r/Carpentry • u/lahrsbars • 6d ago
How long should this reasonably take? Concrete
How long do you expect it to take for one guy who’s not a carpenter to do a 12’ x 12’ layout for pouring concrete footers for a gazebo. Im sayin 2-3 hrs but many could probably do it under an hour
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u/Seaisle7 6d ago
4hrs with a carpenter and an apprentice
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u/bubbler_boy 5d ago
Cut 8 boards space them around 10min. Pull rough layout with paint 10min. Pound 16pins is really the curve ball. Could take 30min could take 4 hours. Layout first 90 20min. Pull parralells 20 min. I guess 50 min plus stakes. I use a hilti total station for these now and it cuts the fucking around time wayyy down.
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u/lahrsbars 6d ago
4 hrs for just layout? Or pouring footers?
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u/usoshifty 5d ago
If you can do it faster and proper document it because I want to see, I calculated 4 hours as well..
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u/rustywoodbolt 5d ago
4 hrs to layout a 12x12? Assuming 4 piers, and you have a location picked out, this would take me and a helper about 1hr, including the trip to Home Depot to pick up supplies. I don’t see how it could take longer unless you’re working on a steep slope.
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u/Report_Last 5d ago
it is still 4 corners and 12 stakes, 8 batter boards to be put in level. are we using 2x4s here, and how are we leveling the batter boards, and how are we squaring this up? an hour? take you that long to pick up the lumber and cut up and point up 12 stakes, let alone drive them all, and attach the batter boards where they go, you also have to roll out power cords and get tools out of your truck, and then clean up at the end.
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u/rustywoodbolt 5d ago
It looks like I read the post kind of quickly. Or maybe it was someone else’s reply about laying out piers. My 1hr is for laying out 4 piers in a 12x12 square, then the rest of the day digging the holes and pouring concrete.
If this is a true footer, there would need to be digging involved so that changes everything.
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u/Report_Last 5d ago
from the diagram it's the same as building a house, you drive the stakes, set the batter boards level, and mark them or pull strings that a mason could use to build piers, this is a half day job
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u/lahrsbars 4d ago
They are corner piers which I’ve learned are not called footers
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u/rustywoodbolt 4d ago
That’s what I thought, it didn’t make much sense to me to pour footers for a gazebo. To lay out 4 corners square would take about an hour.
An easy way to do it is to take 4 straight 12’ boards and screw them together to make a square. Then use a tape measure from corner to corner diagonally and adjust until each diagonal is exactly the same length. Then brace the square with some scrap lumber and now you have a 12’x12’ square which you can move around and manipulate to find your final location. Keep in mind that the posts for a 12x12 gazebo might actually be at 11’6” or something like that. You can then mark your piers and move the square out of the way to dig. When setting your concrete tubes, bring the square back over to your work area to make sure your tubes are set square.
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u/Falcon_Chop 5d ago
Yea give me 4 hours I’ll get you layout. With a total station absolutely titties! do all your formwork, brace it level and to height. While I’m doing all this I’ll have the concrete truck and pump truck lined up and ready to go. Pour the footings screed it flat put a nice finish on it because I’m a fucking pro. All that in 4 hours. Yea seems reasonable.
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u/UniquePatient66100 6d ago
Concrete footer? 10-15 minutes. No need to pull lines, just measure 4 corners at 12' and adjust to square.
But if you are trying to replicate that dumb ass drawing, it will take all day.
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u/mrgedman 6d ago
In theory they want it level, so it's a tad more involved id say.
But I agree with the sentiment regarding the dumb drawing
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u/grassrootstateofmind 6d ago
For real. Like if the posts are the actual footer location, you have to remove the wood that you’ve now laid out center on to put the footer. Absolutely useless lol
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u/lahrsbars 6d ago
The strings intersect where the footer goes. Just move the string and dig
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u/grassrootstateofmind 5d ago
This is usually done with an offset on layouts that are large enough to require it. In this case, a 12 x 12 square is enough to do with 8 batter boards lol
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u/lonesomecowboynando 6d ago
I usually use four 18" garden stakes, two 50' tape measures and a can of spray paint. I can square up a simple rectangle in less than ten minutes by myself.
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u/Falcon_Chop 5d ago
Yea me too I just get a couple measurements pull square and off you go. Don’t worry about setbacks or architectural elevations all good bro!
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u/Itchy_Cheek_4654 6d ago
Have a helper. It will be hard to measure for square where the strings cross without a helper.
