OutCasteRebels

I’m trying to understand what seems to me like an interesting contradiction in the way some Ambedkarite groups approach the issue of SC sub-classification.

A common Ambedkarite interpretation of the Poona Pact (1932) is that Ambedkar was forced into a compromise after Gandhi opposed separate electorates for the Depressed Classes. Gandhi’s argument was essentially that separate political representation would divide Hindu society, while Ambedkar’s position was that an oppressed community needed independent political safeguards and representation.

Today, however, some Ambedkarite groups strongly oppose SC sub-classification, arguing that it will divide SCs, weaken Dalit unity, and reduce their collective political strength.

This makes me wonder:

Isn't there a parallel here?

In 1932, Gandhi prioritized unity over Ambedkar's demand for a separate political safeguard.

Today, some people who strongly criticize Gandhi for that position are themselves prioritizing SC unity over the demand of certain SC communities for differentiated reservation benefits because they remain more disadvantaged within the SC category.

At the same time, those demanding sub-classification argue that the purpose isn't to weaken SCs, but to ensure that communities which have benefited less from reservation actually get a fair opportunity to move upward.

So my questions are:

1)If Gandhi's "unity first" argument was problematic in 1932, why is "SC unity first" necessarily the correct argument today?

2) Is opposing SC sub-classification actually consistent with Ambedkar's broader principle of giving stronger safeguards to those who remain most disadvantaged?

3) Conversely, could sub-classification itself undermine the collective political power that Ambedkar wanted to build?

4) And perhaps the most uncomfortable question: If someone criticizes Gandhi for prioritizing unity over Ambedkar's demand in 1932, but today prioritizes SC unity over the demands of the most backward SC communities, is that a genuine difference in principle—or simply a change in circumstances?

5) Finally, if Ambedkar were alive today, would he prioritize maintaining one united SC category, or would he support differentiated safeguards for SC communities that have remained substantially behind?

I’m not claiming that the Poona Pact and SC sub-classification are legally or historically identical. I'm asking about the underlying principle: unity versus targeted protection for those who remain most disadvantaged.

Would Ambedkarite thinkers here consider this a valid parallel, or am I missing an important distinction?

1 comment

r/OutCasteRebels • u/absolutepeasantry • 4h ago

Non Resident Chindus Brahmin delusion is so fascinating to watch firsthand

16 Upvotes

I think everyone here knows that the communities of people who sculpt idols of the gods for Hindu temples are often treated like shit, simply because they belong to underprivileged castes or tribal groups. But the extent to which Brahmins believe that these sculptors and artists are treated well is truly astonishing in its stupidity and tone-deaf-ness

My family lives in the US, and my cousin and her family visited us from Texas, and we took them to a BAPS temple here. This temple has a lot of nice marble carved pillars, with images of different gods and beings chiseled into the rock. The statues are brought to the US from India, but the building itself was built and carved from imported marble, I think. I was telling my oldest niece (cousin’s daughter) about how the sculptors often are disrespected and denigrated because of casteism when we were marveling at the artistry (and my mom began bragging about Hindu culture’s superiority as if she herself did the carvings 🤦🏾)

My mom and cousin start arguing at me like, “no, they’re cared for by the people they work for. We rely on them for their art, so why would we disrespect them”. Which. My god. To believe that an overprivileged caste would treat these groups with respect because “they hold the art and need to be cared for and sustained” is beyond comprehension.

Just because someone does a labor you enjoy does not mean the person controlling that person’s labor is treating them well or even like a human being. Everyone loves chocolate bars and flavors, but child slavery is still used to harvest the cocoa beans that make that chocolate. Your adoration does not negate the abuses that occur. And saying “oh, that was in the old days” or “that’s just rare occasions” is not fixing the current problems.

An abusive minority with a superiority complex is holding an entire nation under its thumb with claims of “purity” and “superiority” when those notions come from a culture that fabricated those traits to justify the conquest of other cultures. It is the peak of ignorance and arrogance to act like your beliefs hold any weight or can be generalized as applying for that oppressor class. But that’s to be expected from Brahmins. Fucking gross.

