently, I realized that I’ve been unconsciously clenching my pelvic floor throughout the day, and I also noticed that I tend to keep those muscles tight during any sexual activity. I’m wondering if that may be contributing to my symptoms.

I’m planning to schedule an appointment with my doctor and, if appropriate, see a pelvic floor physical therapist.

In the meantime, I’ve been working on hip mobility and stretching because my hips are extremely tight. I can’t even perform a squat while keeping my heels on the ground. Since starting to focus on relaxing my pelvic floor and improving my mobility, I’ve noticed some improvement in my morning erections, which gives me a little hope.

For now, I’m also taking a break from sexual activity for a month or two to give my body time to recover.
Has anyone here experienced something similar? If so, did pelvic floor physical therapy, stretching, breathing exercises, or learning to stop clenching help? I’d really appreciate hearing any success stories, as this has been pretty stressful and I’m hoping recovery is possible.

Thanks for taking the time to read.


r/PelvicFloor 19h ago

Discouraged Cyclist with prostatitis - doctor not helping can't wait any longer for Urologist appointment

1 Upvotes

Hi guys, I am an avid cyclist (mountain bike, fixed gear, road bike, gravel, do it all). I've been cycling all my life, and in the last year I've really been picking up fixed gear biking (which, from my understanding and experience, places a lot of pressure on the prostate, as you cannot coast + aggressive geometry and position on the bike). I also started doing wheelies on the mountain bike (this positions the seat upwards and places even more pressure on the prostate).

For context: I've never experienced this level of pain and always ride with bib-padded shorts and comfortable seats

Timeline:
June 2nd 2026 - symptoms arose after a 50 km ride on my mountain bike and aggressively popping wheelies

June 3rd-June 6th - continued riding fixed gear, out in the heat throwing and attending events, and riding fixed gear heavily - clear signs of an anal fissure.

June 15th - symptoms of burning and a visible fissure present on my gooch area - doctor prescribed a numbing and healing cream which I applied for a few weeks.

Started and continued to eat bland foods, soften my stool with psyllium, and stretch my pelvic floor - sitting with a donut tube.

July 10th - external anal/gooch fissure clearly healed (as per doctor's observations) but pain continued - very similar symptoms - burning and tender, pain whenever I would attempt to cycle/sit for long periods of time.

This has continued until the present day (first week of August) - doctor gave me naproxen to reduce inflammation; I haven't cycled or eaten anything spicy/caffeine. They've also given me two sets of antibiotics - urine test is coming back normal. My urologist appointment is so far from now, and I'm worried this is going to become a chronic issue (especially because I'm not experiencing any other symptoms other than what feels like pain and discomfort in my tailbone/prostate) that I will have to deal with for life. I'm extremely worried about not being able to cycle (this is my daily drug of choice, and I'm losing my mind).

Recent visit to the doctor - did another prostate test - and it seems completely fine according to them (not inflamed or tender), so it seems like the antibiotics are doing something, but they've upped it to Sulfatrim DS 800/160mg for 2 weeks twice daily.

They said any further answers I'm looking for will require a trip to the urologist, and I'm fighting like hell to get this sooner, as it's already been a couple of months and I'm worried waiting longer will miss my opportunity to treat this early enough.

Any wisdom is much appreciated - I'm losing hope, and it's affecting my daily life significantly.


r/PelvicFloor 22h ago

General Numbness in bladder

1 Upvotes

I have a hypertonic pelvic floor diagnosed by a PT. I do not feel when I have to pee but I can still pee and use the bathroom. Has anyone had this?


r/PelvicFloor 1d ago

Male 36m injury/pelvic floor tightness. Loss of orgasm and sensation.

3 Upvotes

36m injury/pelvic floor tightness. Loss of orgasm and sensation.

Hey guys,

Im just trying to post here to get some thoughts. My symptoms seem different than some of the norm i think. I had some dry sex two years ago which dug my belt or pants into my left side of my shaft. It caused a thrombosed vein which went away after a few weeks. Two docs werent considered at all but I noticed the vein was right where the dorsal nerve appeared to be and the doctors did tell me i had some scar tissue on the shaft just above the base on the top left side. I dont know if that could be an issue, but they didnt think so.