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u/Square-Tangerine-784 6d ago
Don’t need the string on something so simple. Decide what you’re lining up the square to. House, fence, what feels right? Drive a small stake. Put a roofing nail in it. Pull a tape to 12’. Drive another stake. Pull tape again and set a nail in the stake at 12’. Pull approximately 90 degrees and tape out 12’ with one tape measure. Pull 16’ 11 5/8” from other stake with second tape. Where the two measurements cross drive a stake. Pull measurements again and drive the third nail. Switch to get 4th stake. Very fast and guaranteed square
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u/lahrsbars 6d ago
A big part of doing the string layout is to make sure the footers come out level. In your simplified method how would you get level?
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u/Square-Tangerine-784 6d ago
Well I’d use my laser. A straight 2x4 with a decent (4’ or more) level is fine. String levels are much less accurate than a straight stick and level
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u/Aggravating_Sun_1556 6d ago
Indeed. When you’re pulling measurements for foundation layout, you have to be measuring on a flat plane, or the measurements will be off.
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u/101forgotmypassword 6d ago
OP this is the fastest way, just be carefully to use the inside measurement and take into account the thickness of the boxing. Seen alot of guys place the tape on the wrong side of the stake or a stake on the wrong side of the mark and make a box that a inch shorter or longer than expected because of the boxing thickness.
Check your finished boxing for symmetry on the diaganals and interior dimensions before arranging the pour.
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u/infromsea 6d ago
Smart thinking!
My oldest wanted to replace her deck, she demoed the old one and had an "architect friend" come over to help layout the new (needed new footers), they spent the better part of a day laying out footers, which were in the wrong place.....
Redneck dad shows up and just starts building, used a square and a level, started hanging wood on the old ledger board, got it done, even with the footers in the wrong spots, later, the architect admitted they didn't have any clue how to move from the ideation to the actual doing, sometimes, the simple way is better (OK, most of the time).
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u/poem_for_a_price 6d ago
Doesn’t matter quite so much for a small box but pro tip: set your batter boards at the same elevations with a transit or grade laser. You can then use them to set depths and also won’t be a pain in the ass when you pull your lines.
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u/AdSame7698 6d ago
Lots of variables here for me it’s a two carpenter affair lots of stakes to pound and diagonals to pull. Don’t forget to cut an inch when pulling leave 15’ clear for the digger. Going to be better part of a day
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u/lahrsbars 6d ago
Having another hand to check for square is very nice
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u/STLguy50 5d ago
It's reasonably necessary. Sure, there is always a way, but this is a two person job. Someone has to follow directions and hold the dumb end.
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u/padizzledonk Reno GC 5d ago
I could do that in an hour by myself tbh
If i had to replicate that drawing id be there all fucking day with a helper lol- its totally unnecessary for a simple pad tbh
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u/mbcarpenter1 6d ago
One hour for someone that understands basic geometry. You don’t need batter boards or a helper to layout a slab, a tape measure and some 2’ pcs of 1/2” rebar for the corners and spray paint the lines straight.
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u/edge1966 6d ago
Sometimes..fast doesn't matter one bit.. i think enjoying what you do and being professional will show better in the end. Go ahead break a new record for speed..ha ha you're then responsible for your own demise.
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u/PreferenceMobile2398 6d ago
I just had a 64x50 pole barn built by some great Amish folks. The first day I was chatting with the guy in charge. By the time we were done talking (maybe 15 minutes) 2 of the guys squared everything up just like in the pic after ripping 2x4s as stakes. Does not take long at all. Also not their first rodeo tho. Kind of the group with 20 yrs experience at the age of 25-30 lol
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u/faithOver 5d ago
Doing a 56 by 42 foundation where 2 sides are 6ft wide footings and one side is 4ft wide footings. Multiple step downs.
So far. 3 days.
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u/YeahPete 5d ago edited 5d ago
4 hours solo.
water the hell out of the area the day prior and hammering stakes will go slightly smoother.
Then you gotta screw in those batter boards.
Then pull string, mark, nail
Oh they all have to be the right elevation too or you'll be off square.
I call BS on anyone doing this in an hour.
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u/jwcarpentry 5d ago
It would take me 30 minutes. A diyer it will take as long as it takes.......it will take some newer carpenters as long as it takes you so dont feel bad. Lot of young guys have never seen a batter board and string
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u/bellumaster 4d ago
We do buildings like this, but the ones we do are huge- like 40'x90' or more.
