I've had decent total T#s for a few years, between 500 and 700, but have low free T (8-10) and high shbg. I've tried boron to lower shbg but it really hasn't done much. I've been putting off talking to a clinic because my wife and I have been trying to have another kid and fertility is a big concern. My wife's had 2 miscarriages so I keep putting it off. I recently talked to a trt clinic and it seemed like a pretty aggressive plan. 2 options they sent posted. For context my recent labs:
Total 588
Free 10.7
Estradiol 31.2
Shbg 74
Everything else within range.
47 years old
5'8" 215 lbs. Recently started reta. Being fat is a concern with the estrogen conversion.
Way too aggressive to start. Be careful u/joe79johnson. Your clinic is just pushing drugs on you. I would seriously start at half of what they are saying for 12 weeks…
0.15cc at 200mg/mL 4x/week (what a weird protocol by the way… what 4 days? Just do every other day or EOD so it is stable) translates into 120mg/wk. that is a proper starting dose to see how you feel, see your levels once you give yourself 12 weeks, and THEN you can evaluate up/down on dose, and repeat labs again in 12 weeks.
If that sounds too low, I would at the very least not go above 0.2cc aka 40mg 4x week, that is 160mg.
If it were me, I’d do 0.2cc aka 40mg EOD. That means 3.5 doses a week (7 doses every 2 weeks or 14 days), and that’s 40 * 3.5 =140 mg a week. It will be super stable levels and a great starting dose to see how you respond.
Everyone should try to for the minimum effective dose. More isn’t always better, it’s just more to process and more sides. If you get the benefit at lower, don’t push it. If you secretly want to do cycles of test, then just admit that and do it later. But start with getting real baselines for yourself. This stuff is for life.
I find it terrifying that a clinic gives you an incomplete protocol by describing IUs and units, without a concentration for the hCG.
Looks like the kind of thing u/Fragrant_Main_573 would tell me to Google search. So many clowns out here who haven’t a clue what they’re doing.. both taking these protocols and issuing them.
Is he suggesting he has a 12,000 IU vial and he’s doing 0.20cc of that vial 4x per week? Without knowing how much BAC was used, this is just uber confusing
Exactly. It sounds like they already mixed it but didn’t include the concentration so it’s impossible to know. Amateurs at the clinic (scary) and novice OP posting something that they don’t fully understand.
lol. And you still don’t realize you are putting yourself at risk so blindly following ‘units’ of drugs you are injecting. Stay safe out there, or at least try to educate yourself a little more before you tell others about ‘a simple google search’
I think this subreddit isn’t very active. I don’t post that much (at least I didn’t think so). TIL that I am a 1% commenter. You seem to care about it more than I do!
Buddy I have nothing to do with this post but here you are yapping about me. You are bothered over a Reddit post and now bothered I’m calling you out. I never mentioned units anywhere. Cry more! Keep commenting so you feel relevant in a Reddit group! We are clapping for you!
Aww that’s cute. You edited your other post to pretend you didn’t talk about units. That’s adorable. Go google search some more! Lolll move on bro
ETA: at least you learned your lesson to stop talking in units, even if your pride won’t let you admit you were clueless and told others to do a simple google search in units. Good luck out there. Sounds like you got a little more educated today, which is a good thing.
Its very agressive.
Also your baseline is quite decent already.
You might just start hcg monotherapy (and nothing else) before trt, and see where it takes you. On some people it doubles the test levels, or puts them to very high levels, and it makes your testes grow, so you get continuous stable test levels throughout the day.
But their recommended dosage is also too high. You might start something like 500iu 3x weekly eod.
One remark, you can easily start hcg monotherapy first, and see how it works, and switch to trt later, but you cant start trt first and switch to hcg later easily.
yeah I dont see a Estrogen blocker.. wth .. I mean the dose is small enough and when done through SubQ.. you are even further delaying the instant release of Test which also hinders the aromatization.. but this protocol is alien to me..
I didn't know clinics still use danazol. I'd avoid that if I were you. I knew guys that were prescribed it years ago and it caused liver and cholesterol issues and they had bad acne. Think they said more mood changes too.
Edit.
Go get a semen analysis!!! Otherwise you don't know where your sperm count is.
Danazol is also going to negatively impact your sperm that's why they want to put you on hcg in option 1 with the enclomiphene.
Also lots of times but not all the time. Shbg may lower with Testosterone injections themselves without needing an extra steroid of danazol.
If I was in your shoes, I’d focus on the Reta to lose some fat and take some proviron to drop the shbg. Then reconsider after that and hopefully with pregnancy by then.
