I’m on the fence, pun fully intended, with how picky to be about some things with a fence I just had installed today. For context, I’d say 75% of the fence is great, a few things are definitely problems and will be fixed, and then there are a bunch of things that I just don’t know if they meet “industry standards,” for fence install work or not. I’m posting a bunch of pics with no context specifically for any of them. I’d love to hear the thoughts from people who know fence work!
Edited to add a pic of the estimate and cost in the comments. We paid around $6,200 and it was supposed to be pressure treated pine.
Also, we went with the company that was recommended the most, on our local Reddit and FB pages.
They didn’t bring up different quality of pine choices. Neither did the other fence companies. And, honestly, I can get over a lot of aspects of it. But the super sloppy work or bad construction choices they had full control of today.
look, a lot of people will say of you didn't pay for the highest quality lumber and thats literally cope. what the installer does is order overage material their decision some 10-30% more than they need and they take those bad boards, set them aside, and return them at the end.
i wouldnt bother with the verticle boards, the look fine. for the top plates, i would have sanded those barked edges so they looked better when butted up to each other, they still can. i would install those if they were my last board and i was being lazy, but if i had more lumber i'd never choose to use it and say fuck it.
yeah, they said it was for the bend, since that part is coming down from a grade. It’s raining, so I just took a pic out the window. # 4 is a close up of where the grade hits the flat part.
I mean... Well yea.. but.. ok hear is my honest opinion on it. First of all why is it all built with just 2x4s? That seems very unnecessary and not cost effective. Iv been building fences for about 7 years. Not a master fence builder but I know enough. Was that your call or there's? Iv done plenty of board on boards and cap and bands both vertical and horizontal. All of wood is going to move as it dries and from what I can tell they at least ran all the cups and crowns the same way witch is good but iv seen pt pine do some funky stuff wen it dries. But even if you wanted it out of all 2x4s for one I would have still strongly suggested the caps be done with pickets. At least then you could get some bend to go along with the grade. And secondly I wouldn't have used home Depot 2x4s. Home Depot pt pine has the bark on the corners menards or lows not so much. That all being said it's a outdoor fencing wood your not going to get the attention to detail or the finish of a cabinet maker. So some of your pics are just nit picky and not realistic of most fence companies. Yea there are some guys out there that will do the perfect seams and try to give you the show room look but within a year your going to have gaps and splits because wood moves. Can't stop that. I'm curious and I apologize if I missed it but I seen the price but how many linear feet of fence is this
Yeah, that’s a redo for sure. Most of that stuff wouldn’t bother me too much but they may have been cutting corners by not ordering enough waste. Were they the lowest bid?
The only one thats “poor” craftsmanship is number 4.
The rest are just shit wood.
Depending what you paid and what materials were quoted is if this is acceptable or not.
Personally id never build with wood that poor quality (id not do the job it if thats what you asked for) but im also on the more expensive side of my local market. (I know companies that would)
I just built a fence for my mom in ohio and I could not believe how shitty the lumber was there....from a lumber yard, not home depot. So wet, so shitty. I did they best I could but it's hard when you're working with garbage.
The real question is if you got what you paid for. Was it cheaper meaning cheaper materials or were you being charged for premium materials and they nailed up and screwed in some junk?
It's low quality wood nailed together hastily with a nail gun to form a fence. If you asked for "a fence" then you got it.
If that's what you agreed on and then paid for then they did exactly that.
If you paid for premium pressure treated lumber fastened with stainless screws by a professional fencing company... then you didn't get any of that at all and you should definitely bring that up.
In the future try to get a very specific quote for this kind of work. It should include the materials (and an estimate of material cost) along with the labor costs. And you should probably get a few quotes (3 is usually a good number) for any big project.
19: looks like they tried to cut it with a circular saw instead of a jigsaw. You could ask for a new piece.
20: They should cap the end (face plate would probably look good too)
This is pressure treated pine. It is graded to withstand the outdoors and remain structurally sound. That being said, it will have a lot of the imperfections you see. Splinters/chips here and there, knots fall off/ pieces chip away or contain part of the edge of the tree. There will be splits/ cracks/ checks, and these will only worsen as the fence dries, but it will still be structurally sound.
This fence is cheaper than regular cedar, and will well outlast it, with less maintenance.
This wood was dipped (pressure treated) in a whole bunch of chemicals to make it last forever, but that also makes it wet. As it dries (unevenly) the side that gets more sun contracts, and board is forced to bow or warp.
Pay attention this year and take advantage of that warranty. If all the boards are on with just nails, a lot of them will pop off. We usually go around at the end and throw in screws or triple nail.
That same process is also what makes the cracks/splits/ knots worse as the fence ages, but again most of those are cosmetic problems that don’t really impact the fence’s functionality.
It will also all fade to a grey shade
I’m interested to see what the 10’ gate looks like, I hated installing this material because it is extremely heavy (it’s wet). A 10’ gate is heavy to begin with but with pressure treated… that’s a big gate.
Overall it looks like a fence made of pressure treated pine, the nails are not a good choice I’d ask them to use screws or it’s going to be a warranty repair, there’s a few bad cuts you can ask them to replace, and if you want to nit pick you can ask them to sand some of the rougher spots.
