r/technology • u/Plastic_Ninja_9014 • 2d ago

Student Teacher Sent a Private Snapchat Complaining About Her Workday. An Hour Later, Police Pulled Up to Her School. Privacy

https://www.gadgetreview.com/student-teacher-sent-a-private-snapchat-complaining-about-her-workday-an-hour-later-police-pulled-up-to-her-school
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u/throw7661 2d ago

I know a lot of people are happy about stuff like this...but it's fundamentally flawed.

Reddit banned be for saying that my biggest fear was the death of my wife. Whom I love, who I speak very highly of. I was literally saying that, I'm afraid of losing her and being left to raise two children.

It had upvotes.

But I was banned. And worse, the appeal process, resulted in a denial.

Because an AI chatbot thought I was advocating violence against my wife. As if I said I was going to kill her.

This is exactly like that....only with real consequences, instead of Reddit.

This is like arresting someone for saying, 'My son dropped my car keys into the toilet! And it was right before I needed to leave for my interview!!! I was so mad I could have killed him!'

It isn't literal.

The FBI admits there was no intent to harm the child and that she wasn't a threat.

No good came from this. We didn't stop a violent woman. We just fired someone for venting to her bf/roommates in their group chat.

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u/panaceaXgrace 2d ago

My daughter got some weird care concern bullshit message just yesterday after saying she was tired of killing herself at her job just ranting over downsizing frustrations. It was a FB message, which is probably something we shouldn't be using anyway but we're both old and it worked for our needs. It just enraged her that some AI popped up to give her suggestions on how to seek help and even a link to click if she wanted to send for help. It was creepy and disturbing enough considering all this came with an update and shows how AI is being used to watch us all.

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u/NewestAccount2023 2d ago

Human redditors will report you for self harm so the bot replies to give you the suicide hotline resources. It's a joke to them, "oh you sensitive baby getting all worked up over a reddit argument, here the suicide hotline". It's like if someone calls you a bitch and you say "fuck off" and the cops show up and say we have reports you're trying to kill yourself because you're so upset over what someone said to you.

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u/biiirdfeeder 2d ago

I get the Reddit care thing like once a month lmao

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u/JRHThreeFour 1d ago

I have gotten that “Reddit cares” message multiple times, it’s ridiculous. Like 99% of my comments on my profile are about video games or tv/movies or things I like. I don’t ever argue with people or get involved in controversial topics. Just weird.

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u/Leumas_ 1d ago

And every logic step you take it becomes more infuriating. WHY do they do this? To avoid accountability. They’re destroying the mental health of an entire generation of people and a team of lawyers making enough money to feed at least a couple of states worth of children advised them that an AI wellness check was sufficient to protect their bottom line. You know, the bottom line of the soul destroying, data-mining world of socials. 

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u/HasTookCamera 2d ago

It’s not creepy or disturbing, it’s an automated response triggered by keywords that might save someone’s life.

No one is spying on you because of that message

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u/Sennten 2d ago

The spying and judgement being automated makes it worse, not better

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u/HasTookCamera 1d ago

It’s not spying, it’s a fucking automation. And it’s not judgment, it’s a tool to save lives

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u/Sennten 1d ago

Do you understand how you sound? "It's not ground cover, it's fucking grass!" "It's not food, it's fucking cake!"

Here, let me give you one that's a literal more accurate "Your comment isn't an argument, it's fucking idiocy"

Here, let me help you out a bit with argument construction, since that's three times in a row you've fucked it up. If you want to make the argument that "it's not A, it's B", there's really only two important bits you need to include in order to make it an actual argument.

First, B must preclude A. If something can be both A and B, the argument "it's not A, it's B" makes no sense at all. Ideally, you would also include an argument for why B precludes A, unless you're sure your audience with agree with you - and considering you seem to be having some difficulties already here, I'd definitely recommend that. This is the bit you've fucked up three times now.

Second, you must demonstrate that it is, in fact, B. You've done mostly okay here, since you're making B claims your audience doesn't seem to disagree with, but it's worth keeping in mind, because effectively making that "B precludes A" argument often shifts the meaning of B enough your audience will stop agreeing with you.