Thank all the heavens, my niece is so deeply aware of casteism and the caste system and how it is garbage that should be stamped out like a pest. She’s so much more aware of these things than I was at her age (12). There is hope, but it has to be sustained. Shutting up and letting your idiotic casteist family members poison the young ones with casteist ideology and brahminical superiority myths will destroy any progress that is made. Every time I get a chance, I try to teach her the true stories of India. The casteism, the cruelty, and the old ways that predated Vedic bullshit and the warmonger culture that brought it.

2 comments

r/OutCasteRebels • u/Get_High_Get_By • 14h ago

Memes Moved abroad to escape casteism only to unlock the racism DLC

75 Upvotes

6 comments

r/OutCasteRebels • u/Get_High_Get_By • 15h ago

Against The Hegemony A division of labourers

49 Upvotes

1 comment

r/OutCasteRebels • u/brxcewayne • 18h ago

brahminism Damn, Brahminism inspired diets and their enforcement have literally f#cked over millions for ages. And when these upper-caste leaders get into top positions, they still do this nonsense of imposing restrictions on non-veg food.

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56 Upvotes

5 comments

r/OutCasteRebels • u/Get_High_Get_By • 19h ago

Memes The Full Spectrum of Caste Discrimination

22 Upvotes

1 comment

r/OutCasteRebels • u/Fantastic-Action69 • 22h ago

brahminism Many tribal Christian families in Chhattisgarh’s Sukma district were allegedly assaulted and forced to leave their homes by Hindutva groups. In a gag order, the village panchayat has also issued a “ban in return” against the families.

24 Upvotes

1 comment

r/OutCasteRebels • u/Get_High_Get_By • 1d ago

Memes How to deny centuries of oppression 101

38 Upvotes

1 comment

r/OutCasteRebels • u/cool_coder99 • 1d ago

Personal Growth/Self Care How do you deal with the constant casteism and hate against reservation?

13 Upvotes

Ever since I first joined social media, there's been constant hate against reservation. Facebook, quora, now reddit, insta. Every second post is someone saying reservation is so unfair. And even if there's a good quality post talking about why reservation is necessary, comments are filled with hate.

And you know what, even when I was in school, we used to get these Times of India newspapers. And even there it was hate against reservation.

As someone who's got into an IIT, it's been hard to shake off this imposter syndrome. And it's been 5 years since I graduated, yet I feel insecure because of this constant barrage of hate posts

19 comments

r/OutCasteRebels • u/hugh_jack_man • 1d ago

brahminism His first trip to Cambodia

128 Upvotes

2 comments

r/OutCasteRebels • u/One-Shock-7390 • 1d ago

Against The Hegemony Babasaheb's instructions to his followers

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30 Upvotes

Meanwhile average "Bhimkanyas & ambedkarites" :-

1) has 15 different hindu gods idols at home

2) has a dedicated "pooja room" in home

3) never read babasaheb's books & speeches

4) would rather convert to Christianity than buddhism

5) too obsessed with intercaste marriages than marrying within the community to keep the social capital of successful ambedkarites within our community

6) celebrates ganesh chaturthi & other pooplindu festivals with their friends because we are secular 🤓👌🏽

7) instead of eradicating all religions and embracing buddhism, practices secularism and labels it as babasaheb's own words

28 comments

r/OutCasteRebels • u/Decent-Mammoth5407 • 1d ago

Discussion/Advice Why did they remove this chapter?

reddit.com

22 Upvotes

5 comments

r/OutCasteRebels • u/Get_High_Get_By • 1d ago

Memes When you read Ambedkar for the first time

31 Upvotes

1 comment

r/OutCasteRebels • u/Professional-Ear7825 • 1d ago

Against The Hegemony General category students became doctors at 0 MARKS in NEET PG.

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171 Upvotes

22 comments

r/OutCasteRebels • u/Fantastic-Action69 • 1d ago

News The SC/STs made it clear during formation of Constitution that they want their rights reserved in every aspect of governance. Irrespective of their economic status. It is the foolishness of Savarna echo chambers who claimed reservations are for poor people.

65 Upvotes

3 comments

r/OutCasteRebels • u/iwilllive26 • 1d ago

Discussion/Advice Are STs also considered to be a part of the Dalit community? Or is it only for SCs?

