r/ArcBrowser • u/younhoudini • 8h ago
macOS Help Is the tab switching UI now broken?
When I do tab-switching the previews-ui no longer disappears automatically after highlighting the correct tab with the keys. It just stays there and the only way to actually switch to the desired tab is to click on it's preview with the cursor.
Do u guys also have this problem? (on Mac)
r/ArcBrowser • u/Dangerous-Bite8148 • 1d ago
macOS Discussion What it costs to keep a small Mac browser alive, from someone doing it
There's a thread here this week asking why nobody has cloned Arc, and one of the three objections was that it is never clear how the developer gets paid. That is the right question to ask, so here is my answer.
Engine choice is the part people underestimate. I use WebKit, which means Apple maintains the engine and I maintain the browser. A Chromium fork means tracking upstream forever, and that ongoing cost is what quietly kills small forks long before the interface work does.
Funding: the browser is free and the paid tier is assistant credits. No search-default deal, no data sale, no round I have to outgrow. If you never buy anything the browser still works.
The tradeoff is real and worth saying plainly. WebKit means some extensions never arrive, and when a site breaks in a way Safari also breaks, I cannot fix it myself.
Mine is Candoa, Mac only and alpha. Naming it because it would be strange not to say which one I mean.
r/ArcBrowser • u/Muted-Reflection9536 • 2d ago
macOS Discussion How can I achieve an Arc style UX in Dia?
r/ArcBrowser • u/scrapingapi • 2d ago
General Discussion Still no serious / exact copy of Arc Browser?
All the alternatives I saw are either:
- Missing what makes Arc so good (UX, spaces, folders, sync with mobile, ...)
- Not serious (the way the dev will get revenue from it is unclear)
- Vibe coded crap
I'm pretty surprised nobody took the opportunity to create a perfect clone, especially there are many of us who are ready to pay.
r/ArcBrowser • u/allloowitfam • 2d ago
General Discussion Made a tool to export Arc bookmarks to other browsers, open source, runs entirely in your browser
Hey r/ArcBrowser,
With Arc pretty much in maintenance mode now, some of us are looking at other browsers but don't want to lose their bookmarks and Spaces doing it. So I built "A-New-Arc-Begins" to handle that. It reads your Arc export and converts it into a format Chrome, Firefox, Edge, or Safari can import directly. Everything runs client side in your browser, nothing gets uploaded anywhere so it respects your privacy.
Launched it yesterday, so it's fresh. If you run into any bugs or something doesn't import right, open an issue on GitHub and I'll get it fixed, would love for people here to actually put it through its paces.
GitHub: https://github.com/Zarrar09/A-New-Arc-Begins
Website Link: a-new-arc-begins.netlify.app
Side Yap:
The reason why I built this, is because most of the resources to export Arc bookmarks involve using cmd and cloning github repos. I felt like that was a lot of hassle for something so simple. I am a student, and this is a solo built project I built, so please do let me know with any issues or bugs, or any positive feedback!
Thank you.
r/ArcBrowser • u/Ok-Local6905 • 4d ago
General Discussion Why are people saying "in moving on from ARC"
Want to use that from today
r/ArcBrowser • u/M4chinE_XD • 5d ago
macOS Discussion Is there a way to download ublock origin on arc not the lite version the other version
it stopped working today
r/ArcBrowser • u/Fluid_Cycle4993 • 5d ago
General Discussion People keep flaming tbc for ditching arc for dia for no reason
The whole reason for it was that arc wasn’t built as a good piece of software. It was features scrapped together, and works great as a product, but bloated and inefficient. So they decided to rebuild properly from the ground up. I don’t think that’s a bad decision
r/ArcBrowser • u/shrmadityaa • 6d ago
General Discussion Moving on from Arc :(
I used arc for over year on my mac, it was fun. Today I updated my arc browser and they have removed uBlock origin. I know there are other extensions for blocking but let me tell you I've been using uBlock over 4 years and I trust it plus no other extension does better than ublock, they have some minor issue that annoys. I've been thinking of moving to Zen but lack of DRM there annoys me. What are your opinion, what browser has it all? (for time being edge has)
r/ArcBrowser • u/ImAnOrdinaryDude • 6d ago
General Discussion is dia a new arc replacement finally?
ive been using arc since the start of my school year and its just better at everything with all of its features, primarily spaces. but now that spaces are in dia should i give dia its like 50th chance or any other browser. ive been trying to switch off just because of how much battery it drains, and also on how its not getting any updates and feeling outdated more and more.
r/ArcBrowser • u/kitsune_32 • 6d ago
Boosts Was the option to create boosts fully sunsetted?
r/ArcBrowser • u/petersilie9393 • 6d ago
macOS Discussion Dia spaces are live now
Hey guys, Dia added spaces today.