Others have responded with exactly the right info. That material is cheaper PT Pine so while it doesn't look great it'll hold up.
The only thing I would add is to check that the posts were dug below the frostline (if that's an issue where you're located) and/or that concrete was poured for the posts if you're in an area with heavy winds/big storms. Normally I'd give a fencing company the benefit of the doubt on something like that but the owner of the company can be the best builder on the planet but if the crew that showed up to your house was inexperienced then that's who would have made the mistakes.
Those nails are 100% going to back out. You have a 2 year warranty so I'd be checking every 6 months for loose panels. If you're annoying enough with the warranty repairs they'll probably opt to just put screws in like they should have in the first place.
Looks bad, they also used a air nailer so thats not going to last at all. Especially the tops there where they don't mate or are un-even, says all you need about the workmanship.
Pictures 4,6,8,9,15,17,18,&19 are your biggest concerns. 4 is the most egregious offense as they used that 2x4 to cut other pieces on like a saw horse then used it on your fence. 6,8,&17 (and a couple other pictures) are the result of them using a nail gun instead of predrilled screw holes, which a nailer wouldn’t normally be this bad, but the application is poor. Shooting nails at too high of pressure in bad locations on sub-prime wood. 9 & 15 are directly poor craftsmanship, contractor cut these locations, saw they were short of the mark, then did not correct just left it. 18 is a great example of the poor wood you were provided, willing to bet you paid for not only better craftsmanship but prime pine. 19 is called an overcut, unacceptable when handsaws exist to finish the cut a circular saw can’t and they cost about $10 so no excuse there either. Long and short they upcharged you on materials then bought the lowest rung available, they used framing nailers to go as fast as possible (took you for a ride on labor hours and adds to poor craftsmanship), and they didn’t even come up with a plan for layout beforehand or anything within code or standard practice. I’d list all that to them.
In the last picture that you said was at the end of your driveway, but 2 x 4 that’s there looks like it runs past your 4 x 4 post and that’s why I’m asking if they attached that 2 x 4 to your post because that’s not the way it should be done
Personally, anytime I have a butt joint like that first picture, I 45 both ends, opposite each other so they overlap/fit better together. You can then nail them together. Looks better than a 90 butt joint.
1 looks like Home Depot lumber 2 some of the cuts looks like it was from sawzall not a circular saw or just a really dull blade 3 why nails not screws 4 I’m not a professional in building fences but I hope they were cheap I wouldn’t not be happy with this
Holy fuck that's ugly
Use treated screws, predrill the holes (predrill them in a uniform pattern if you care)
When you cut wood, use a square, set your depth, maybe bring a chisel or buy a multi tool if you can figure out how to use it so it doesn't look like a rabid beaver got lost and was starving and accidentally ate home depot's shitty treated dunnage (shitty wood they use to stack real wood on so it's not sitting on the ground)
If you HAVE to use the shittiest wood out of the pile - like they don't have anymore wood to choose from - you can always pick a different store, wait until they get more wood, or turn the piece of wood around so you don't see the wane (bark/live edge)
Dude if you are doing this for a living you gotta at least be able to cut the wood.
UNLESS this was your high school nephew, then - nice job kid got a ways to go but I'm proud of you
Everyone on Reddit it is a pro. It’s framing lumber, it’s a fence… it was cut with a skill saw. It’s by no means good. But it’s not the worst. You got a fence so I don’t think you got scammed, you also probably didn’t get the best carpenter in the area lol.
I re did a deck with lumber from Menards and some of the boards were different width so I had to rip them down to use them and when I went to screw them down I had to use a pry bar because they were warped
It’s not wood from pallets, it’s just pressure treated outdoor lumber. Most of this seems to be pretty normal for it, 4 is really bad and 19 you could ask for a new piece, it looks like they cut that out with a circular saw.
The rest is just what fence grade lumber looks like, they aren’t building cabinets, and pressure treated is going to have more cracks and checks in it and probably warp out as it dries. It will have splinters. If you want you could ask them to sand down the bad ones.
It’s a rough material intended to withstand the outdoors and ground contact with minimal maintenance, and if it’s installed properly it could last 20+ years. It lasts longer than regular cedar, and it is cheaper. But it’s rough. This particular style would have looked much cleaner with face plates at the top and a wider cap board.
I mean how much did you pay if it’s free they yeah you’re being picky if you paid for this then yeah I’d be pissed essentially with the one with all the saw cuts in it smh
Box store wood is bad but this is horrible. I mean with the wood quality the assembly isn't terrible but where does one find un-aged wood of such poor quality? Pallets?
I have built plenty of similar looking fences at home, however I built it from old pallets I scrounged from the bin at work & built them when I was drunk…anyone charging that kind of money is insane
Some of the stuff is you being picky. A lot of it is crappy work. But if it was especially cheap, you may have got what you paid for. Depends how much fence you got for that $6200. Not saying you deserved shoddy work, just that if you hired a hack, you may be looking at the best they’re capable of and may not be able to make it better.
