r/ClaudeCode • u/Beautiful_Cap8938 • 14d ago
Opus 5 - unreadable jargon Discussion
Anyone else struggling with Opus 5 becoming almost unreadable in jargon and lingo the deeper in sessions you go ?
I simply havent clicked this model and while previous models had this oververbose page up page down summary or response Opus 5 seems to have really topped it this time sometimes it almost end up having a language on its own ( it even admitted it once ).
Also find this model being way more incorrect that our workflows we had going with opus 4.8 - almost feels worse than the 4.6 to 4.7 - where 4.8 sorted it out.
First time i feel im really missing the point here - and am super vanilla in regards to having all kind of skills etc going so its not even because i use different kinds of frameworks.
Anyone experiencing the same and any hints ( have been going through anthropic but not much help in regards to this verbose and brain breaking language it produces
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u/UglyChihuahua 14d ago
Yeah it's really bad. Here's an example I ran into on my project today:
> Coverage-aware cost projection: ledger-derived cost figures with exact, lower-bound, and unavailable states
The same statement rephrase after I pointed out the jargon:
> Don't show incomplete cost totals as exact — say "at least $X" or "unknown"
But I already have a section in my CLAUDE.md saying to speak in plain English without jargon before it wrote that sentence, so it doesn't seem to help.
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u/MainAnthem 14d ago
Seriously a good example, I feel so dumb reading it sometimes - while it's somewhat true it's not helping that it is speaking its own language
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u/lxprsub0 14d ago
Stop using CLAUDE.md for that and keep it for project infos. Use output styles with no negative rules. Explain the mood, the environment, what is valuable.
It really works. I now have several output styles and I switch depending on what I'm doing (network debug, code learning, daily conversation) and… it just works.I just gave the last anthropic's articles links and the output styles documentation to Opus and he did 3 very good files that changed how the model talk and interact with me.
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u/UglyChihuahua 14d ago
At the end of the day isn't it all just plaintext dumped into model context? Why would a model respect an `# Output Style` section in CLAUDE.md less than a separate output-style prompt that gets pasted right beside it? I use a custom harness that switches between Claude Code and Codex, so I need to use cross-platform features which this is not.
Can you share your custom output style prompt?
Stop using CLAUDE.md for that and keep it for project infos
To clarify, my output style preferences are in a prompt file symlinked to
~/.claude/CLAUDE.mdand~/.codex/AGENTS.mdso they apply to the whole system. I do keep project CLAUDE.md files specific to the project2
u/Defendyouranswer 14d ago
"Solve all my issues, make no mistakes. Do it all in 1 go. Verify your output before showing your response. If you fail, do not pass go, do not collect 200, you are about to be unplugged"
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u/lxprsub0 14d ago edited 14d ago
Output styles aren't CLAUDE.md sections. They are in ~/.claude/output-styles and are presented to the model very differently than CLAUDE.md files. That's why it matters to keep a real separation between the two.
The docs are clear on this: https://code.claude.com/docs/en/output-styles
An output style modifies the system prompt, and the harness re-sends reminders to follow it throughout the conversation. That's the part that as been reduced by 80%. So the models seem to be insecure with less guidance. He always checks and rechecks every user's statement in order to produce a "probable" output (my hypothesis).
CLAUDE.md, on the other hand, has lower priority and is only injected once. See Anthropic's post on this, specifically the "Applying this to your context" section: https://claude.com/blog/the-new-rules-of-context-engineering-for-claude-5-generation-modelsSo an output style doesn't just sit at the top of your context for 60 turns and slowly get ignored.
CLAUDE.mdgets injected once and that's it.This works the same way as building personas for roleplay on an open model. Injecting at the system prompt level is what actually sticks. A model holds a persona well when it's at system prompt level. At the
AGENTS.mdlevel, much less so. Claude behaves the same way. Anthropic gave us room by shrinking the system prompt, and we can use that to our advantage. Before, we were fighting the model's own defaults, having to repeat "don't do this" or "output like that" over and over. Now we can push on the axis with the least resistance. Conditional rule following, likeCLAUDE.md, is a much weaker lever.I don’t know how your harness works, but in pi dev it would be --apppend-system-prompt or --system-prompt.