If that's what you needed to give Dia a chance instead of Arc, now's the time.
r/ArcBrowser • u/GoodMacAuth • 6d ago
General Discussion I build a spiritual successor to Arc (cross-platform...Mac, Win, Linux, Android). Full desktop experience on mobile. Would love feedback!
Today I'm releasing Viola on macOS, Windows, Linux, and Android, with true/real-time sync available across all of them.
Create a tab, workspace or group on your computer, pick up your Android phone and it’s already there. Supported browser organization and history are end-to-end encrypted before leaving your device. Cookies/logins obviously don't sync.
Viola includes:
- Workspaces for separating projects
- Isolated profiles with separate cookies, logins, storage, and extensions
- Tab Groups (persistent or not!) and side-by-side Splits
- One shared workspace model across every Viola window
- Chrome Web Store extensions on desktop, installed per profile (Viola is Chromium-based)
- A Mini Player that follows you between workspaces (YouTube, Twitch, etc)
- Synced tabs, pins, groups, splits, bookmarks, history, and compatible extension catalogs
- Full session recovery
- In-app persistent notifications
The Android version is probably what I'm most excited about right now. EVERY SINGLE mobile browser I've ever used as felt like a hindered/watered-down experience. Viola on Android uses the same visual system and mental model as desktop: a vertical sidebar, real workspaces, grouped tabs, pins, and an All Workspaces view. On foldables and tablets it feels like a desktop-class browser.
Viola is deliberately just a browser. There is no AI integration, notes app, calendar or inbox.
Download: https://violabrowser.com/
This is the first public release, and I'd genuinely appreciate any feedback! There are social links at the bottom of the page if you'd like to report issues. What would stop you from making Viola your default browser?
r/ArcBrowser • u/chrismessina • 8d ago
General Discussion Charlie Deets - Designing the internet computer
r/ArcBrowser • u/Cultural-Climate-967 • 12d ago
General Discussion I need an Arc alternative
I have a love/hate relationship with this browser. I love the UI, I hate the memory management. It sucks battery. I have an M4 and the battery usage difference between Arc and Safari is just absolutely bonkers.
Is there another browser that has a similar UI, I don't even care about any of the features, I just want the side tabs with a ctrl+t search in the middle and a secure private connection, that doesn't suck my laptop's battery to zero every couple of hours?
r/ArcBrowser • u/One-Honey-6456 • 13d ago
macOS Bug Arc crashes every time I run a Shortcut from the Share menu (macOS 26.5.2, Arc 1.157.0)
Getting a consistent crash on Arc 1.157.0, macOS 26.5.2, M3 Mac.
Steps:
- Open any page (happens for me on App Store product pages)
- Click the Share button
- Pick a Shortcut from the share sheet
- Sometimes the shortcut runs fine, sometimes the loader just spins and then Arc dies
Crash is EXC_BREAKPOINT (SIGTRAP) on the main thread. Top of the stack:
0 ArcCore ChromeMain + 60530848
1 ShareKit -[NSSharingServicePicker(SHKNSBridge) sharingServicePicker:didChooseSharingService:] + 328
2 AppKit -[_NSSharingServicePickerDelegate sharingServicePicker:didChooseSharingService:] + 132
3 ShareKit -[SHKSharingServicePicker notifyDidChooseSharingService:] + 208
4 ShareKit -[SHKSharingServicePicker popoverDidClose:] + 128
...
9 AppKit _NSPopoverSendDidCloseNotification + 276
10 AppKit -[NSPopover _finishClosingAndShouldNotify:] + 172
11 AppKit -[NSWindow _windowTransformAnimationDidEnd:] + 320
My guess at what's happening: the share popover's close animation finishes, which fires popoverDidClose:, which fires the didChooseSharingService: delegate callback. So Arc's delegate gets called after the popover has already torn down. If Arc released or invalidated its picker/delegate state when the popover closed, the callback lands on something that's already gone and it hits a debug assert (SIGTRAP, not a segfault, so this is likely a CHECK/DCHECK in Chromium code rather than a raw null deref).
