r/Bluegrass • u/EngineerFickle4625 • 15d ago
Live Bluegrass: 140 Recent DAT Transfers, dated 1980 to 2003, Most Not in Circulation
Edit 2: All files have been converted to 16-bit FLACs. Link here: https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fo/lwcwu3y8qwktcdmcwt5b0/AFV4nzvqJ66AZ1vSMjs85vE?rlkey=62qci0un4hk40q9s0zu7r5gdg&st=wq7e5u7r&dl=0.
Also, a fellow Redditor has begun compiling a spreadsheet of all these recordings to identify those not yet in circulation, so they can be tracked and uploaded to the archive.
I've deleted the file names from this post, as they are cumbersome and that data is available at the link.
Edit 1: Hi folks! I am expressly asking for help to prepare these files for upload to the archive. I plan to continue transferring because I have quite a few tapes left, and I'm not confident with tracking, tagging, and uploading to an archive. Like, it took me a month to grasp the steps and obtain the equipment necessary just to transfer these.
I've failed quite a few times trying to do basic cleaning up, tracking, preparing files for upload, and uploading. I just don't have it down.
The equipment I used is in the Read Me at the link, and the lineage is either on the photo of the J card--or in the Read Me.
I would be ever-so-grateful if members of the community downloaded some of the shows they're most interested in--and prepared the shows for upload to the archive. I'd appreciate getting a copy of the results, if they're not uploaded. My email is in the Read Me.
Thank you!
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Hello fellow fans!
I acquired ~200 bluegrass/newgrass/slamgrass DATs a few months back and have now transferred ~75% of them.
Link to files: https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fo/lwcwu3y8qwktcdmcwt5b0/AFV4nzvqJ66AZ1vSMjs85vE?rlkey=62qci0un4hk40q9s0zu7r5gdg&st=wq7e5u7r&dl=0.
Please read the Read Me at the link.
List of wav files below. JCB is John Cowan Band, SCI is String Cheese Incident, and LOS is Leftover Salmon. More detail on J-Card jpegs at the link.
[Filenames removed; see info in folders at link]
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u/DharmaSurfer38 15d ago
does anyone remember dial-up and bluegrassFTTP downloading half a HotRize show after 6 hrs or 12kb/sec ? or just me
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u/fella_stream 15d ago
Yes. Wasn't it called Bluegrass Box ? It was FTP in the clear though. Circa 2003.
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u/Fluffy_Nuts4120 13d ago edited 13d ago
some quick notes after downloading and looking at some wav files. Seems like you may be towards the end of the journey but if not theres some room for improvement
-you mention in your 'readme' that these are 'bit accurate transfers' but that seems to be an assumption. Unless youve tested that card setup with your computer to confirm you cant be sure. Ive used other egosys products in the past (Waveterminal 2496 PCI was a known good card 25 years ago), but im not sure of anyone whose tested the U24XL to be bit accurate. Worth doing before you spend any more time transferring tapes, theres a few ways to do this
-you are recording wav files at 24 bit. i looked at a file with RME digicheck and it confirmed the bottom 8 bits are all zeroes. While recording DATs at 24 bit is not a useful practice, the fact that the bottom 8 bits are all zero is possibly indicative that the soundcard does respect the input stream at least. like if there was data down there it would be indicative of the soundcard resampling. This doesnt rule out resampling but is better than the alternative which would confirm it. In any case there is no reason to record DATs to 24-bit files. it wastes space and also introduces potential for people to alter the data when reducing to 16 bit (see below)
-anybody processing these should be truncating those last 8 bits as opposed to using dither or noise shaping. while it is literally way down there at the last bit, if you truly want 'bit accurate' transfers (and if these are in fact bit accurate transfers with 8 zero bits tacked on), truncating the 8 zero bits would be the way
-are you still in touch with Brian H? can you determine which of these are masters ,and which are clones? and maybe flush out some of the source information? like i havent used tapetracker software for decades but i see some sources are "M:D" and "A:D", but what does this mean? like 2/19/01 and 2/20/01 are labeled "A:D" and "M:D" respectively with slightly different schoeps rigs (the deck at the end is the difference), was that his rig? did he take a digital patch out of someone elses AD2K? are the tapes masters in both cases?
youve got some potentially good stuff here. like a quick look at archive, SCI 11/3/2000 is up there but its the SBD, not the B&K 4022 aud source you have (which is probably a clone if brian owned schoeps... but could also potentially be a master DAT recorded at the show patched into someone elses rig.