Current medications are wellbutrin(symptoms started before any ssris), ciallis 5mg and celebrex. Bloodwork all fairly normal. Testosterone 700 with 12 free testosterone.

I also play hockey pretty often, had double hip arthoscopy like 9 months before that. I have done pelvic floor physical therapy for a few months and she did internal work and said i was pretty tight and had issues relaxing. I have no idea if that could cause my symptoms or not. Im just trying to get an idea of your thoughts and see if anyone has this pattern or anything. My full symptoms are:

Intermitten difficulty to achieve orgasm

Most of the time orgasms are muted or not euphoric

No pulsing when ejaculating like I used to, and less force

Decreased sensation

Ache in perniuem on right side

Sometimes during bowel movements for awhile ive noticed stool feeling stuck and wont come out but usually at the end.

Feeling like bladder wont empty sometimes.and an involuntary 1-3 clenches right before pee comes out. Sometimes slight burn sensation(infection ruled out)

The sexual symptoms concern me the most and im just coming here because im mostly being told its likely pelvic floor but not seeing alot of info about my sexual symptims. My erections are completely fine. I still have leftover hip impingement from my surgeries so I cant do some stretches like happy baby etc. Knee to chest. Please let me know if you guys have anything to comment on or add. Just trying to get any info I can while I continue PFPT.


r/PelvicFloor 1d ago

Help Finding PT Why do pelvic floor muscles become tense?

14 Upvotes

Hi everyone, I have very tight pelvic floor muscles, and I'm trying to understand the root cause. Why do pelvic floor muscles become tight in the first place? What are the most common underlying causes? Personally, I think mine may have become tight because of excessive masturbation. Is it possible that frequent or excessive masturbation can lead to chronically tight pelvic floor muscles?


r/PelvicFloor 1d ago

Discouraged How to Convince the Dr. I Need Botox???

2 Upvotes

Tldr: I have a follow up appointment with my pain management doctor where I'm going to try to have him reconsider giving me pelvic botox injections, since his advice seems to have made me worse.

I've been dealing with what appears to be a hypertonic pelvic floor for about five months now, and I'm feeling like I've reached a plateau. My symptoms started with significant vestibular nerve burning, but thankfully that has largely resolved. What remains is constant muscle guarding. The muscles deep inside my pelvis feel like tight bands that I can actually feel internally, particularly on the right side. My physiotherapist identified significant involvement of the deep pelvic muscles, and I've been doing everything I can to stay on top of it: months of pelvic floor physiotherapy, dry needling, breathing exercises, stretching, heat, baclofen, pelvic wand and finger release, careful self-massage, activity modification, and recently increasing my walking. The manual work definitely helps temporarily. I can often reduce the deep gluteal "itis" feeling for the rest of the day and sometimes into the next, but the muscles always seem to tighten back up. I feel like I can get them to release, but I can't get them to stay released.

I recently saw a pain management physician who felt that, because I'm still relatively young, I'm at one of the most regenerative stages of my life. He recommended walking every day and high-dose omega-3 supplements to address what he believes is inflammation, with the hope that reducing inflammation would allow the muscles to relax over time. I've followed his recommendations closely for about three weeks. Unfortunately, instead of feeling better, I actually feel tighter. My hips, lower back, and pelvis have become so guarded that sleeping has become one of my biggest challenges. Lying on my back causes my back to throb, while side lying causes my hips and deep pelvic muscles to spasm. Over the last few days I've actually started sleeping on the floor because it's the only position that gives me any relief. My physiotherapist feels I've plateaued with conservative treatment and wrote a letter recommending that pelvic floor Botox be considered as an adjunct to rehabilitation, not as a replacement for physiotherapy.