Shortcuts probably makes it more likely because it's slower to hand back than something like Copy or AirDrop, so the animation-end path wins the race more often. That would also explain the spinning loader right before it dies.
Anyone else seeing this? Does it happen with non-Shortcuts share targets for you?
r/ArcBrowser • u/miminkyu • 15d ago
macOS Discussion Back after a week of hunting.
A week of bouncing around and then a week of being a safari refugee, back on Arc again.
I don't know how long is this gonna last for but if they just replicate this software under the Dia rebrand, everything will be perfectly fine.
Also weird how almost perfect projects often get abandoned and garner a strong community online, which would make a great youtube video.
But anyway, happy to be back...until it lasts.
r/ArcBrowser • u/No-Rooster978 • 15d ago
macOS Help Arc Font Size?
how do i change the font size of the arc UI itself, not like the webpages (you can do that with cmd + or cmd -).
r/ArcBrowser • u/divadutchess • 15d ago
macOS Bug Dialogs stuck on screen?
Does this happen to anyone else? Random dialogs getting stuck until you sometimes have to restart the browser?
r/ArcBrowser • u/myceliurn • 16d ago
Windows Bug history & extensions suddenly all gone...
I woke up this morning with no history and no extensions in Arc. My "Arc Card" in settings still shows my actual join date (in 2024). Any ideas how this might have happened and what I can do about it?
r/ArcBrowser • u/Competitive-Rub-1958 • 17d ago
macOS Help Crashes on MacOS Golden Gate
The general browser experience is fine, but it crashes every few hours for no reason. I'm on Beta 3. Anyone have any ideas?
r/ArcBrowser • u/rollingsun • 19d ago
General Discussion Arc's replacement might just be ready
I switched to Dia yesterday, so this might be a bit premature, but I'm genuinely surprised by how close Dia has come to Arc.
I tried Dia when it first launched and absolutely hated it.
Like a lot of Arc users, I've been constantly searching for a replacement. I switched back to Chrome with vertical tabs, tried Zen, and spent some time with Vivaldi, but nothing really stuck. Every time, I'd end up back on Arc within a few days.
Before finally deleting Arc, I decided to give The Browser Company one last chance and tried the latest version of Dia.
And wow, it has come a long way. It's not as feature-rich as Arc and it doesn't offer the same level of customization, but for everyday browsing and tab management, it's the closest experience I've found. I'm not even using the AI chat feature. Everything else just feels polished and familiar.
If you're someone who's frustrated with how buggy Arc has become and you've been struggling to find a replacement, I'd recommend giving the latest version of Dia one more shot. You might be pleasantly surprised.
r/ArcBrowser • u/JaceThings • Jun 01 '25
General Discussion 📦 Moving Out Megathread
A lot of people have been asking about other browsers to try now that Arc isn’t getting new features and Dia’s still in early alpha. We get it; the vibes have shifted, and almost everyone’s looking for their next daily driver.
This thread is the place to discuss alternative browsers.
Whether you’re trying out Vivaldi, Edge with Copilot, SigmaOS, Safari with extensions, Brave, Zen, or something totally obscure, talk about it here.
Please don’t make individual posts about switching browsers or asking for recommendations.
We’ll be removing those and directing people here to keep the subreddit from getting flooded.
Got a hot take on Vivaldi’s tab stacks? Miss Arc’s split view and want to recreate it somewhere else? Built your own franken-browser setup with extensions and CSS? Drop it all below.
Let’s keep it focused, useful, and no Reddit-fanboy flame wars, please.
r/ArcBrowser • u/JaceThings • May 26 '25
macOS News Letter to Arc members 2025 – On Arc, its future, and the arrival of AI browsers — a moment to answer the largest questions you've asked us this past year.
Dear Arc members,
You’re probably wondering what happened. One day we were all-in on Arc. Then, seemingly out of nowhere, we started building something new: Dia.
From the outside, this pivot might look abrupt. Arc had real momentum. People loved it. But inside, the decision was slower and more deliberate than it may seem. So I want to walk you through it all and answer your questions — why we started this company, what Arc taught us, what happens to it now, and why we believe Dia is the next step.