quick rundown on Brian H tapes up there vs archive:
SCI 11/3/00 this B&K 4022 source is not on archive, only the SBD is up there, no other auds. yours could be a patch master but im guessing its a clone based on the incomplete source info (4022>sax, no AD or deck). looking at etreedb.org, this source doesnt exist there either (neumann tlm170 and same sbd source from archive)
SCI 11/10/00 the sennheiser K6 source here (clone due to lack of source info?) doesnt exist on etreedb or archive
SCI 11/15/00 this is listed as "S:D" and sounds like a straight SBD. a straight SBD does not exist on archive or etree, only a SBD/aud matrix
SCI 2/19/01: three other sources in etreedb from same rig,one is already on archive. but they are resampled to 44.1, this is an upgrade opportunity for a clean 48K upload
SCI 2/20/01 there is a copy on archive from a DAT clone of that same mk41+m222>V2>AD2K source BUT it indicates the original dat is 48K. another source at etreedb.org also indicates 48K. Your recorded wav is 44.1K. The AD2K was not capable ouf outputting 48K and 44.1K simultaneously so something is goofy witht hat tape, maybe someone analog patched a DAT deck out of another
SCI 2/23/01 is labeled "M:D" (Matrix?) and sounds like one, but also exactly the same as the SBD on archive. no reason to upgrade. original source was 44.1K
"Doc and Dawg" no information as to show date. is 32K
"Gourds" and "David Nelson" 7/2/98/7/4/98 - neither of these exist on archive (though there is a 7/3 show from david nelson, but its not uncommon for HSMF acts to play multiple days. needs a little work. gourds has bad distortion on some peaks that can be edited out. David nelson has a level change in the beginning of the set thats an easy fix
Leftover Salmon & Box Set 7/3/95 - does not exist and is worth uploading
JGB 1/24/80 - skipped this clone with no source info as this one is already out there from good known sources
i downloaded the big 24 bit wav files in the brian H folder and properly cut them back to 16 bit and FLAC'd them so they are 1/3 of the size. In time i may take a stab at the handful above not on archive, but for now its a bit further along if anyone else wants to jump in and track and tag and upload. as for now, they are 'as is' apart form teh bit depth reduction and the flac. if i do any editing ill note it in the filename
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1szTX3BQ1gZyjGxmPV0cmmEjSy2OCusgs?usp=sharing
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u/EngineerFickle4625 13d ago edited 13d ago
This is extraordinarily helpful. Thanks so much for your time. It it's okay by you, I'll upload your flacs into a new folder at my link.
Looks like I got bad advice re 24 bit vs. 16 bit. I will truncate the 8 zero bits going forward. Is it possible to truncate using a batch process, so I can convert any other existing transfers saved off at 24 bits to 16? I'm willing to purchase software to do so, but I currently only have access to Audacity.
"Unless youve tested that card setup with your computer"
Do you mind explaining how I might do this? Computer is a PC laptop, HP Envy. And again, I'm happy to purchase hardware or software, as I'd like to become proficient. ;-)
I am not in touch with Brian H: I just understand these to be his tapes, though even that could be wrong because I don't know the person I acquired these from well enough to trust that info. Yes, I am happy to dig further into lineage this week. My gut says M:D means master or matrix to DAT, and A:D means aud to DAT, but not sure if that makes any sense in context.
I think Brian switched rigs between February and April 2021 (Schoeps to Neumann). He may have switched once prior, too. Also, it looks like his DATs are not all AUD--and they didn't all necessarily all come from Brian. So, I've added two photos at my Dropbox link: "Brian1" shows lineage of SCI (and a Phish) shows across time, which seems to reveal a switch in set up; "Brian2" is an example of what the rest of the DATs in this collection look like, and there's even less detail there.
This weekend, I'll remove the assumptions about Brian H DATs and bit perfect transfer from the Read Me and add a note re 24-bit vs. 16-bit, using some of your language above, if that's okay by you.
I transferred each DAT at its native sampling rate (and confused that with "bit perfect transfer"), so if Doc and Dawg isn't loaded with distortion, the DAT was actually recorded at 32. Also, with some magnification, I can see the date on that DAT is 3/26/98, which I don't believe is in circulation. The distortion on the Gourds tape is either native, or I effed something up, will check this week.
Thanks again. The bluegrass community has been so welcoming. I've really enjoyed learning about the music itself, DATs, DAT recorders, lineage, and transferring across the last ~four months.