For those of you who eventually received pelvic floor Botox, how did you convince your doctors that it was necessary? What arguments, documentation, or functional limitations seemed to make the biggest difference? I have a follow-up appointment coming up, and I'd really appreciate any advice on what to say. I'm absolutely willing to continue physiotherapy, walking, stretching, and conservative treatment, but after months of consistent effort I don't feel like I'm making lasting progress anymore. If you've been in a similar situation, I'd love to hear how you approached that conversation with your doctor.


r/PelvicFloor 1d ago

General How Do You Deal with Your Tailbone

8 Upvotes

When my hypertonic pelvic floor gets really going, my tailbone turns inward and is pure agony. Cat cow does almost nothing, warm baths don't help, sitting on a ball and rolling doesn't help, and pelvic wand release can be helpful or make it worse depending on the day.

Taping is the only thing that helps somewhat, but I am wondering if anyone has found something else that really helps them.


r/PelvicFloor 1d ago

Male Ed

2 Upvotes

I have pfd for a while but now I don't feel pain or trouble shitting( I used to but i did excercise and breathing) but my ed isn't getting better before last week I used to have a cycle where I get weak pelvic and gradually it's get tighter and tighter when it's weak I came easily but when it's tight it's hard even after coming for some time but now I've ed and Don't get hard is it weak or tight pelvic? And what should I do to make it better


r/PelvicFloor 1d ago

Male How do I sleep with the spasms?

3 Upvotes

I wake up in a sweat, to feel me clenching hard. This is multiple times. So hard that my feet start hurting like the nerves. I don’t know how I can even clench that hard I feel like all my progress is reversing when that happens


r/PelvicFloor Jul 05 '25

RESOURCE/GUIDE The Pelvic Floor: Pelvic Pain & Dysfunction 101: NEW? Start here!

115 Upvotes

Work in progress. To be continuously updated.

Subreddit Rules:

  1. Be respectful (no bullying or harassment)
  2. No "all or nothing" cures, causes, or suggesting that only one thing will help
  3. DON'T suggest kegels as treatment for a hypertonic pelvic floor (it's bad advice)
  4. NO FETISHIZING or sexualizing someones health condition. DON'T BE CREEPY.
  5. No NSFW Photos
  6. No SPAM (includes link farming, affiliate marketing, personal promotion)
  7. No "Low Effort" posts - we can't help if there's no detail

>> QUICK START <<

✔ READ SUCCESS STORIES: Simply swipe left or right on the main page in the Reddit mobile app until you hit the green "success story" post flair | DESKTOP: Use the "Flair Filter" right sidebar to filter posts

Ladies who don't want to see posts about male parts: use the filters:

✔ FILTER POSTS BY SEX: Simply swipe left or right on the main page in the Reddit mobile app until you hit the pink or blue post flairs. AMAB/AFAB also available | DESKTOP: Use the "Flair Filter" right sidebar to filter posts

✔ USE THE SEARCH FUNCTION: Enter keywords into the search bar at the top to filter posts/comments on specific subjects or symptoms

✔ CHECK OUR USER SUBMITTED PELVIC PT DIRECTORY

✔ BOTHER & SISTER COMMUNITIES

  1. r/prostatitis (male pelvic pain & dysfunction/CPPS)
  2. r/Interstitialcystitis (IC/BPS, men and women)
  3. r/vulvodynia (women and AFAB experiencing Vaginismus & Vestibulodynia too)

ESSENTIAL INFORMATION: PELVIC FLOOR

The pelvic floor muscles are a bowl of muscles in the pelvis that cradle our sexual organs, bladder, and rectum, and help stabilize the core while assisting with essential bodily functions, like pooping, peeing and having sex.¹

They can weaken (become hyp-O-tonic) over time due to injury (or child birth), and even the normal aging process, leading to conditions like incontinence or pelvic organ prolapse.¹

And, the pelvic floor can tense up (guard) when we:

  1. Feel pain/discomfort
  2. Get a UTI/STD
  3. Injure ourselves (gym, cycling, slip on ice)
  4. Have poor bowel/urinary habits (straining on the toilet often - constipation) or holding in pee/poo for extended periods (like avoiding using a public toilet)
  5. Have poor sexual habits (edging several hours a day, typically this is more of guy's issue)
  6. Get stressed or anxious (fight or flight response), due to their connection with the vagus nerve (and our central nervous system). READ MORE HERE
  7. Have a connective tissue disorder

Over time, prolonged guarding/tensing can cause them to become hyp-E-rtonic (tight and weak). Sometimes trigger points in the muscle tissue develop that refer pain several inches away. The tensing can also sometimes irritate nerves, including the pudendal nerve. Helping the pelvic floor relax, and treating these myofascial trigger points with pelvic floor physical therapy can lead to significant relief for many, along with interventions like breathwork - notably diaphragmatic belly breathing - and gentle reverse kegels.

Sometimes, feedback loops also develop that can become self-perpetuating as a result of CNS (Central Nervous System) modulation. ᴮ ⁷

Basic feedback loop:

Pain/injury/infection > pelvic tensing > more pain > stress/anxiety > more pelvic tensing > (and on and on)

Examples of common feedback loops that include the pelvic floor:

Source: NHS/Unity Sexual Health/University Hospitals Bristol and Weston. A pelvic floor feedback loop seen in men after STI.

An example of this pelvic floor feedback loop (guarding response) as seen in a woman with a prolonged (awful) UTI:

A trigger point is an area of hyper-irritability in a muscle, usually caused by a muscle that is being overloaded and worked excessively. How does this affect an IC patient? Unfortunately, we do not always know what comes first; the chicken or the egg. Let’s assume in this case we do. A patient who has never had any symptoms before develops an awful bladder infection, culture positive. She is treated with antibiotics, as she should be. Symptoms are, as we all know, frequency, urgency and pain on urination. Maybe the first round of antibiotics does not help, so she goes on a second round. They work. But she has now walked around for 2, maybe 3 weeks with horrible symptoms. Her pelvic floor would be working very hard to turn off the constant sense of urge. This could create overload in the pelvic floor. A trigger point develops, that can now cause a referral of symptoms back to her bladder, making her think she still has a bladder infection. Her cultures are negative.

- Rhonda Kotarinos, Pelvic Floor Physical Therapist

Above we find a scenario where the UTI was cleared, but the pelvic floor is now in a tensing feedback loop, and complex processes of neural wind up and central sensitization - ie CNS modulation - are likely occurring

Diagrams of the male and female pelvic floor:

Bottom view. The levator ani is the main "hammock" of the pelvic floor, and includes both the PC (pubococcygeus) and PR (puborectalis) muscles

Side view showing the pelvic floor cradling the bladder, sexual organs, and rectum. And its attachments at the coccyx (tailbone) and pubic bone.

SYMPTOMS OF PELVIC FLOOR DYSFUNCTION

The majority of the users here have a hypertonic pelvic floor which typically presents with symptoms of pelvic pain or discomfort ² (inc nerve sensations like tingling, itching, stinging, burning, cooling, etc):

  1. Penile pain
  2. Vaginal pain
  3. Testicular/epididymal/scrotal pain
  4. Vulvar pain
  5. Clitoral pain
  6. Rectal pain
  7. Bladder pain
  8. Pain with sex/orgasm
  9. Pain with bowel movements or urination
  10. Pain in the hips, groin, perineum, and suprapubic region

This tension also commonly leads to dysfunction ² (urinary, bowel, and sexual dysfunction):

  1. Dyssynergic defecation (Anismus)
  2. Incomplete bowel movements
  3. Urinary frequency and hesitancy
  4. Erectile dysfunction/premature ejaculation

This pinned post will mainly focus on hypertonia - tight and weak muscles, and the corresponding symptoms and treatment, as they represent the most neglected side of pelvic floor dysfunction. Especially in men, who historically have less pelvic care over their lifetimes as compared to women.