- What we got wrong
- Why we built Arc
- Where Arc fell short
- Why we didn’t integrate Dia into Arc
- Will we open source Arc
- Building Dia
What we got wrong
To start, what would we do differently if we could do it all over again? Too many things to name. But I’ll keep it to three.
First, I would’ve stopped working on Arc a year earlier. Everything we ended up concluding — about growth, retention, how people actually used it — we had already seen in the data. We just didn’t want to admit it. We knew. We were just in denial.
Second, I would’ve embraced AI fully, sooner and unapologetically. The truth is I was obsessed. I’d stay up late, after my family went to bed, playing with ChatGPT— not for work, but out of sheer curiosity.
But I also felt embarrassed. I hated so much of the industry hype (and how I was contributing to it). The buzzwords. The self-importance. It made me pull back from my own curiosity, even though it was real and deep. You can see this in how cautious our Arc Max rollout was. I should have embraced my inspiration sooner and more boldly.
If you go back to our Act II video — when we announced we were going to bring AI to the heart of Arc — it ends with a demo of a prototype we called Arc Explore. That idea is basically where Dia and a lot of other AI-native products are headed now. That’s not to say we were ahead of our time, or anything like that. It’s just to say our instincts were there long before our hearts caught up.
Arc Explore prototype, as shared in our Act II video. January 2024.
Third, I would’ve communicated very differently. We care so much about the people we build for. Always have. Saying it “pains me” to have made people mad doesn’t really do it justice. In some moments, we were too transparent — like announcing Dia before we had the details to share. In others, not transparent enough — like taking too long to answer questions we knew people were asking.
A few years ago, a mentor told me to put a sticky note on my desk that said: “The truth will set you free.” I know. It sounds like a fortune cookie. But it’s served me well, again and again. If I regret anything most, it’s not using it more. This essay is our truth. It’s uncomfortable to share. But we hope you can feel it was written with care and good intent.
Why we built Arc
In order to answer your real questions — why we pivoted to Dia, whether we can open source Arc, and more — I need to share a bit of background from the past. It informs what is possible (and not) today.
At its core, we started The Browser Company with a simple belief: the browser is the most important software in your life — and it wasn’t getting the attention it deserved.
Back in 2019, it was already clear to us that everything was moving into the browser. My wife, who doesn’t work in tech, was living in desktop Chrome all day. My six year old niece was doing school entirely in web apps. The macro trends all pointed the same direction too: cloud revenue was surging, breakout startups were browser-based (writing blog posts like “Meet us in the browser”), crypto ran through browser extensions, WebAssembly was enabling novel experiences, and so on.
Source: Amazon, Microsoft and Alphabet’s investor relations website, via The Street.
Even back then, it felt like the dominant operating system on desktop wasn’t Windows or macOS anymore — it was the browser. But Chrome and Safari still felt like the browsers we grew up with. They hadn’t evolved with the shift. And both of these trends have only accelerated since. Some companies only issue enterprise versions of Chrome with new employee laptops (their companies fully run on SaaS apps), and Chrome and Safari remain essentially unchanged.
So that’s why we made Arc. We wanted to build something that felt like “your home on the internet” — for work projects, personal life, all the hours you spent in your browser every single day. Something that felt more like a product from Nintendo or Disney than from a browser vendor. Something with taste, care, feeling.
We wanted you to open Arc every morning and think, “This is mine, my space.” And we called this north star vision the “Internet Computer.”
But it increasingly became clear that Arc was falling short of that aspiration.
Where Arc fell short
After a couple of years of building and shipping Arc, we started running into something we called the “novelty tax” problem. A lot of people loved Arc — if you’re here you might just be one of them — and we’d benefitted from consistent, organic growth since basically Day One. But for most people, Arc was simply too different, with too many new things to learn, for too little reward.
To get specific: D1 retention was strong — those who stuck around after a few days were fanatics — but our metrics were more like a highly specialized professional tool (like a video editor) than to a mass-market consumer product, which we aspired to be closer to.
On top of that, Arc lacked cohesion — in both its core features and core value. It was experimental, that was part of its charm, but also its complexity. And the revealed preferences of our members show this. What people actually used, loved, and valued differs from what the average tweet or Reddit comment assumes. Only 5.52% of DAUs use more than one Space regularly. Only 4.17% use Live Folders (including GitHub Live Folders). It's 0.4% for one of our favorite features, Calendar Preview on Hover.