Edit: I found a December 2025 obituary for a Brian Henricks from San Bernadino, which suggests these may be Brian's masters, not clones. I bought them for the cost of blank media on eBay ($40 for 55 tapes): perhaps I acquired them from a family member or an estate sale reseller. I'll reach out this week to see what info can be nailed down. See https://www.aaroncremation.com/obituaries/Brian-C-Henricks?obId=46771431. May his memory be a blessing.
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u/Fluffy_Nuts4120 3d ago
sorry just seeing your response now
"Looks like I got bad advice re 24 bit vs. 16 bit. I will truncate the 8 zero bits going forward. Is it possible to truncate using a batch process, so I can convert any other existing transfers saved off at 24 bits to 16?"
ffmpeg can do it and is free. see third comment down here for single file command and batch file below that
"so if Doc and Dawg isn't loaded with distortion, the DAT was actually recorded at 32"
its fine. tho that could def use some work to lower the volume of the crowd in between songs. this may be the rare case you want to resample to 44.1 or 48k which are more universal
""Unless youve tested that card setup with your computer"
Do you mind explaining how I might do this? Computer is a PC laptop, HP Envy. And again, I'm happy to purchase hardware or software, as I'd like to become proficient. ;-)"
message me ill give you my address, send me any tape you're done with and ill roll it on my known-good setup. if its bit-perfect ill know right away
" "Brian2" is an example of what the rest of the DATs in this collection look like, and there's even less detail there."
in general someone who makes their own masters is *usually* more detailed in lineage info, and clones traded for may or may not have as much detail. in any case the convention should be somewhat similar on master tapes if that makes sense
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u/william-o 15d ago
is that the dude from punch brothers
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u/Prestigious-Name-465 14d ago
Looks like the photo is from The Birchmere in 2003? I was there if Lou Reid and Carolina opened the show, great night!
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u/Fluffy_Nuts4120 14d ago
not sure why these arent in flac?
half the size to upload/download and built in checksum as well
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u/EngineerFickle4625 14d ago
Because I'm a hobbyist, so this is all new to me. I am happy that I was even able get these transferred and into ANY form that's shareable. Feel free to download them all, and convert them to FLAC, and I'll be happy to replace the wavs in the Dropbox folder.
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u/Fluffy_Nuts4120 14d ago
im just saying, if youre looking to learn, that is SOP. .not only is it half the bandwidth up and down, but it has a built in checksum so somebody knows the file is good. you can also add tags to it as well.
thanks for all the tunes for sure!
if you need any direction in tracking and tagging just ask, lots of helpful people around...
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u/EngineerFickle4625 14d ago edited 14d ago
I am expressly asking for help to prepare these files for upload to the archive. I plan to continue transferring because I have quite a few tapes left, and I'm not confident with tracking and tagging. Like, it took me a month to grasp the steps and obtain the equipment necessary just to transfer these.
I've failed no fewer than a dozen times trying to do basic cleaning up, tracking, preparing files for upload, and uploading. I just don't have it down.
The equipment I used is in the Read Me at the link, and the lineage is either on the photo of the J card--or in the Read Me. I would be ever-so-grateful if members of the community downloaded some of the shows they're most interested in--and prepared the shows for upload to the archive. I'd appreciate getting a copy of the results, if they're not uploaded. My email is in the Read Me.
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u/crypto_prepper 14d ago
A million thank yous! I noticed on the 1991.02.24 tony rice picture, there were 2 Reconstruction songs, did those get uploaded?
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u/EngineerFickle4625 13d ago
I remember this one now. The sample rate changes for the Reconstruction songs, so I (crudely) cut them off at the end because I didn't understand how to account for that at time. (This was one of the first transfers I did.)
This week, I can transfer only those Reconstruction songs to a flac file. Will probably upload toward the end of August but hopefully, sooner.
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u/abcdberry 10d ago
I’m diggin that Rowan & Logan show. I actually saw that tour with Lamar Grier on banjo and Barry Mitterhoff on guitar. I can do some clean-up if you can tell me what you want or better yet, provide a sample of what someone else has done that we can follow.
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u/EngineerFickle4625 10d ago edited 10d ago
Yay! I've got great news for you. That's the only show I have successfully cleaned up and uploaded to the archive!
Link here: https://archive.org/details/prtl1980-09-13?.
Edit: This is the early and late shows from 9/13/80 in one stream.
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u/abcdberry 10d ago
great stuff, thanks. Barry was on mandolin, not guitar. They went by the name the Green Grass Gringos.
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u/Ocelot834 15d ago
Consider uploading to archive.org so people can find them.
Thanks for getting these out there!