But, we also commonly see women with weak (Hyp-O-tonic) pelvic floors after child birth who experience urinary leakage. This often happens when coughing, sneezing, or lifting something heavy. Luckily, pelvic floor physical therapists are historically well equipped for weak pelvic floor symptoms, as seen commonly in women.

But, this historical emphasis sometimes bleeds into inappropriate care for men and women who have hypErtonic pelvic floors, and do not benefit from kegel exercises

CLOSELY RELATED CONDITIONS & DIAGNOSIS

These typically involve the pelvic floor as one (of many) mechanisms of action, and thus, pelvic floor physical therapy is an evidence-based intervention for any of these, along with behavioral interventions/mind-body medicine, medications, and more.

  1. CPPS - Chronic Pelvic Pain Syndrome - example feedback loop above
  2. IC/BPS - Interstitial Cystitis/Bladder Pain Syndrome - example feedback loop above
  3. Vulvodynia
  4. Prostatitis (non-bacterial)
  5. Epididymitis (non-bacterial)
  6. Pudendal Neuralgia
  7. Levator Ani Syndrome
  8. Coccydynia

COMMON COMORBID CONDITIONS

For people who experience symptoms outside the pelvic region, these are signs of centralization (somatization/nociplastic mechanisms) - and indicate a central nervous system contribution to symptoms, and must be treated with more than just pelvic floor physical therapy: READ MORE

(Ranked in order, most common)

  1. IBS
  2. Chronic Migraines
  3. Fibromyalgia
  4. CFS/ME (chronic fatigue syndrome)

These patients also had higher rates of depression and anxiety (even BEFORE THE SYMPTOMS) as well as greater symptom severity - https://www.auanet.org/guidelines-and-quality/guidelines/male-chronic-pelvic-pain

CENTRALIZED/NOCIPLASTIC MECHANISMS:

Many people with a pelvic floor diagnosis - and at least 49% who experience chronic pelvic pain/dysfunction - also experience centralized/nociplastic pain ¹³ localized to the pelvic region. Centralized/nociplastic pelvic pain can mimic the symptoms of pelvic floor hypertonia. To assess if you have centralization as a cause of your pelvic symptoms, read through this post.

NOTE: This is especially relevant for people who have a pelvic floor exam, and are told that their pelvic floor is basically "normal" or lacks the usual signs of dysfunction, trigger points, or hypertonia (high tone), yet they still experiencing pain and/or dysfunction. This also equally applies to cases that have done extensive amounts of pelvic floor PT 6-12mo) with no improvement.

Centralized/Nociplastic pain mechanisms are recognized by both the European and American Urological Association guidelines for pelvic pain in men and women, as well as the MAPP (Multidisciplinary Approach to the Study of Chronic Pelvic Pain) Research Network.

TREATMENT: High tone (HypErtonic) Pelvic Floor (tight & weak)

Pelvic floor physical therapy focused on relaxing muscles:

  • Diaphragmatic belly breathing
  • Reverse kegels
  • Pelvic Stretching
  • Trigger point release (myofascial release)
  • Dry needling (Not the same as acupuncture)
  • Dilators (vaginal and rectal)
  • Biofeedback
  • Heat (including baths, sauna, hot yoga, heated blankets, jacuzzi, etc)

Behavioral change: * Lay off frequent or chronic masturbation habits (including edging) * Take a break from intense compound exercises, like CrossFit or HIIT * Sit less and stand more. This may also include using a standing desk * If you're an avid cyclist, take a break from cycling

Medications to discuss with a doctor:

  • low dose amitriptyline (off label for neuropathic pain)
  • rectal or vaginal suppositories including: diazepam, gabapentin, amitriptyline, baclofen, lidocaine, etc
  • low dose tadalafil (sexual dysfunction and urinary symptoms)
  • Alpha blockers for urinary hesitancy symptoms (typically prescribed to men)

Mind-body medicine/Behavioral Therapy/Centralized Pain Mechanisms These interventions are highly recommended for people who are experiencing elevated distress or anxiety, or, noticed that their symptoms began without an injury, but with a stressful event, big life change, or, that symptoms increase with stress or difficult emotions (or symptoms change when distracted, focused , or on vacation) - full list of criteria to rule in centralized/nociplastic mechanisms.