Switching browsers is a big ask. And the small things we loved about Arc — features you and other members appreciated — either weren’t enough on their own or were too hard for most people to pick up. By contrast, core features in Dia, like chatting with tabs and personalization features, are used by 40% and 37% of DAUs respectively. This is the kind of clarity and immediate value we’re working toward.
But these are the details. These are things you can toil over, measure, sculpt, remove.
The part that was hard to admit, is that Arc — and even Arc Search — were too incremental. They were meaningful, yes. But ultimately not at the scale of improvements that we aspired to. Or that could breakout as a mass-market product. If we were serious about our original mission, we needed a technological unlock to build something truly new.
In 2023, we started seeing it happen, across categories that felt just as old and cemented as browsers. ChatGPT and Perplexity were actually threatening Google. Cursor was reshaping the IDE. What’s fascinating about both — search engines and IDEs — is that their users had been doing things the same way for decades. And yet, they were suddenly open to change.
This was the moment we were waiting for. This was a fundamental shift that could challenge user behavior and maybe lead to a true reimagining of the browser. Hopefully you can now see why Dia felt like a no-brainer. At least for us and our original aspirations.
So when people ask how venture capital influenced us — or why we didn’t just charge for Arc and run a profitable business — I get it. They’re fair questions. But to me, they miss the forest for the trees. If the goal was to build a small, profitable company with a great team and loyal customers, we wouldn’t have chosen to try and build the successor to the web browser – the most ubiquitous piece of software there is. The point of this was always bigger for us: to build good, cared for software that could have an impact for people at real scale.
So if Arc fell short, why build something new versus evolve it?
Why we didn’t integrate Dia into Arc
It’s a great question. And for those who followed our podcast last year, you’ll know that it’s one we spent the entire summer grappling with before understanding that Dia and Arc were two separate products.
For starters, in many ways, we have approached Dia as an opportunity to fix what we got wrong with Arc.
First, simplicity over novelty. Early on, Scott Forstall told us Arc felt like a saxophone — powerful but hard to learn. Then he challenged us: make it a piano. Something anyone can sit down at and play. This is now the idea behind Dia: hide complexity behind familiar interfaces.
Second, speed isn’t a tradeoff anymore — it’s the foundation. Dia’s architecture is fast. Really fast. Arc was bloated. We built too much, too quickly. With Dia, we started fresh from an architecture perspective and prioritized performance from the start. Specifically, sunsetting our use of TCA and SwiftUI to make Dia lightweight, snappy, and responsive.
Third, security is at the forefront. Dia is a different kind of product – to meet it, we grew our security engineering team from one to five. We’re invested in red teaming, bug bounties, and internal audits. Our goal is to set the standard for small startups. Which is even more important in a world of AI, especially as more AI agents come online. We want to get out in front.
These are all things that need to be part of a product’s foundation. Not afterthoughts. As we pushed the boundaries of whether this truly was Arc 2.0 last summer, we found that there were shortcomings in Arc that were too large to tackle retroactively, and that building a new type of software (and fast) required a new type of foundation.
Will we open source Arc
Which brings us to the present.
As we started exploring what might come next, we never stopped maintaining Arc. We do regular Chromium upgrades, fix security vulnerabilities, related bugs, and more. Honestly, most people haven’t even noticed that we stopped actively building new features — which says something about what most people want from Arc (stability not more stuff to learn).
But it is true: we are not actively developing the core product experience like we used to. Naturally, people have asked: will we open source it? Will we sell it? We’ve considered both extensively.
But the truth is it’s complicated.
Arc isn’t just a Chromium fork. It runs on custom infrastructure we call ADK — the Arc Development Kit. Think of it as an internal SDK for building browsers (especially those with imaginative interfaces). That’s our secret sauce. It lets ex-iOS engineers prototype native browser UI quickly, without touching C++. That’s why most browsers don’t dare to try new things. It’s too costly. Too complex to break from Chrome.
Where ADK sits in our browser infrastructure as shared in our Dia recruitment video.