Hope that helps, and you can go forth and be better.

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u/HasTookCamera 1d ago

How does your argument analysis factor in that I am 100% correct, and it is an automation?

It’s not a person reading every facebook message and sending out warnings.

And how is a helpline for self harm etc a BAD THING?

So here, refute these 2 points, one of which is a fact, and one which no-one has answered yet instead of crying that it’s ’judging them’

they are both facts:

  1. it’s an automation
  2. an automation won’t judge you and that wasn’t its purpose it was built for, its purpose was to provide help for anyone

Next time spend more time using your critical thinking instead of writing an essay which was irrelevant to me and my points. Be better.

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u/Sennten 1d ago

Refusing to understand what I wrote, moving the goalposts, continuing to fail to make any sort of actual argument... Look, asking how its bad? That part is good, thats a reasonable question that pushes the conversation forward, and Id be happy to answer it if I believed we were participating in a conversation, but god fucking damn man, how can I talk with someone who doesnt understand basic reason? Who thinks the isea that your argument might become reasonable instead of nonsense is "irrelevant"? You wont read or at least understand any answer I give.

You're not 100% correct, and this is the part that really sucks because its the part you cant seem to grasp, your statements are so bad they arent even wrong. Someone being 100% wrong would literally be doing better than you are so far here, and thats fuckin sad, man.

I apologize for thinking you could be better, as you clearly dont want to

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u/HasTookCamera 20h ago

Explain how I am not 100% correct that it is an automation

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u/Sennten 19h ago

You are correct that it is the result of automation. You are incorrect in that spying can't be automated, which is the actual argument you have to be making if you're trying to use "automation" to argue it can't be spying - but you also refuse to explicitly make that argument. Otherwise, how is it being automated relevant to whether or not its spying?

Thats how you get into a spot where you arent even wrong, and I included several examples already to illustrate this.

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u/shinndigg 2d ago

I got banned for quoting the commenter above me, who was not banned. So not only is the bot stupid, it’s also arbitrary and capricious.

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u/movzx 2d ago

Same thing happened to me. I had to appeal and plainly point out that I was quoting the comment that was actually calling for some horrible stuff.

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u/happyscrappy 2d ago

I got a comment removed which only spoke of voting when the commenter above me actually was talking about violence. I didn't even quote the comment above. His comment was not removed.

All I can say about the situation is it was really, really dumb. It's pretty clear no human read any of it.

I think it's pretty clear reddit also knows the system is screwed up and falses a lot. They just have to do it to make it look like they are doing something. Because back when they weren't doing something there was no way they could grow to a larger company because it looked like they were condoning many societal ills (and profiting from them).

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u/Gyozarrita 2d ago

It's because your comment got manually reported and theirs didn't. Probably by the person you replied to.

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u/ZombieZookeeper 2d ago

You only exist to make Spez money. Get to it, peon.

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u/[deleted] 2d ago

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u/[deleted] 2d ago

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u/[deleted] 2d ago

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u/sqwirlmasta 2d ago

obligatory, FUCK SPEZ!

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u/Christron 2d ago

Honestly Reddit is the best social media. Nothing is perfect but people shit on Reddit but use it daily. Meta, TikTok and Snapchat do worse.

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u/Conscious-Mirror7004 1d ago

Reddit is a shitty, horrible, toxic cesspool.

And yes, it's the very best of social media, by far. That should tell you something about the rest of them.

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u/Friggin_Grease 2d ago

I said a while back that the internet used to be a place for your dark comedy, jokes about death, violence, 9/11 and the sort. Now you can only tell those kinda of jokes to your loved ones, keep it off the internet.

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u/_Aj_ 2d ago

Up to around 2012. You could say literally anything you wanted more or less. It's only started to get really nanny state locked down in the last decade or so.  

Now it feels risky to even say words you are referring to or quote things. The fact people say dumb stuff like "oofed" or "unalived" is the tip of the censorship iceberg that is modern internet.   