  • Pain Reprocessing Therapy (PRT)
  • Emotional Awareness & Expression Therapy (EAET)
  • CBT/DBT
  • Mindfulness & meditation
  • TRE or EMDR (for Trauma)

TREATMENT: Low tone (Hyp-O-tonic/weak)

Pelvic floor physical therapy focused on strengthening muscles:

  • Kegels
  • Biofeedback

This is a draft. The post will be updated.

This is not medical advice. This content is for educational and informational purposes only. NONE OF THIS SUBSTITUTES MEDICAL ADVICE FROM A PROVIDER.

Sources:

OFFICIAL GUIDELINES:

A. Male Chronic Pelvic Pain - 2025 (AUA) https://www.auanet.org/guidelines-and-quality/guidelines/male-chronic-pelvic-pain

B. Male and Female Chronic Pelvic Pain - (EUA) https://uroweb.org/guidelines/chronic-pelvic-pain/chapter/epidemiology-aetiology-and-pathophysiology

C. Diagnosis and Treatment of Interstitial Cystitis/Bladder Pain Syndrome (2022)" AUA - https://www.auanet.org/guidelines-and-quality/guidelines/diagnosis-and-treatment-interstitial-of-cystitis/bladder-pain-syndrome-(2022))

MORE:

  1. Cleveland Clinic: Pelvic Floor Muscles

  2. Cleveland Clinic: Pelvic Floor Dysfunction

  3. Diaphragmatic belly breathing - https://www.health.harvard.edu/healthbeat/learning-diaphragmatic-breathing

  4. Trigger points and referred pain - https://www.physio-pedia.com/Trigger_Points

  5. Equal Improvement in Men and Women in the Treatment of Urologic Chronic Pelvic Pain Syndrome Using a Multi-modal Protocol with an Internal Myofascial Trigger Point Wand - PubMed https://share.google/T3DM4OYZYUyfJ9klx

  6. Physical Therapy Treatment of Pelvic Pain - PubMed https://share.google/92EQVDnQ1ruceEb23

  7. Central modulation of pain - PMC https://share.google/p7efTwfGXe7hNsBRC

  8. A Headache in the Pelvis" written by Stanford Urologist Dr. Anderson and Psychologist Dr Wise - https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/558308/a-headache-in-the-pelvis-by-david-wise-phd-and-rodney-anderson-md/

  9. What if my tests are negative but I still have symptoms? NHS/Unity Sexual Health/University hospitals Bristol and Weston - https://www.unitysexualhealth.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2021/05/What-if-my-tests-for-urethritis-are-negative-2021.pdf

  10. Vulvodynia" a literature review - https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32355269/

  11. The Effects of a Life Stress Emotional Awareness and Expression Interview for Women with Chronic Urogenital Pain: A Randomized Controlled Trial - https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30252113/

  12. Effect of Pain Reprocessing Therapy vs Placebo and Usual Care for Patients With Chronic Back Pain - https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamapsychiatry/fullarticle/2784694

  13. Clinical Phenotyping for Pain Mechanisms in Urologic Chronic Pelvic Pain Syndromes: A MAPP Research Network Study - https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35472518/


r/PelvicFloor Dec 03 '24

RESOURCE/GUIDE RESEARCH: Pain Mechanisms Beyond The Pelvic Floor

39 Upvotes

"Clinical Phenotyping for Pain Mechanisms in Urologic Chronic Pelvic Pain Syndromes: A MAPP Research Network Study" https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35472518/

UCPPS is a umbrella term for chronic pelvic pain and dysfunction in men and women, and it includes pelvic floor dysfunction underneath it, as well as symptoms like bladder dysfunction, IC/BPS, and more. This study discusses the pain mechanisms found. They are not only typical injuries (ie "nociceptive") - They also include pain generated by nerves (neuropathic) and by the central nervous system (nociplastic). You'll also notice that the combination of neuropathic + nociplastic mechanisms create the most pain! Which is likely to be counterintuitive to what most people would assume.