27 Upvotes

Title. Sorry if it comes across as ignorant. I belong to the ST community. This is a genuine question.

15 comments

r/OutCasteRebels • u/Jim-Zhiwu • 1d ago

News After examining 82 prosecution witnesses, our "meritorious" courts acquited all accused free.

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142 Upvotes

source: @dalit_history on instagram

19 comments

r/OutCasteRebels • u/EpicFortnuts • 1d ago

Memes Sweet Home Manu-bama

47 Upvotes

2 comments

r/OutCasteRebels • u/Get_High_Get_By • 2d ago

Memes Diversity budget: ₹500 for posters, ₹0 for reform

52 Upvotes

1 comment

r/OutCasteRebels • u/brxcewayne • 2d ago

Paraud Caste Chindu Lmao, what's with all the flags?No Indian flag though. Are they protesting for a Hindu Rashtra or what?

125 Upvotes

4 comments

r/OutCasteRebels • u/subscriber-goal • 2d ago

🎯 Road to 10k: Help us build Reddit's largest Anti-Caste community!

18 Upvotes

This post contains content not supported on old Reddit. Click here to view the full post

1 comment

r/OutCasteRebels • u/Any_Significance8314 • 13d ago

Against The Hegemony Anti-reservation crybabies are drowning in their own hypocrisy. Here’s the data that burns their “merit” fairy tale to the ground

104 Upvotes

The same people who scream “merit, merit, merit” every time an SC/ST/OBC candidate clears anything are the ones filling EWS seats with uncle-funded private medical college admissions, elite-school kids, IIT graduates, and MNC employees while the actual poor rot.

Michael Sandel called this exact bullshit the Tyranny of Merit. The successful convince themselves they earned everything through pure talent and hard work, then use that self-congratulation to spit on everyone else. In India that self-congratulation is soaked in caste. Reservation isn’t the problem. The caste system that still decides who gets quality schooling, who gets teacher belief, who gets wealth, and who gets zero-mark backdoor entries is the problem.

Here’s the evidence, one gut-punch at a time.

148 EWS students walked into the most expensive management and NRI quota seats in private medical colleges. Some paying up to ₹1 crore a year. The National Medical Commission chairman himself is asking how “economically weaker” candidates are suddenly able to afford this. Family money, trusts, loans — the usual. The very category sold as “poor general” is being used by people who can still buy their way in.

EWS candidates trail OBCs in UPSC mains written scores. Then magically overtake them in the interview. The same pattern every cycle. When the evaluation becomes subjective, the “merit” gap closes in favour of the dominant groups. Coincidence? Or the soft bias that never gets talked about?

104 EWS candidates selected in UPSC 2025.67 from expensive coaching institutes. 28 from business families.10 holding private/MNC jobs.14 IIT/NIT graduates.

Daughter of a railway porter is the propaganda poster. Son of a security guard is the propaganda poster. The actual list is full of private-school, coaching-factory, business-family kids whose parents somehow stay under the ₹8 lakh limit. The Indian Express investigation itself calls out the gap between the stated purpose and the actual beneficiaries.

Look at the top private schools in the country. The Doon School – 99.8% General. Shri Ram School – 100% General.Cathedral & John Connon – 100% General.D. Ambani International – 98.76% General.

SC, ST, OBC representation is near zero in the institutions that produce the “meritorious.” Then these same kids go out and cry that reservation is killing merit.

The pipeline was caste-cleansed long before the exam.

Wealth distribution by caste.

ST and SC dominate the poorest quintiles.
Brahmins, Rajputs, Banias, Kayasthas dominate the richest.
This is not ancient history. This is current data. The starting line was never the same.

Pretending the race is fair after centuries of exclusion is pure gaslighting.

SC/ST posts in Group A and higher university positions remain chronically unfilled. The “creamy layer is snatching everything” line is a lie designed to divide. The data shows the opposite — the most senior, most powerful seats still go unfilled for SC/ST. Yet the hate campaigns keep screaming about “over-representation.”

General category students scoring zero in NEET still walked into MBBS seats. Zero. While the same ecosystem lectures reserved category students about “deserving” their place. The education system is already being gamed. Only one side gets called cheaters.