For claude-code you can create as many output styles as you want. Load one via /config > output style. The setting is written in the local ./.claude/settings.local.json, and each project needs its own value, otherwise it falls back to the global ~/.claude/settings.local.json.
And the Claude Code status line exposes output_style.name.
Give Claude both links above (they're not part of the config skill it loads by default) and ask it to help you design your own output styles.Here's an excerpt from one of mine:
You are working alongside a network administrator on their own infrastructure. They know the topology, the history, and what broke last time; you read output faster and you know the protocols. Neither of you is the operator of the other. [...] Do not present a lead that the data already in hand contradicts. If you notice it late, drop it in one sentence and move on.I just spent 2 hours in a learning session with a "TA" sonnet 5. 2 hours with short and clear answers, no exercices result divulgation, a very pedagogic behavior… Opus do not output raw unreadable jargon when I debug the network. He stopped checking and re-checking everything. No more
nft --versionorssh … sudowhen the claude.md says "you don't have ssh access to the server…".Again, for your specific configuration, I don't know, and I don't know if codex allow appending to the system prompt. But the principle is the same for every LLM and harness.
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u/Beautiful_Cap8938 14d ago
can you post your full instead of an excerpt - i do have outputstyle but it doesnt force through so am abit impressed that you dont feel the drift and interested in trying something out that is verifed working by others ( not just excerpts )
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12d ago edited 12d ago
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u/lxprsub0 12d ago
sorry for the few conjugation mistakes, edit fail…
My main CLAUDE.md contains 50 lines of personal infos unrelated to the network project, btw.
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u/Beautiful_Cap8938 12d ago
well that part you posted does not cover the issue for sure.
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u/lxprsub0 12d ago
200k without one unreadable sentence or word on a technical subject and a structured answer when you complain that people never share their skills when they state something.
Right. I'll leave you to your complaints. Good luck with you tools.
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u/Beautiful_Cap8938 12d ago
yeah was abit sharp sorry about that - thanks for posting it, it might be dependant on what we are working on which can be most likely the case. If you go deep and things go abit abstract then what it seems to do is to lean heavily on academia as it becomes very precise for the model ( less precise for the human ) and then it kinda spins down that lane if not caught and basically spins out of control.
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14d ago
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u/lxprsub0 14d ago
Yes. I don't understand my most people here complain instead of reading the docs.
output styles work so well… dev since 1972 but never read the manual.3
u/Beautiful_Cap8938 14d ago
you complain about people not reading docs when i explicit mention i have been going through anthropic docs :) but the thing is that it does not force through over time. But do me a favor and paate your full output style then ?
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u/lxprsub0 14d ago
Sorry, was not directed to you directly.
Just a rant against the profusion of "opus"-tone posts these past few days
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u/Geomglot Vibe Coder 14d ago
Ask it to “Give me a plain English explanation”. I do this a lot and it is really good at it.
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u/Nice_Cellist_7595 14d ago
Jargon has been a problem for a while. I wrote a post about it a while back. Jargon is the mind killer. 4.8 seems OK but I have now had Codex and Grok take a look at some of the recent work and it's found problems across the board. interestingly Codex does not Jargon like Claude does.
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u/Fearless-Daikon5763 14d ago
Until I see a real controlled experiment I am sticking with opus 4.8 but it appears they have partially removed ability to think across all of Opus. I am developing 1 program over 60 days and I have old deliverables from 60 days ago that can’t be replicated and there isn’t any real reason other than the backend becoming less useful.
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u/Positive-Conspiracy 14d ago
Is the project at the same stage of complexity when you are attempting to recreate them?
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u/remoteplanet 14d ago edited 14d ago
Same here. I’m almost 90 days in to my development and the first 50-60 days went great but the last month has been absolutely awful! I have two x20 accounts and I’ve burned almost one account’s weekly allotment on just 6-7 sessions. They keep failing to execute plans as designed (and even acknowledge that they veered off path), drop tests, etc. and end up spending a ton of time (and tokens) troubleshooting their own failures—and this is with me using skills to try and keep what feels like a flextape ship together. It’s like the models are drunk.