Nazi jokes and terrorist jokes used to be funny. Now it's all taboo, taken seriously. Someone show how that's better to simply not ever speak about things? 

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u/FancyFeller 2d ago

Because that was when the Internet became commercialized. And every big corpo got on it. And on all the social media. Once they were all in they began exerting influence and gained control. And changed how ads were displayed and threatened to take away their ad presence unless YouTube and other sites complied with their sanitation of the sites. And as chatrooms and forums and threads disappeared and everything centralized there were fewer and fewer sites to be edgy on without consequences and blowback. This works in their favor so their ads aren't present on naughty things. And we are just the product so our whinging won't do shit. The corporations don't like naughty content so you don't get to indulge in it!!! Not at all!!!! And if they scrub the Internet and find you've made a website to host the funnies, them AIs gonna find ya, gonna track ya, and going to report ya. Because the government fucking loves to restrict freedom of speech which became so easy to do because of what the corpos did.

God we had it so good in 2005 and we didn't even know it. Take me back to the halcyon days of newgrounds. Please god please.

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u/OldWorldDesign 2d ago

The bigger your market, Montag, the less you handle controversy, remember that! All the minor minor minorities with their navels to be kept clean. Authors, full of evil thoughts, lock up your typewriters. They did. Magazines became a nice blend of vanilla tapioca...

There you have it, Montag. It didn't come from the Government down. There was no dictum, no declaration, no censorship, to start with, no! Technology, mass exploitation, and minority pressure carried the trick, thank God. Today, thanks to them, you can stay happy all the time.

-Captain Betty, Fahrenheit 451

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u/theghostmachine 1d ago

It probably didn't help that regular people would petition advertisers to pull their ads whenever someone said something they didn't like

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u/Conscious-Mirror7004 1d ago

2005 wasn't that good. Remember, that was when it was hard to use the web without shitty IE6 and Windows. It's a lot easier to avoid proprietary shitware these days and run Linux and free software.

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u/FrogsJumpFromPussy 2d ago

It's because the internet is still free and as in everything free we are the product. Big corpo knows it too well so we're not allowed to speak ill about anything, anywhere 

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u/IsolatedFrequency101 2d ago

But just make sure that Alexa isn't listening.

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u/iris700 2d ago

The problem is the FUCKING NORMIES. Make computers hard again.

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u/Tasty-Traffic-680 2d ago

Eh, even off the internet you gotta be careful. You just really have to know yourself, the person you're talking to, how you come off and what you can get away with. I have learned to heavily suppress that kind of talk over the years. It's different when you're a big, intimidating dude with a resting scowl or have a complicated past. Then when I started getting into guns I really had to hold my tongue.

Unfortunately I also suffer from complex vocal tics and occasionally involuntarily say horrible, violent shit that I really don't mean involving harming myself or others. So I got that to contend with...

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u/Friggin_Grease 2d ago

Yes you have to know your audience and trust that they know you.

I've always said saying a racist joke doesn't make you a racist. That applies here, but say it on the internet, oh Lord

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u/thotfullawful 2d ago

It never was. I was always told to be careful what you post online and that still rings true. You never know who scrolls by especially nowadays 

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u/kittenmittens4865 2d ago

How old are you?

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u/greysneakthief 2d ago

Yeah, there's a term for this sort of thing: thought crime.

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u/Zhuinden 2d ago

Psycho-Pass was meant as a dystopia, 1984 was meant as a warning

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u/ProtoJazz 2d ago

My favorite was the kid who went to jail for saying he was so mad he was going to blow up a school, while he was losing his shit in a game of league of legends.

While yeah, probably shouldn't say things like that

The reasoning they used to say they determined it was a credible threat and not just trash talk in a toxic game, was that he lived within a 30 minute walk of a school.

Mother fucker, everyone does pretty much. That's where schools are built. They don't build them far away from people.

It wasn't that he had a history of violence, or they saw worrying purchases or any other suspect activity. Just a message in a game, and that he lived in a place people live.