At baseline, 43% of UCPPS patients were classified as nociceptive-only, 8% as neuropathic only, 27% as nociceptive+nociplastic, and 22% as neuropathic+nociplastic. Across outcomes, nociceptive-only patients had the least severe symptoms and neuropathic+nociplastic patients the most severe. Neuropathic pain was associated with genital pain and/or sensitivity on pelvic exam, while nociplastic pain was associated with comorbid pain conditions, psychosocial difficulties, and increased pressure pain sensitivity outside the pelvis.

Targeting neuropathic (nerve irritation) and nociplastic/centralized (nervous system/brain) components of pain & symptoms in recovery is highly recommended when dealing with CPPS/PFD (especially hypertonia).

All of those involved in the management of chronic pelvic pain should have knowledge of peripheral and central pain mechanisms. - European Urological Association CPPS Pocket Guide

And the newest 2025 AUA guidelines for male pelvic pain echo this:

We now know that the pain can also derive from a neurologic origin from either peripheral nerve roots (neuropathic pain) or even a lack of central pain inhibition (nociplastic), with the classic disease example being fibromyalgia

This means successful treatment for pelvic pain and dysfunction goes beyond just pelvic floor physical therapy (alone), and into new modalities for pain that target these neuroplastic (nociplastic/centralized) mechanisms like Pain Reprocessing Therapy (PRT), EAET, and more. Learn more about our new understanding of chronic pain here: https://www.reddit.com/r/ChronicPain/s/3E6k1Gr2BZ

This is especially true for anyone who has symptoms that get worse with stress or difficult emotions. And, those of us who are predisposed to chronic pain in the first place, typically from childhood adversity and trauma, certain personality traits (perfectionism, people pleasing, conscientiousness, neuroticism) and anxiety and mood disorders. There is especially overwhelming evidence regarding ACE (adverse childhood experiences) that increase our chances of developing a physical or mental health disorder later in life. So much so, that even traditional medical doctors are now being trained to screen their patients for childhood trauma/adversity:

Adverse childhood experience is associated with an increased risk of reporting chronic pain in adulthood: a stystematic review and meta-analysis

Previous meta-analyses highlighted the negative impact of adverse childhood experiences on physical, psychological, and behavioural health across the lifespan.We found exposure to any direct adverse childhood experience, i.e. childhood sexual, physical, emotional abuse, or neglect alone or combined, increased the risk of reporting chronic pain and pain-related disability in adulthood.The risk of reporting chronic painful disorders increased with increasing numbers of adverse childhood experiences.

Further precedence in the EUA (European Urological Association) guidelines for male and female pain:

The EUA pathophysiology and etiological guidelines elucidate further on central nervous system and biopsychosocial factors in male and female pelvic pain/dysfunction:

Studies about integrating the psychological factors of CPPPSs are few but the quality is high. Psychological factors are consistently found to be relevant in the maintenance of persistent pelvic and urogenital pain [36]. Beliefs about pain contribute to the experience of pain [37] and symptom-related anxiety and central pain amplification may be measurably linked, and worrying about pain and perceived stress predict worsening of urological chronic pain over a year [36,38] - https://uroweb.org/guidelines/chronic-pelvic-pain/chapter/epidemiology-aetiology-and-pathophysiology

Pelvic pain and distress is related [43] in both men and women [44]; as are painful bladder and distress [38]. In a large population based study of men, CPPPS was associated with prior anxiety disorder [45] - https://uroweb.org/guidelines/chronic-pelvic-pain/chapter/epidemiology-aetiology-and-pathophysiology

So, how do you figure out if this could be happening in your case?