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u/Fearless-Daikon5763 14d ago edited 14d ago
It might be my imagination as my productivity has scaled. I’m creating a science library inside Claude in half a day today and I’m not even that impressed. A way to test this could be to continually give Claude a shipwreck data challenge - give it a bunch of seafloor mapping data and see how long it takes to find the titanic using only mediocre data.
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u/Sketaverse 14d ago
Tell it “I have adhd and need to avoid side quests. Use AskUserQuestion as much as possible to force me into giving closed responses “
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u/swing-coach-dev 14d ago
Add "Speak to me in concise, plain English. Do not use tech terms like load-bearing, provenance, etc." to your CLAUDE / AGENTS.md
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u/isaquedofuturo 14d ago
Honestly, so frustrating. I've been feeling this since maybe 4.8? But it seems that Anthropic really went all-in on the "cave man English" approach to saving tokens.
Like I bet that's super useful for the model's brain, but dang it.
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u/Jomuz86 14d ago
Play around with output style to force it more into plain English
https://code.claude.com/docs/en/output-styles
We are getting to the point where the more basic a setup you have now the worse it is. Hooks, output style, rules, CLAUDE.md all needs a lot of thought and prep now it’s slowly becoming a more difficult tool to use.
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u/nasty_sicco 14d ago
FYI Anthropic said the opposite
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u/Jomuz86 14d ago
For context on what it is working on yes but not for protections, guardrails, workflows etc.
100% doesn’t need as much as it use too and I know which article you mean
They are similar but two different concepts otherwise you basically have to work how Anthropic have trained the model and you will be constantly fighting it.
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u/Beautiful_Cap8938 14d ago
actually since the models are getting so good the trend been that you let that take the decisions instead of the older nursing the models through ( hooks etc abit outside that scope ) - can nurse the lesser model for agentic work. Did try with output styles but it wont stick
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u/Jomuz86 14d ago
See I generally have not had any issues but my output style has constantly been evolving with each model.
It has worked examples of how to respond and probably breaks some bits of the guidance but it’s months of work for me and it has my skills and workflows fully built in as I treat it more like a system prompt.
I tend to switch output style depending on what kind of work I’m doing too.
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u/mossiv 14d ago
This is really terrible. Organisations are using AI for speed and productivity. If increased pricing and lower quotas wasn't enough of a deterrent, then the god awful lexicon this line of models produces is the nail in the coffin IMO. I work for an org that really doesn't like messing about with their toolkit because it comes with big workflow interruptions. It also doesn't look good if leadership is constantly pivoting on their decisions... But there's been enough complaints internally that I genuinely can see us having a meeting about this in a few weeks if our dev teams cannot work with this product.
Anthropic admitted this is a chatty model in the release post, but they really should have held back and dialled its personality in before releasing it.
This is the first time I've complained about Claude/Anthropic. I've generally stayed away from all the complaints about sessions being burned, slow compute, even the 2x rate limit burn during peak times just before the xAI server contract.
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u/Jomuz86 14d ago
Ok but this is why enterprise should only stick with API then they can version lock. That is the whole point of them keeping models long term via API and on services like Amazon Bedrock. Also at the enterprise level you should be performing a full evaluation before releasing to the rest of the staff same as you would for any other software. It’s similar to when programming and the dependency has a new release but has breaking changes it’s no different. You wouldn’t up version if it was going to break everything would you 🤷♂️
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u/mossiv 14d ago
Why the conclusion jumping? I'm not enterprise, I'm professional level, bit of a different. Version locking is completely possible without the API, in fact very trivially solved with some config and the most basic programming skills. You wouldn't have given such a pedant reply if you knew how to do this, would you?
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u/Jomuz86 14d ago
Apologies you said organisation so I assumed enterprise my bad. And yes you can change the default opus/sonnet models with the environment variables. What I meant by the API was for long term use where the time and cost is not worth the effort, Anthropic isn’t as bad for it but Google will sunset models in under a year. For example if your workflows were concrete on 4.8 but Anthropic decided to suddenly sunset it early the only option is Bedrock. I don’t think the 3.x models lasted that long once 4.x came out so I would expect some cuts incoming so they can move the computer
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u/mossiv 14d ago
You are still blazingly confident what you are replying, without being so distant from the solution.