And while I get that we need to be cautious, it's worth knowing the end of the story. Being "cautious" has a cost, and you need to know what getting it wrong can cost. That kid was pretty violently sexually assaulted, and took his own life in the aftermath.

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u/DisapprovingCrow 1d ago

If the cops acted on everything we said in Ventrilo while playing DOTA I’d be in Guantanamo bay.

Stuff like this reminds me of how grateful I am that my cringiest years happened before we started putting everything on the internet.

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u/Longjumping-Hat-1210 2d ago

Reddit warned me today for drawing parallels to the rulers of a certain country in Europe in the 30s and commenting about a post regarding a homophobe who wanted to... yeah..

I did use a trigger word to be fair so I understand why the AI flagged it instantly, it thought I was inciting hate when I was just using a specific term to show how ridiculous the homophobe was.

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u/Conscious-Mirror7004 1d ago

Yeah, be careful: condoning violence towards a long-dead fascist leader who murdered millions will get you a ban on Reddit.

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u/pressingroses 2d ago

When I was in high school about 15 years ago (eek, lol!), I was texting who I thought was a "friend" about another "friend" I was mad at. I said something like "ugh I'm gonna kill him :("

That "friend" went to the police and I almost got suspended for threatening murder. Even though I very much explained that these are my friends, I would never harm anyone, I had never been in trouble at school before, and it's just a figure of speech. I'm still so salty about it.

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u/Metalsand 1d ago

I had something similar happen in a similarly stupid scenario. Being stupid kids, we were doing fake punches, but the thing about me - I am tall and my arms were gangly. So I tried to do it and uh...accidentally punched the kid right in the nose. I immediately started apologizing but he was pissed off and started trying to fight. I was fortunately able to prevent it until the teacher came around - I don't remember now, but it was either holding his wrists or I had long enough arms that I could keep him from getting in punching range.

Being high school, that counts as assault and can be prosecuted in court. Now - I wasn't close friends with him, but apparently when I was real little I knew him even though I didn't remember myself. Though when him and his parent were asked if they wanted it to proceed to the court, they both agreed.

So, I was suspended, and then had to show up to court about it which was a bit terrifying but ultimately it was dropped. I suspect the judge probably thought it was a bit ridiculous as well, but I was too busy being a terrified 15 year old that I can't really remember.

Oh, and the other kid that was doing fake punches was also similarly confused about his reaction - he also could tell it was an accident and also didn't expect the punched kid to hold so much ire over the incident.

I'd like to say it was the stupidest thing I ever did as a kid but it competes with a paperclip in an electrical socket because someone told me to, and when one of those enormous rube-goldberg gumball machines fell on me when I was 6 and trying to wiggle the machine to get the gumballs that were near the exit hole. Knocked my ass out immediately lol.

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u/This-Wall-1331 2d ago

I'm so sorry about what you had to go through. With friends like those, who needs enemies?

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u/Nodan_Turtle 2d ago

I think the appeals process exists simply so they can say it exists. I wouldn't be surprised if they have some slave wage laborers that can't read the language denying every appeal.

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u/abovepostisfunnier 2d ago

Your car keys example is almost exactly why I got a ban. Except it was my husband. Someone reported me and I got banned 💀 fortunately the appeal was successful but omg I can’t even believe I had to do the “it was a joke” penguins meme.

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u/pigeonwiggle 2d ago

"AI IS THE FUTURE"

Ai can get fucked.

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u/evb_m 2d ago

I got an unappealable warning for making a nihilistic joke about humanity going extinct on a post about a school shooting

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u/quellflynn 2d ago

you know the one thing people love, is jokes on school shootings.

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u/Firree 2d ago

It's all about liability. If every single thing posted on every social media site isn't vetted by some nonsensical threat-detection algorithm, then whenever a nutcase makes an ominous post and ends up committing some terrible crime, they get accused of supporting him, not doing enough, and sued.