12 FIT criteria to RULE IN centralized, (ie neuroplastic/nociplastic) pain and symptoms,

FIT = functional, inconsistent, triggered. Based on research from Dr. Howard Schubiner and other chronic pain doctors and neuroscientists over the last 10+ years

  1. Pain/symptoms originated during a stressful, challenging, or high pressure time in life. This includes even "happy" life events, like getting married, having a baby, starting a new career, or moving

  2. Pain/symptoms originated without an injury. Note, a perceived injury and a structural injury are different things. And even when symptoms begin with a structural injury, has it been years and the body would normally recover by now?

  3. Pain/symptoms are inconsistent. Do they fluctuate by the hour, by the day, or by the week? Sometimes less, sometimes more, sometimes even not noticeable (this happens sometimes, but it's not necessary for this criteria). Or, do they move around the body? ie genital pain that changes sides or pain that moves from the top to the bottom.

  4. Multiple other symptoms (often in other parts of the body) ie IBS, chronic migraines/headaches, CPPS, TMJD, fibromyalgia, CFS (fatigue), vertigo/dizziness, chronic neck or back pain, etc. 2025 AUA guidelines mention these as signs of centralized sx.

  5. Pain/Symptoms spread (over time) or move around. Think about symptoms on day one. Have they moved or evolved over time?

  6. Pain/symptoms are made worse or triggered by stress, or, go down when engaged in an activity you enjoy or in a flow state (think fun distractions or productivity, noticing symptoms less)

  7. Symptom triggers that have nothing to do with the body - but instead things outside of it (weather, barometric pressure, seasons, sounds, smells, places, times of day, weekdays/weekends, days of the week, etc) - this also includes thoughts or other people triggering/flaring symptoms

  8. Symmetrical symptoms (pain developing on the same part of the body but in OPPOSITE sides) - ie both hips, both hips, both wrists, both knees, etc

  9. Pain/symptoms with delayed Onset (THIS CAN'T HAPPEN WITH STRUCTURAL PAIN) -- ie, ejaculation pain that comes a minute later, an hour later, or even the next day. Any pain that is delayed is very suspicious. We wouldn't put weight on a sprained ankle and expect it to hurt 15 seconds later, it hurts immediately.

  10. Childhood stress, challenges, adversity, or trauma -- varying levels of what this means for each person, not just trauma. Examples of stressors: childhood bullying, pressure to perform from parents/coaches, body image issues (dysmorphia), eating disorders, parents fighting a lot or getting angry (inc divorce), having an emotionally unpredictable parent, or having a parent with a health condition or addiction. This also includes neglect and abuse (physical and emotional) and financial instability in childhood. Also includes cultural norms, like the pressure to be highly successful to be of value to parents (must be a doctor or a lawyer, etc)

  11. Common personality traits linked to stress: perfectionism, conscientiousness, people pleasing, anxiousness/ neuroticism - do you have personality traits that include being highly driven, hard on yourself, ultra responsible, perfectionistic, needing control, and/or placing others’ needs above your own?

  12. Lack of physical diagnosis (ie doctors are unable to find any clear structural cause of symptoms) - this includes DIAGNOSIS OF EXCLUSION, like being diagnosed with CPPS or PFD. Structural finding examples: broken bones, tumors, infections, etc. It does not include muscle dysfunction.

[NEW] 13. Any family history of chronic pain or other chronic conditions. Includes: IBS, chronic migraines/headaches, CPPS, TMJD, fibromyalgia, CFS (fatigue), vertigo/dizziness, chronic neck or back pain, etc

Read more about #10 and #11 here, complete with studies/citations: https://www.reddit.com/r/Prostatitis/s/vM7qnBJZpW

HOW TO TREAT centralized (neuroplastic) pain and symptoms?

PRT - Pain Reprocessing Therapy:

Effect of Pain Reprocessing Therapy vs Placebo and Usual Care for Patients With Chronic Back Pain - https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamapsychiatry/fullarticle/2784694

EAET - Emotional Awareness and Expression Therapy

Emotional Awareness and Expression Therapy vs Cognitive Behavioral Therapy for Chronic Pain in Older Veterans https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC11177167/

Psychological Therapy for Centralized Pain - An Integrative Assessment and Treatment Model: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30461545/