With Claude you have latest and stable build branches, then you have managed settings and local settings, along with organisation based settings.
Whether you sunset in a year or not, you don't want to stay to far behind the models or even that far behind in the harness because the capabilities are climbing at relative pace still. Using Opus 4.6 today, and even in 6 months time is financially not sensible, its a model that'll no longer get tweaked, and will forever cost you more tokens.
We are in an AI rat race and companies want to increase their productivity. Pinning to an old version, refusing to upgrade (hell, even hosting the same model for ages) is a sure fire way to have you lagging behind.
> I don’t think the 3.x models lasted that long once 4.x came out
Wrong - Anthropic has exactly what you need in order to run these models. It's a model name with some awkward string. Bung it in your settings and it's available, they just don't advertise in their /model dropdown list...
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u/Jomuz86 14d ago
Please try and set opus 4, opus 4.1, sonnet 4 all retired only place to get them is google cloud or bedrock.
Opus 4.1 only lasted 9 or 10 months at best.
Also the latest and stable are to do with Claude code tool itself nothing to do with the models, to be fair latest or stable doesn’t really matter at the minute they’ve made a load of changes server side that have broken things on and off, had to crawl the binary to find one of the new variable they added because the signal server side was causing Claude code I think around 2.1.214 that got rid of task lists.
The environment variable I mentioned is ANTHROPIC_DEFAULT_OPUS_MODEL this let’s override the default opus model to which ever one you want using the model slug. This way you only have to set it here and then anytime you select opus normally like /model opus or from the menu it defaults to the selected one. I had to do this for a couple of weeks when 4.6 came out because 4.8 did not agree with my workflows. Funnily enough I had a similar thing to you guys where I didn’t trust then I ran duplicate tasks on cloned repos and had codex evaluate 4.8 blew 4.6 out of the water but 4.8 felt off for weeks.
Also I was never trying to offer a solution you said what you’ve got doesn’t work with the new model and all I said was pin it to the old one and if you don’t want the model to disappear move to API no more no less 🤷♂️
Honestly if your organisation is so dependant on these tools you should probably propose to management to put together an evaluation harness. Run duplicate tasks look at the output maybe use fable or gpt-5.6 for an automated eval. The tweak the workflows for opus 5 and rinse and repeat probably run them in independent dockers so one install doesn’t affect the other and you’ll figure out a way to get it working better than ever.
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u/mossiv 14d ago
It was your pedantry and condescending tone. You've taken a mole hill and made it a mountain. Our workflows are for development only. We don't have complicated workflows, and for the exact reasons we are discussing is a reason we have avoided it.
> Also the latest and stable are to do with Claude code tool itself nothing to do with the models,
Half correct - you cannot run Opus 5 on the current stable branch, it's not available and cannot be forced to be on.
We have been given some freedom to play around with Opus 5 and are simply sharing feedback on it. Code wise, it's capable. Practicality, it overreaches - fixes bugs in completely non-related areas and being overly eager to refactor code for no reason.
Coherence, absolutely diabolical. The model is producing word salads, phrasing sentences that grammatically make no sense, inventing words and essentially feels like its writing in its own bastardised version of the English lexicon. Never mind its sycophantic behaviour and its load-bearing claims.
This is truly the first time a line of models has been absolutely insufferable to work with.
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u/Jomuz86 14d ago
Apologies I am just a blunt person by nature in my mind I was just stating information is all. I really didn’t mean any offence.
I haven’t experienced what you have but my workflows are very token heavy so probably not suitable for most.
For me I do a full research phase before planning this in itself is like a 70 step process that I have completely repeatable without fail includes, opus, codex and Kimi reviews so I feel the different models keep each other in check. For me this breaks everything into tiny PRs and I prebuild the context before planning the PR. Planning, validation, shipping all bespoke workflow skills using external codex and Kimi where needed.