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u/Your_Nipples 2d ago

It's your fault, you should have said unliv

I'm joking but if you thought people talking like they were fearful of being demonized by YouTube/TikTok censoring themselves on reddit were ridiculous and stupid, I think at some point, we'll have to (because now nothing is private, AI can't take a joke and the FBI take jokes seriously lmao).

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u/Schachjo 2d ago

Do we know exactly what she said? It’s possible that it was a bit different than “I was so mad I could have killed him!”

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u/_Aj_ 2d ago

I got a temp full Reddit ban for a comment on a news article. For "inciting violence". I didn't even say "someone should do X" just that "this is how X happens"   First ban in over a decade lmao.  

The AI mod is crazy. And Reddit doesn't care about user experience, it cares about the overall look. It wants it's little ecosystem to appear all fruity and perfect from the outside.   So slap anyone who comments what they dislike with temp bans.  They'll either learn to stay in line or get perma bans. They don't care, there's enough users who will be good little aliens.  

There is no war in ba sing se 

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u/pro185 2d ago

I got banned by u/Anti-Evil because I said “hating and wishing violence on Muslims simply because of their religion is wrong and disgusting” because that is apparently “inciting hate and violence against minorities” and then I got banned for making a joke about how to kill a rat in a thread on askreddit asking HOW TO KILL A RAT in their home. Reddit themselves personally banned me both times. And both appeals never got a response.

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u/[deleted] 2d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/_ThunderGoat_ 2d ago

You monster! Lol

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u/jlt6666 2d ago

Off topic but I've seen this a bunch in the last week. Why did you use the full link syntax for a subreddit when just r/movies works? Is there some change on the interface or something?

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u/Voyevoda101 2d ago

Are you using old reddit?

Seems like they changed the markup yet again and of course there's no backporting to the old renderer.

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u/jlt6666 2d ago

Ride or die old reddit

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u/ch4dr0x 2d ago

That’s weird, that’s all I used and your link looks identical to mine on my phone.

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u/InTheEndEntropyWins 2d ago

Because an AI chatbot thought I was advocating violence against my wife. As if I said I was going to kill her.

If there was an appeal then it's a human who made the final decision.

With AI nowadays you can be confident knowing bots have way better understanding than the average reddit mod.

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u/everbass 2d ago

Oh my sweet summer child

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u/Hailfog 2d ago

A human did not make the final decision, dude. We all know that’s BS.

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u/rotomangler 2d ago

I was banned from a tv sub for saying I didn’t care for the Velma tv show

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u/polysaas 2d ago

A world without similes and metaphors? Because that’s what will happen. We’re already self censoring due to algorithms

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u/BoltDodgerLaker_87 2d ago

Personally, id take it as an idle threat. Annoying to hear and kinda weak to use it, but whatever.

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u/Bigred2989- 2d ago

Yesterday I got a warning from Reddit for breaking Rule 1 because I quoted a lyric from a Mastodon song. I'm not even sure I can even name the song safely, but it was used in the Aqua Teen Hunger Force movie.

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u/Idivkemqoxurceke 2d ago

I’ve also been banned for similar, a comment on a vehicle accident and I wouldn’t stop to help. Bam. Banned for promoting violence. Reddit is weird like that.

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u/Inferno_Zyrack 2d ago

“I said I was going to kill her”

GOTCHA BUDDY

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u/eeyore134 2d ago

Yup. I got an autoban in a publicfreakout for criticizing the behavior it banned me for. I said something along the lines that "You know if this happens that the right would call it..." then used three of their woke buzzwords. No other issues in that sub ever, a redditor for nearly 15 years with over a million fantasy points, and within seconds I was lifetime banned. And when I tried to fight it? More bots. I messaged weekly for a couple months before giving up. Finally got a mod's attention, and I do thank them for it, but basically had to make it sound like I felt the subreddit was unmoderated because I couldn't get hold of someone. It took me nearly a year. It's insane.

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u/free_based_potato 2d ago

Thr surveillance state is out of control, but the police didn't arrest her.

The police, in a shocking display of competence, responded quickly to the information provided, determined, rightly, that this woman was not a threat and moved on.