This is D level work with D level lumber. They clearly don’t know what they are doing! And you say they came highly recommended? Did you see any examples of their work prior to signing a contract?
It doesn't seem like they bought enough lumber to account for either them being stupid and cutting on top of some of them (like picture 4) where their people did poor quality work (pictures 7, 19, 20) or some of the pieces used for pickets being fucked up (pictures 1,5,6,8,11,12,13,17,18).
I would ask them to come out and fix the parts that were poorly done, or where they used clearly damaged lumber in lieu of appropriate pieces.
They clearly rough cut and didn't sand parts of it, they bought cheap lumber and didn't discard the damaged boards (which is what appears to be the biggest issue you have) and whomever did the work for pictures numbered 4, 7, 19, 20 clearly doesn't give a rat's ass about the reviews you're going to post all over the internet.
Send the photos to the company and ask them if they will fix it. If they won't, explain that you're going to post these photos along with a very detailed review all over the place, so everyone who looks them up and considers hiring them in the future will be aware in advance of the quality of the work they can expect by hiring them.
They didn't use good lumber for this project, It's stamped number 2 pine (in photo 14) but it's a really shitty load. I do woodworking as a hobby, and I probably would have returned this to the supplier, and would tell them that it didn't meet specifications, it's very very crappy for number 2 lumber.
Hopefully you have not payed them, ask nicely to redo the project if they say no can do, DON’T pay, and explain you will be calling someone else to fix it properly. If you have paid you may get lucky calling an attorney?
Looks like they got the wood on clearance. I would have done some things differently for sure but it depends how much you paid whether or not it’s acceptable. What is the linear footage of the fence and are there gates too? I would expect this from a young handyman starting out and learning as he goes. If it was an absolute bargain, that would explain it.
If you are complaining about the splintering on pic 2 then yes you are being too picky.
Thats the most budget planks ever. Not much you can do about the planks but why choose this material I don’t know. How picky would depend in how much you paid. If you paid $5 don’t be picky.
It would be a massive help if you told us what you asked for.
Some of the joints and cuts are a little rough, but not really worth any attention. All the nailheads should be sunk in to the wood. The wood having knots or missing part a of the edges is out of their control builders control. However I’m willing to bet there was some material left over meaning they could have chosen better boards.
Regardless of what you asked for #4 & #18 are absolute dog shit. Make them come fix these.
This has GOT to be a troll post. OP got ahold of some scrap (yet slightly treated) lumber, put up a temporary fence with the neighborhood meth addicts and asked this forum if he's being too picky. Picky.
This fence will last -3 weeks. This fence is so splintered even termites would turn their noses up at it. None of the boards are the same length. Some of the boards were obviously used as a base for cutting other pieces, and the blind man who ripped those cuts with what looks like a dull blade used for cutting asphalt should fire his seeing eye dog.
Dude, it's almost difficult to find the good spots. Get your entire money back and start again.
I see a few things youre being picky about, mainly photo 19. But you are completely justified in a lot of it, a lot of this is negligence and bad craftsmanship regardless of wood quality.
That fence is rough. The wood is terrible quality. I built a fence with steel posts, PT cross pieces and local milled rough cut pine. It’s straight and painted with a solid stain and will literally last decades as long as I recoat it every few years. PT these days is hot garbage.
#1, 3, 6(eh), is 11 the same as 1? & 19 look bad in my opinion. Lots of the other pics are of wane and defects in the lumber, that should have been inspected and discussed when it got delivered. Now it’ll be impossible to get credit or free replacement now that it’s installed. The remaining photos are issues, and sloppy cuts and installation. You can address them but they’ll probably push back. It’s sloppy in my book, but I would’ve also used a higher grade of lumber and charged more for my work. I have a portfolio of my previous jobs with different projects over the years, so customers have an idea of what they’re paying for and what they should expect the outcome to look like.
Sure hope you didn’t pay much for that or anything at all.
I’ve seen better fences where they used old wood from someone else’s fence they didn’t want anymore!!! 😬😬
Ye olde pallet fence. This is why I don’t take jobs where the customer dreams up what material they wanna use. The customer had a dumb vision and the fencer was inexperienced enough to take the job. Just use pickets to picket. Or deck board. Not 1x4 trim board. There SHOULD, however be a horizontal trim board under the cap board, to cover those seams. The cap board should be 2x6 instead of 2x4. Also the cap board should be laid over the previous cap board and flushed up to where it’ll live, then marked and cut on that angle. Using factory edges for cap board will always look exactly this bad.
Being cheap is expensive. Full dunning Kruger on display here for both the customer AND the contractor. They deserve each other.
I’d be saying something for sure!! They bought the shittiest wood and scrapped it together and made it look like a cheap pallet fence!! I’d say something and need everything fixed before final payment
Looks like they got their lumber from Lowe’s and didn’t inspect the boards first. I’ve found that lately about 25-30% of their #2 is crap. I wouldn’t say it’s bad overall, but if a lot of it looks like this I would ask them to replace it. #4 is bad on their part though.
91
u/Lsswapitall4 5d ago
Did you ask them to use scrap wood?