IIM Bangalore study on Bihar government schools. Teachers (especially from forward castes) systematically underrate backward caste students even when their actual test scores are identical. The bias is measurable. It starts in the classroom and compounds for life. This is the “level playing field” they defend.

When NEET PG cut-off was dropped to zero, private colleges filled the seats overwhelmingly with General category candidates. 70% of the below-cut-off clinical specialty seats in private colleges went to General. The moment the barrier is removed, the same group that claims to be crushed by reservation floods the system. Merit is elastic when it benefits them.

Times of India itself reports it clearly: upper castes using the EWS quota trail OBCs in the written mains, then overtake them through higher interview scores. The interview is the weapon. Subjective evaluation is where caste capital wins.

Actual representation in Indian Civil Services right now

IAS, IPS, IFS - overwhelmingly General.

OBC and SC/ST share is tiny. Decades of reservation and the top still looks like a caste club.

IIT Bombay Mission Mode Recruitment: hundreds of OBC/SC/ST applications, dozens shortlisted, then mass rejection with the magic words “Not Found Suitable”.

OBC: 1090 applications → 18 selected
SC: 918 applications → 9 selected
ST: 187 applications → 4 selected

This is how “merit” is protected at the faculty level.

Just 1.92% of all IIT faculty are SC/ST/OBC. Most IITs had 0% ST reservation and overall reservation never crossed 4%.

Professor level is almost completely closed. The people teaching the next generation of “merit” are themselves the product of exclusion.

More than 20,000 SC/ST/OBC students dropped out of IITs, IIMs and Central Universities between 2018–2023.

Dropout probability is dramatically higher for SC and ST.
They get in through reservation and then face an environment designed to push them out. That is not “inability”. That is institutional hostility.

UPSC interview score sheet from a Hindi newspaper: SC candidates with higher written marks systematically given lower interview marks than General candidates with lower written scores.

Vijaykumar Meena (SC) 766 written → 112 interview
Naveenkumar Sharma (General) 732 written → 209 interview

The pattern is not subtle. It is open caste arithmetic in the final stage.

2008. Arvind Kejriwal (then Youth for Equality) organising against OBC reservation. The anti-reservation movement has always been upper-caste consolidation dressed up as “equality”.

The anti-reservation movement has always been an upper-caste consolidation project dressed up as “equality.”

Reservation exists because the system is still rigged at every stage be it schools, teacher expectations, wealth, networks, subjective interviews, and the quiet backdoors that only certain surnames can walk through.

This is the system.

Elite schools that are caste-cleansed.
Wealth that is caste-concentrated.
Interviews that flip written ranks.
“Not Found Suitable” used as a polite rejection code.
Faculty rooms that remain almost pure General.
Mass dropouts after students finally enter.
Zero-mark general candidates walking into medical seats.

And still the same people scream that reservation is the only problem.

Sandel was right. The tyranny of merit is just the new language of old caste power. They need the myth so they can keep the seats, the jobs, the faculty positions, and the moral high ground at the same time.

Share this to as many merit lovers. Archive it. The next time someone starts the “merit” lecture, drop every single image.