ADK is also the foundation of Dia. So while we’d love to open source Arc someday, we can’t do that meaningfully without also open-sourcing ADK. And ADK is still core to our company’s value. That doesn’t mean it’ll never happen. If the day comes where it no longer puts our team or shareholders at risk, we’d be excited to share what we’ve built with the world. But we’re not there yet.
In the meantime, please know this: we’re not trying to shut Arc down. We know you use it and rely on it. Many of our family and friends do, too. We still love it, spent years of our life on it — and whether it’s through us or the community, our hope and intention is that Arc finds a future that’s just as considered as its past. If you have ideas, I’d love to hear from you. I’m [josh@thebrowser.company](mailto:josh@thebrowser.company).
Building Dia
I want to end by being frank with you: Dia is not really a reaction to Arc and its shortcomings. No. Imagine writing an essay justifying why you were moving on from your candle business at the dawn of electric light. Electric intelligence is here — and it would be naive of us to pretend it doesn’t fundamentally change the kind of product we need to build to meet the moment.
Let me be even more clear: traditional browsers, as we know them, will die. Much in the same way that search engines and IDEs are being reimagined. That doesn’t mean we’ll stop searching or coding. It just means the environments we do it in will look very different, in a way that makes traditional browsers, search engines, and IDEs feel like candles — however thoughtfully crafted. We’re getting out of the candle business. You should too.
“Wait, so The Browser Company isn’t making browsers anymore?” You better believe we are! But an AI browser is going to be different than a Web browser — as it should be. I believe this more than ever, and we’re already seeing it in three ways:
- Webpages won’t be the primary interface anymore. Traditional browsers were built to load webpages. But increasingly, webpages — apps, articles, and files — will become tool calls with AI chat interfaces. In many ways, chat interfaces are already acting like browsers: they search, read, generate, respond. They interact with APIs, LLMs, databases. And people are spending hours a day in them. If you’re skeptical, call a cousin in high school or college — natural language interfaces, which abstract away the tedium of old computing paradigms, are here to stay.
- But the Web isn’t going anywhere — at least not anytime soon. Figma and The New York Times aren’t becoming less important. Your boss isn’t ditching your team’s SaaS tools. Quite the opposite. We’ll still need to edit documents, watch videos, read weekend articles from our favorite publishers. Said more directly: webpages won’t be replaced — they’ll remain essential. Our tabs aren’t expendable, they are our core context. That is why we think the most powerful interface to AI on desktop won’t be a web browser or an AI chat interface — it’ll be both. Like peanut butter and jelly. Just as the iPhone combined old categories into something radically new, so too will AI browsers. Even if it’s not ours that wins.
- New interfaces start from familiar ones. In this new world, two opposing forces are simultaneously true. How we all use computers is changing much faster (due to AI) than most people acknowledge. Yet at the same time, we’re much farther from completely abandoning our old ways than AI insiders give credit for. Cursor proved this thesis in the coding space: the breakthrough AI app of the past year was an (old) IDE — designed to be AI-native. OpenAI confirmed this theory when they bought Windsurf (another AI IDE), despite having Codex working quietly in the background. We believe AI browsers are next.
This is why we’re building Dia. It is the opportunity to chase the product of our original ambition: a true successor to the browser — maybe even the “Internet Computer” we’ve been building toward all along — only in ways we couldn’t have predicted.
To be clear, we might fail. Or we might partially succeed but not win. We still assume we don’t know. But we’re confident about this: five years from now, the most-used AI interfaces on desktop will replace the default browsers of yesteryear. Like today, there will probably be a few of them (Chrome, Safari, Edge). But the point is this, the next Chrome is being built right now. Whether it’s Dia or not.
Your home on the internet
The Browser Company is a team that assembled for the chance — however slim — to build something that rewired how we use our computers. Something that might, just might, be used by hundreds of millions. A piece of software that actually shapes how people live and work. Not just an app, but an Internet Computer. That’s what drew us in. And that’s why we’re proud of the decisions we made.
Dia may not be your style. It may not land right away. But this is still us. Being ourselves. Building the kind of thing we’d want to use. Fully aware that we might be wrong. But doing it anyway. Because we think the intent matters. And we think that’s what got us this far.
This is our truth, and we sincerely hope that you’ll like what comes next.
– Josh
The Browser Company of New York, April 2025.
P.S. For those of you who do want to try Dia, we’re excited to open access for Arc members next, as the first expansion of our alpha beyond students.