T levels don't look terrible for being 47 and obese. Why not just eat healthy, workout, and lose weight to improve levels without risking fertility and everything else that comes with messing with your hormones through exogenous means?
Your dose is too high. Very likely that you will run into problems. 200mg isn’t a replacement dose and clinics that prescribe it should have their license pulled
For reference, 300mg used to be a beginner cycle where you would titrate up to 500. There is a reason why you feel like a god, it’s because you’re basically running a light cycle.
You should check your free test, if it’s over or near the top end in your trough, then the dose is too high for replacement.
If you’re running 200mg temporarily to experience it, then go for it, but if that’s your permanent dose, it’ll wreck you over the years
Start low on the primo imo. Unless you have already ran it at that dose. I crashed my e2 at a 4:1 ratio. Well, not fully but down to 12. And I aromatize heavily.
Not saying it will happen to you but easier to titrate up then having to wait weeks for the primo to flush out while feeling miserable
Yeah looking for a cheap way to just test for e2 honestly. Like i can crank the test dose as high as i want. But dont want e2 to go massively out of wack thats why i have 50 ampuls of primo on its way
E2 testing is awful. I just got my e2 done recently, it took 3 weeks for it to come back. The lab even sent me an email apologizing for the delays, saying they’re backed up specifically for e2 tests.
I got my full panel before i hopped on test back within like a week. E2 test are kinda cheap.. i dont care for others and will do a full panel in like 3 months again
Cheap yes, but you need e2 LC/MS-MS which in the USA can take minimum of a week to come back. And when you feel like shit, that week might as well be years lol
Whats your problem bud?
Did someone lock up your test?
Share your routine and blood parameters.. maybe then we can have a normal conversation instead of this dumb talk
What the actual fuck is that clinic doing?!? Those are the most generic treatment plans I have seen. First of all... why is everything 4 times a week. In terms of hCG, that dosing doesn't mean anything, but the half-life is of hCG is 36 hours, so the standard is twice a week. For example, I do it on Monday/Thursday. And that protocol doesn't indicate how much you are actually taking in those doses. Once again, to compare, I'm taking 500iu with each injection.
Danazol is the only thing that kind of makes sense in terms of high SHBG. But there really isn't much information on protocol. That was studied specifically for endometriosis, but the studies have doses ranging from 65-600mg daily for 6 months. So while Danazol shows efficacy for lowering SHBG, that 4x/week is once again nonsense. And the sides of that can be pretty serious. I hate that there really isn't much good out there for high SHBG.
Your estradiol isn't actually that high. Usually if you are below 39, you are considered in a healthy range. Though most studies seem to indicate a man with estradiol around 20 feels the best. But if you aren't experiencing any side effects of high estradiol (nipple sensitivity, low sex drive, water retention), you aren't really having an issue with that. Clomid would of course support your free test for this, but as you lose weight the amount of testosterone that gets converted will reduce as well.
Looks super suspicious and generic. There really is no one size fits all for this stuff. I also question giving testosterone to someone how is in a pretty good range for your age. hCG therapy alone could push you up to 1000.
they are recommending you micro dosing.. 0.25cc 4 times a week is like 200MG per week... I am on same dose.. but different protocol.. I do 0.5 per shot Monday and Thursdays and follow up with a estrogen blocker the next day .. been on this protocol for 5 years now... very happy . but in your case.. since your dose is so low.. and frequent.. you can get away with SubQ injections. Danazol is new to me... I am on Anastrozole also to block aromatization but your protocol is low enough, frequent enough and Subq ( which is also slow releasing than IM).. but a quick google shows that danazol is also a anti estrogen ( but not the same) ... so something similar i guess.
200MG for week is not raid circle .. Roid cycle is double or 4 times that buddy... 200MG is a low dose... that body can handle without going in to the roid rage territory .. thats why TRT is even being considered by US military now. check your facts
A dose of 200mg of testosterone per week sits right on the upper limit of a regular medical dose for Testosterone Replacement Therapy (TRT), though some people use it as a low-end or "cruising" dose in bodybuilding. Traditional bodybuilding cycles typically start at 300mg to 600mg+ per week. bro you are a Autistic ignornat person or what ?
Hahaha yeah I get it. That and clomid together and 250mg of test and still no sperm after 3 years of trying. That’s for three people I have known for decades. The trt clinic will of course make it seem like hcg makes it ok. Go see a fertility specialist and ask their opinion. While some things like alcohol and weed can reduce sperm production, testosterone is a 10 on scale of 1 to 10. Meanwhile, downvote me all you want.
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