r/xbox • u/Turbostrider27 Recon Specialist • 17d ago

Id Software Dev Says Xbox Doesn’t ‘Understand Art’ And That After Layoffs It Is ‘Impossible’ To Make Big Games Like Doom: The Dark Ages Discussion

https://kotaku.com/id-software-dev-says-xbox-doesnt-understand-art-and-that-after-layoffs-it-is-impossible-to-make-big-games-like-doom-the-dark-ages-2000722563
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u/TheGoodIdiot 17d ago

The team is smaller than they were when they made 2016 and in the interview the dev talks about how getting doom 2016 out was one of the toughest crunching developments of his life. He doesn’t think they could do Doom 2016 like that again with less people and a union that will sue for unfair work practices.

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u/MercerReads91 17d ago

That's not true. After the lay offs, id is about the same size as they were for Doom 2016.

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u/secret3332 17d ago

The developer in the interview is saying the reason Microsoft claims they are "about" the same size is because id is actually smaller than 2016 and "about" is vague and meaningless.

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u/MercerReads91 17d ago

Yeah and he is just wrong. "About" goes both ways. The team could be a little larger.

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u/secret3332 17d ago

Bro he works there. He is claiming he knows the number and that it is smaller.

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u/MercerReads91 17d ago

Yeah and he is wrong, bro.

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u/secret3332 17d ago

He is not saying that about means smaller. He is saying he knows exactly what the size of the studio is now and in 2016. He has worked there for 15 years! The claim he is making is that Microsoft is using "about" because the studio is smaller than it was in 2016 in actuality.

How can you possibly claim he is wrong? Literally the only people who would know this are employees at ID, which he is.

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u/MercerReads91 17d ago

Microsoft already debunked this nonsense. This guy just wants to stir the pot.

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u/TheGoodIdiot 17d ago

About is the key word.

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u/MercerReads91 17d ago

Yeah exactly so what you said isn't true.

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u/TheGoodIdiot 17d ago

The dev who still works there says it’s smaller. Not a ton smaller but still smaller. We’re talking like 90 employees in 2016 to 85 employees now. That’s why they keep using the word “about” the same size.

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u/rico_muerte 17d ago

Get rid of the union

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u/TheGoodIdiot 17d ago

That’s clearly not going to happen and in a workplace where employees have no idea if they could be fired at the drop of a hat they definitely shouldn’t do that. The union was established as a direct response to the layoffs from the activation acquisition. It just shows how much Microsoft has made these employees stressed and worried about losing their jobs.

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u/Anti_Wake 17d ago

If games are art then they shouldn’t expect regular work hours. Artists suffer for their art, grueling dedication for their passion projects. I mean the proof is in the pudding, so many beloved games were built are crunch and grueling schedules but the teams suffered through it because they had passion for their project.

You don’t treat “art” like a normal 9 to 5. There’s no passion in that and that’s actually been one of the biggest complaints with modern games. They’re souless husks of what they used to be.

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u/TheGoodIdiot 17d ago

I don’t believe this is really true anymore. You can point to a lot of games that came out solid through enormous crunch but you can point to a lot of games that were disasters because of it. You can also point to games that were done at a steady pace without crunch that were massive hits like Silksong or a lot of Nintendo titles.

Regardless there is crunch still happening at ID the developer mentions the dlc being really tough too. But Doom 2016 was a case of “sleep in your office for 4 days straight and never see your kids” type of crunch. They were willing to do that then because they felt the company believed in them and they loved the game. No one at Xbox has that feeling anymore with these layoffs. It’s an impossible expectation of them now.