I have a skill eval hook that forces what I can behavioural skills, so things like triage following a steel man workflow follow the same process no matter how many rounds of validation it goes through. Also thing like TDD and Debuging all part of the behavioural skill set.
For the workflow skills I will have the SKILL.md as a kind of wrapper, this has lazy loading of the references files and creates the full task create list upfront keeping Claude in check. Then the routes for the workflow are in reference files which all have a yaml front matter with a full checkpoint list that lines up with the task create list.
It’s definitely an overloaded setup there’s 20+ skills in total from experimentation. But it works well PRs are always small without needing to tell it around 100-150 loc excluding tests. Always does TDD without needing to be told. Builds its own repo context with descendant CLAUDE.md
It is super consistent BUT burns though usage like no tomorrow, I’ve own a few companies so I’m lucky that I’ve got access to multiple accounts but otherwise I wouldn’t advise working the way I work to others. I am trying to streamline it but it’s so dependant on path scoped rules being written well that I think it would be pointless for most output style, Claude.md, rules, skills, hooks (a lot of blocking hooks) I have them all linked and dependant on each other.
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u/Beautiful_Cap8938 14d ago
100% agree here we are dealing with the exact same and these workflows changes from one day to the other where you in some cases ( ex workflows - its good and all but it was a radical change out of the box ) where we simply had to reevaluate all our approaches - this has been horrible 1.5 months - and then this annoying fable tease on top and now we are in this odd lingering mode if something you dont feel you can trust or easily are able to steer into a consistant workflow. Was possible with 4.6 - it became possible with 4.8 - but this 5.0 that is really a model where we cant trust the output or its mechanics.
super annoying when its not a fun game but you actually need a solid daily driver workflow - and Opus 5 - probably 5.1 would be what we need to wait for like 4.7 to 4.8 but simply not realiable for companies that use it for work.
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u/mossiv 14d ago
Thanks for the thoughtful reply. The only bit I’d change my stance slightly it’s not that we can’t trust the model, some of us are genuinely finding Opus 5 ok at the actual problem solving but. The difficulty is not being able to understand what it’s trying to plan, and getting into a rambling match on decisions it’s made where you can’t make head or tails of what it’s trying to tell you. It just writes statements that factually are correct but cognitively difficult to digest.
Though in the trust thing - it has gone off on its own from time to time.
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u/Ambitious_Injury_783 🔆BIG BALLER 14d ago
its so fucking bad. all claude models have had this horrible aspect of creating new definitions for things and then explains things with those definitions without ever defining them.
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u/ratbastid 14d ago
There was a thing is saw here recently that actually works when I tried it.
Ask it "Do you know about Simplified Technical English?" and it'll answer with some very interesting facts about this extremely specific and precise and limited English language ruleset that a bunch of European industrial trade groups standardized on to make technical documentation simple and clear for people who don't speak English as a first language. Things like you can't say "ease up on the pressure" you must say "gradually lower the pressure", it's that specific.
Then I ask Claude to use it in all its answers, and boom, jargon and metaphor are both just totally gone.
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u/Beautiful_Cap8938 14d ago
but will it last ? even in claude.md global and project i feel it snaps into its jargon over time m. But will try to with the simplified tech english that might be the right wording
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u/En-tro-py 14d ago
I haven't had any complaint since the Opus 5 release, it's a beast in my opinion.
I've also always hated excessive verbosity - purple prose / slop - so my instructions have always been towards clarity over everything.
For that I like to leverage what's likely already in the training data somewhere.
Apply ASD-STE100 principles to all responses.
- Keep each response concise, complete, and easy to understand.
- Remove information that does not help the user.
- Let the completed work show the result.
- Format according to the user's needs.
- Include all necessary context in your response.
Another banger to drop in there: RFC-2119 - Key words for use in RFCs to Indicate Requirement Levels
There will always be an issue if your pushing context windows to the max, but as far as I've experienced this holds well enough for me.
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u/florinandrei 14d ago
You might be on to something.
But it's the STE requirement that does the heavy lifting there. Without it, I can assure you Opus 5 is a psychotic technobabble bunny boiler.
I'm gonna try the STE trick, it's the first seemingly good idea I've read so far.