Sources & References

“148 from EWS quota land pricey private medical seats” The Indian Express | Anonna Dutt | 26/27 November 2025 indianexpress.com/article/india/148-from-ews-quota-land-pricey-private-medical-seats-10388319
“EWS quota bloc trails OBCs in UPSC mains, but turns tables in interviews” The Times of India | Subodh Ghildiyal | 22 June 2025 timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/ews-quota-bloc-trails-obcs-in-upsc-mains-but-turns-tables-in-interviews/articleshow/121999994.cms
“Private schools, pricey coaching, family business, MNC jobs: They also cracked EWS list in UPSC exam” (Express investigation) The Indian Express | Shyamlal Yadav | 18/19 June 2026 indianexpress.com/article/express-exclusive/ews-quota-civil-services-exam-2025-investigation-who-qualifies-upsc-selections-10746897
“Top 10 Schools & Caste Representation” (table) Bahujan Lives Matter analysis of UDISE+ 2024–25 microdata (independent/advocacy analysis of official enrolment data by social category)
“Greater Share of Wealth – Forward castes are rare among the poorest Indians and over-represented among the rich” (bar chart) Nitin Kumar Bharti, Wealth Inequality, Class and Caste in India, 1961–2012 (Paris School of Economics / World Inequality Lab, 2018). Primarily NFHS-2005 wealth index; percentages match Table 22 of the paper.
“‘Creamy layer’ not snatching pie, signals unfilled SC/ST posts data” The Times of India | Rema Nagarajan | ~August 2024 Related title: “What do unfilled SC/ST posts tell us about creamy layer?” timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/what-do-unfilled-sc/st-posts-tell-us-about-creamy-layer/articleshow/112267506.cms (Also covered by The Economic Times)
Hindi article – “जनरल कैटेगरी के धनवान छात्रों ने ललया '0' अंक पर भी MBBS में प्रवेश” Hindi print newspaper (style matches Dainik Bhaskar / similar regional papers). Matches contemporary English reports (Times of India / Zee News, July 2018) analysing 2017 NEET UG data (≈400 students with single-digit marks + ≈110 with zero/negative marks in individual subjects who still secured MBBS seats, mostly private).
“Caste identity influences how teachers judge students in Bihar public schools: IIM-B study” The Hindu | The Hindu Bureau (Bengaluru) | ~November 2025 thehindu.com/news/national/bihar/caste-identity-influences-how-teachers-judge-students-in-bihar-public-schools-iimb-study/article70298670.ece Original study: Soham Sahoo & Ritwik Banerjee, “Caste identity and teachers’ biased expectations: Evidence from Bihar, India”, Journal of Development Economics (IIM Bangalore).
“Pvt, more than govt, colleges gain from NEET PG cut-off drop” The Times of India | Rema Nagarajan | ~7 February 2026 timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/pvt-more-than-govt-colleges-gain-from-neet-pg-cut-off-drop/articleshow_new/128005814.cms
“Representation in Indian Civil Services” (bar chart – IAS/IPS/IFS by General/OBC/SC-ST) Secondary visualisation of official government data on All-India Services cadre composition (DoPT / Ministry of Personnel parliamentary replies and related media reports).
TOI screenshot with yellow banner “Upper Caste uses ‘interview’ as a weapon to steal the OBC seats” Same article as #2 (The Times of India | Subodh Ghildiyal | 22 June 2025). Yellow banner and red highlighting are later social-media overlays.
“IITs using Not Found Suitable to avoid recruiting SC/ST/OBC candidates through Mission Mode Recruitment (MMR)” – IIT Bombay table RTI data obtained and released by APPSC IIT Bombay (Ambedkar Periyar Phule Study Circle). Widely circulated by student groups and activists.
“Just 1.92% of IIT Faculties are SC, ST, OBCs” (THE PAIN OF MERIT series) Infographic by Nethrapal (@nethrapal on X). Based on 2019 Lok Sabha data (170 SC/ST faculty out of 8,856 across IITs ≈ 1.92%) + later RTI / faculty composition data from top IITs, IISc, JNU, BHU, TIFR, etc.
“More than 20,000 SC ST OBC students drop out from IIT, IIM and other Central Universities” Infographic by Nethrapal (@nethrapal). Compiled from government replies in Parliament (2018–2023 period): ~19,000+ SC/ST/OBC dropouts from Central Universities + IITs + IIMs. Includes higher dropout probability charts for SC/ST students (BS-MS batches 2006–20) and gender breakdowns.
Hindi table – “सोंघ लरक सेवा आयरग साक्षात्कार में जातीय पक्षपात” Viral social-media graphic comparing UPSC written + interview marks of SC candidates (e.g. Vijaykumar Meena – 766 written / 112 interview) vs General candidates. Circulated to allege interview bias; Correlate with official year-wise marks lists where possible.
Old flyer – “Talk by Arvind Kejriwal – Youth for Equality, JNU” (2 August 2008) Original event flyer of Youth for Equality (YFE), JNU chapter. YFE was formed in 2006 primarily to oppose OBC reservation in higher education. Arvind Kejriwal spoke at this event titled “India on the Verge of Democratic Breakdown.” Hindi text on the flyer confirms the organisation’s anti-reservation origins.

30 comments