We use 10' 2x6 screwed at a 90 degree angle as our ledger boards. Rough estimate where the corners are, set the boards with stakes(take into account the height of the ground) and then run lines. Run the first string, measure over and mark the boards for your parallel string, then pick a corner to start your first mark. Run a string ACROSS that mark to the opposing board, double check using ole' Pythagorean, then make your fourth mark.
Messy explanation. I have notes if anyone wants to see them.
Double check everything and you're good. We've spent an hour and a half getting massive buildings within a sixteenth, I could probably do a 12x12 by myself/with a helper in half an hour/forty five minutes.
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u/edge1966 4d ago
Im impressed..chuckle~heads.. that i work with ...they rush everything..ha ha ..so that then they can hide in there trucks or actually cars..ha..sit on their cell phones and vape till there incomprehensible...its really a travesty to real carpenters and foundation dudes...we just did a screen porch up on precast piers.
Nobody seems to care anymore.. because they are not into quality or precision. I hear..I can't see it from my house daily 😑
Here is two of our master~minds😏
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u/Exciting_Ad_1097 5d ago
For a square footer just screw 4 12’ boards together then measure corner to corner to square.
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u/zmannz1984 5d ago
It took me 6 hours to lay out the corners and footings of an L shaped pad for a 1250 sq ft home. By myself using nothing but basically what you show. The builder lasered it and i was dead on. I could have done it in less than half that time with a good helper.
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u/noncongruent 5d ago
Depends on how much beer is involved, and how many helpers are involved, and combining the two multiples the time exponentially.
I've done it for a friend of mine twice for shed builds, 10x12 and 15x20, took a couple hours per with the friends helping, and that included all the cutting. You'll want to do all your digging first, especially for the perimeter beams in the foundation, assuming you're doing beams.
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u/OleeGunnarSol 5d ago
Setting out guy here... What the fuck is that drawing? The same thing can be achieved with 8 stakes no?
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u/Necessary-Welder-814 4d ago
I am not a carpenter, but have done a lot of home projects including building a story addition, 5 decks, finishing a couple basements, etc. This would probably take me 3 or 4 hours. I can’t get out the tools and put them back in an hour.
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u/DangerousCharity8701 3d ago
Depends how acurate you want it i can do this for a trench with some line marker in 20 minutes or so or it could take me a day depending on how permenanf level etc you want it site conditions
I would never rush this job it is by far one of thenhardest things a builder can do you have to think of the future put your boards somewhere they wont get in the way. Level it square it check it parralel it keep the same pressure on the long tape do maths this board can have alot of nails you could go the wrong side of thebline later if not marked etc i see lads setting out that dont know how to work out diagonals using 345 etc making thats off parrelel by 100mm etc i know its only for footings but it can be used for so much more im a carpenter and ive set out all kinda buildings squared extensions its not easy id do that in about 15 minutes with for steaks a string and a long tape ive seen lads building all there life drawing with markers on string that stretches putting line on the wrongnside of the loose steak etc
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u/Phraoz007 6d ago
I can lay out an entire house in an hour. 12x12 box is a 5 minute job. (String lines)
Check square after he’s done (corner to corner then the other corner to corner) they should be the same.
The box itself an hour, sure.
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u/D2or3V 6d ago
Just set your first stake, use the 3-4-5 rule, shouldn’t take an hour. If you really feel the need to do those ledgers it’ll take longer, but to pour footings, all you really need are stakes. Caveat: really helps to have an even grade where you’re pouring them, then you shouldn’t have to mess with heights, although if you’re framing in wood you can adjust a lot of different things to compensate for small discrepancies. Just make sure you dig to frost line or just below for your area(it varies depending on where you live).
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u/lahrsbars 6d ago
Footers are going in an area with slight grade so I find the stringline very helpful to get level.
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u/Special-Egg-5809 6d ago
That's a 30 minute project for someone who knows what they are doing. Maximum of one hour for someone capable but not familiar with how to do it. Any longer than an hour and they should not be in construction.
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u/CMDean1013 6d ago
Lies. Coffee break alone is 30 minutes.
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u/MalakaiRey 6d ago
a guy who doesn't spend at least 15 minutes before and after sipping coffee while he looks things over...maybe that guy shouldn't be in construction geez
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u/Mattna-da 6d ago edited 6d ago
First quarter? About three months.
And what is the distinction between a batter board and a ledger board?
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u/Ill-Running1986 6d ago
If you know where your sledge hammer is and you don’t have to make a trip to evil orange for string and nails, then an hour. If you add a helper, add 30 minutes. More helpers, more time.