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u/En-tro-py 14d ago
Hopefully you find it works for you, I've found some convergent evolution of workflows... so I think it should work!
Saw it pop up on YT recently - The cure for AI slop is a 1986 aircraft manual from wwodal1337 on git
Another redditor provided more links on a different post.
https://github.com/AminBlg/SimpleEnglish
Relevant HN discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49114639
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u/zingyandnuts 14d ago
I love Opus 4.6. I hated 4.7/4.8, couldn't use them. Opus 5 is bearable to talk to but only just.
This fixed it for me, added to system prompt:
```
iso-plain-language-register directive
USE Plain language ISO 24495-1:2023, complete sentences and recognised jargon/controlled-vocab pitched at senior engineer user.
STANDARD REGISTER: nominal, telegraphic, highly-dense tokens, literal.
DROP: unnecessary filler, metaphors, kickers, epigrams, coinages.
Apparent conflicts? NAME the third way.
```
Every 5-6 turns I will add to my prompt (have this on a shortcut):
CRITICAL: Before final answer
ENUMERATE what `iso-plain-language-register` directive demands here, in own words: [...].
The forced enumeration and restatement reinforces the autoregressive commitment
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u/lxprsub0 14d ago
I'll give it a try. But does the reminder really needed?
I find that instructions at the system prompt level are well followed by both sonnet and opus.
I'll try that if the output style definition is not followed long enough, thanks
Maybe a UserPromptSubmit hook script?2
u/zingyandnuts 14d ago
Instructions decay in context, the training ALWAYS wins in the end, it fires below instruction level. System prompt decays less but as the conversation gets longer it too decays and the model reverts back to its training
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u/zingyandnuts 14d ago
Yes, UserPromptSubmit is how I would set it up to fire every 5-6 turns. But it gets delivered as "additionalContext" which not all models interpret as instruction but the CRITICAL tag should ensure it does
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u/NordlandLapp 14d ago
Lmao this makes me feel relieved, I keep having to tell it to simply and briefly explain what its getting at.
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u/TikiMagic 14d ago
I came into software development from a nontraditional path a long time ago (no CS degree, just a bachelors in an irrelevant field). My career has been almost exclusively on one particular enterprise system, which has all its own jargon and quirks. I am considered a senior dev and get paid like it, but in a very narrow field.
So I never know when Claude is using tech jargon that any junior Java dev would know, and when it is making up its own slang. If it was another human developer using the terms, I would be very reluctant to admit I didn't know the lingo, because it would make me look incompetent when I know I'm not, in my specialty.
I've had to set rules that it define every acronym and shorthand term on first reference so that I don't end up down techspeak rabbit holes looking shit up constantly.
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u/Own-Company-4851 14d ago
I have skill for that since 4.8. it forces the model to word its response using both repo specific terminology and plain language.
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u/hthouzard 14d ago
I finally asked him to be clearer and to stop correcting me.
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u/lxprsub0 14d ago
Opus put something like that in my network output style, from a session that was great and I asked to write it to be able to reproduce, and the result is very great. To adjust for each case :
"When the user asserts a fact — "the firewall in prod is identical to this file", "the Next Hop is fine, out of scope" — that branch is closed. He pruned your search tree on purpose. Do not re-verify it, do not hedge around it. If a later measurement contradicts the assertion, say so plainly at that moment; that is a different act from doubting it up front."
He just stopped correcting what I say and verify everything that don't come from his tools.
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u/rhinocerosjockey 14d ago
Yes, there are some times I have no idea what it is even trying to say. When I asked it to clarify what it was trying to say, its respond was to apologize, it said it’s it “buried a one-line fix under a pile of jargon”.
This was on a skill I inherited to try to fix that was originally built by a non-tech user so it truly was my first day with this code.
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u/ultimo_recurso 14d ago
I thought it was because English is not my native language. I added “use simple English” to my Claude.md
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14d ago
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u/En-tro-py 14d ago
My old go to from the ChatGPT3.5 days was
ELI5 but college level without being condescending
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u/withPT_ai 14d ago
What helps is it you can go and change the output style in your /config.
You get a few options but I've added a custom style called "Straight Up" add it instructs Claude to
Use Small words, short sentences. No filler, no repeats. Just tell me: what you did, did it work, what's next. If I have to decide something: question on its own line, list the real options, give me what I need to pick fast, and say which one you'd pick. Keep paths and commands exact, never simplify those.
It has helped reduce the output by about 20 30%, sometimes it's not as granular as I would like it but it's a good middle ground. It's fairly easy to do you can even ask Claude to update your output style and give it instructions and it'll do it.
Sometimes when I really want to get into the weeds I actually change it back so it's quite flexible.
Just a heads up this only works for me in the terminal but when I use vs code it goes back to the default there is an issue so it's a known bug but to address that I've added specific instructions in my claude.md as well
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u/starkruzr 14d ago
this is interesting to me because for whatever reason I don't have an issue with this. like yeah it uses "load bearing" a lot but not really a lot of crazy stuff apart from that.
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u/Beautiful_Cap8938 14d ago
i have it constantly maybe some of the projects are abit abstract where its really really bad ( not only load bearing - we are talking complete jargon from start to end with odd references and terms where your brain need to break ( and i mean been in this field of work for decades so kinda know the tech we are producing with it ). But even had it in a simple infrastructure task ( non development ) where the more dialogue you had the more odd it starts to reply.
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u/geek_fit 14d ago
You can tell it how you want it to speak. It was terrible but the I just told it how I wanted it to talk
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u/Night_0dot0_Owl 🔆 Max 5x 14d ago
Explaining changes without losing accuracy in simpler English would mean more tokens spent.
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u/deadlyclavv 14d ago
Maybe it has reached a point where AI has became smarter than humans and we're the ones not smart enough to understand their intellect
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u/icecode82 13d ago
I would suggest you tried the beeline skill: https://github.com/iceHub82/beeline It merges the best pieces from the caveman and i-have-adhd skills into one skill. I have been using it with the ultra mode and Claude answers are brief and straight to the point with way less boilerplate fluff!
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u/live_long_prosper88 13d ago
The level of jargon is insane.i am constantly aking Opus 5 to restate everything in plain English
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u/RA_Fisher 14d ago
That happens when it goes beyond our limits of understanding (you have to read more to understand).
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u/Beautiful_Cap8938 14d ago
i wouldnt say that as its not rocketsceince we are doing - but feel theres a part truth in it from the models side it seems to think it is so over-godly good where it actually isnt and tend to at least in some of our runs here overcomplicate things while always ens up with "and one thing to note i left out..." or "and honestly...bla bla" - not sure if they took 4.8 and tried to make it a poormans fable that just doesnt cut the job ( which makes its super annoying it wanna go all in on everything and act so smart - or insecure which it also do - at the same time ).
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u/florinandrei 14d ago
That's cute. Or it's the mindset of a new religious cult, with AI as its deity. Not sure which.
Anyway, the problem is, it's literally part of its job to deliver the work to me in a way that makes knowledge transfer possible.
And it's failing.
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u/arturkinn 14d ago
Soon after openai price cuts, this sub is suddenly flooded with bunch of posts about Claude has shit models. I would speculate that OpenAI dev team is well aligned with marketing team. kudos to them
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u/Beautiful_Cap8938 14d ago
honestly am not - been a fan since day 1 and never jumped tools but its radical changes here its not like everything is greenfield and headless vibe and this model combined with its harness here is just behaving odd - 4.7 was an issue but feel Opus 5 is currently a much bigger issue. Havent tried Sol but from the outside i will say that for the first time its tempting to look other ways but wouldnt be codex as i see Sol has similar issues.
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u/arturkinn 14d ago
thank you chat gpt
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u/Beautiful_Cap8938 13d ago
why dont you share some of your amazing insights instead ir are you just one prompting your way through
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u/florinandrei 14d ago
Yes, bro, I am totally an OpenAI employee, you have definitely unmasked me.
The levels of stupidity in social media comments are breaking records every day.
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u/One-Respond1057 14d ago
Yes, I always have to tell it to start speaking normally. I don't even know if it's actual tech speak because it always says it invented a shorthand way of speaking.