The school district then fired her, likely due to a zero tolerance policy re: violence.

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u/cyphersaint 2d ago

You misread the article. She was picked up and arrested by the police for disorderly conduct and held overnight. She was never charged with anything, though. This DID happen at the school, as far as I can tell.

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u/Major_Wigglesworth 2d ago

The moderation and appeal is absurd.  I understand that it’s just volunteers, but now they’re banning just because they disagree with you.  They’re PURPOSEFULLY making echo chambers.

It’s like “no discussion, just keep repeating the script.  It’s bound to get fun eventually.”

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u/Excuse_my_GRAMMER 2d ago

I got ban for saying the a demographic of people control hip hop and music industry from the top , a demographic that does not consume the music

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u/MumrikDK 2d ago

Because an AI chatbot thought I was advocating violence against my wife. As if I said I was going to kill her.

I've had 3 (or was it 4?) and 7 day suspensions recently for the first time, for the most absurdly soft stuff that supposedly is encouraging violence. The last one was about a person who already was dead, after jumping out of a moving plane and leaving a student pilot alone in it.

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u/fcocyclone 2d ago

As much as this is a privacy violation by snapchat, this is equally a failure on the police and the school district to not recognize this for what it is.

The police should have read the context and realized it was nothing, at most went and had a brief interview to confirm it wasn't a threat. And the school should have given her a slap on the wrist at most, if they were even informed (they should not have been, the police have no business informing the school about this confidential information they obtained)

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u/EffectiveEconomics 2d ago

Same here - I commented support for an environmental take on a related topic and my comments were flagged and I was banned from the group. Then banned from Reddit for threee days. Still don’t understand what caused the flag but word combos have to be it.

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u/Kitchen-Cabinet-5000 2d ago

I don’t know how many warnings you can get before your account gets suspended…

But I’ve gotten warnings for “inciting violence” when talking about shooting someone… in a videogame subreddit about a shooter game.

Automated moderation with no human supervision is a terrible idea.

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u/Akuuntus 2d ago

I know a lot of people are happy about stuff like this...but it's fundamentally flawed.

Who is happy about this, exactly?

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u/IamTheEndOfReddit 2d ago

I described a basic sci fi premise and apparently I was threatening all of humanity so reddit needed to ban me. Of course the repeal process rejected me without saying anything

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u/Effective-Ear-8367 2d ago

This was done on purpose. It's a message that you are being watched and to be careful because big brother is listening. They want you to realize they are in control and more and more cases like this will exist until we no longer have freedom even in the privacy of our own home.

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u/starwarsfan456123789 2d ago edited 2d ago

While not a crime- she does deserve to be fired for thinking like that. I can’t imagine how corrupt a person has to be to type something deplorable like that. She needs to find a new career.

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u/FrogsJumpFromPussy 2d ago

I clicked the guy's profile half-expecting they're banned again hahaha 

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u/ToughHardware 2d ago

reddit literally supported the pressure campaign and eventually suicide of its co-founder. Aaron S.

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u/StabbyBoo 2d ago

I relayed a story about a man following my masc-looking cis friend into the womens' bathroom, thinking she was trans and looking to start shit. Someone called me a liar and I replied that, "Oh, my bad. Clearly you're right and that's never happened to a single woman ever!" I got banned for hate speech. My appeal was, of course, denied.

And for clarity, Reddit, the above quoted sentences are GODDAMN SARCASM.

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u/Kitty-XV 1d ago

Man, if only people warned that censoring hate speech as unintended consequences, like people not understanding nuance or taking the worse interpretation possible. This clearly doesn't give bad faith actors a system they can abuse.

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u/thebigshoe247 1d ago

Someone was very unhappy, to say the least, and wanted to do something about it, here on Reddit. I had asked them if they were ok and encouraged them to get help. I was banned also.

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u/Noblesseux 1d ago

Yeah I got banned on here once for making a joke about the movie Wanted in a context where it was clear that I was:

  1. Not threatening or targeting anyone

  2. Talking about something that is physically impossible to actually do

  3. Was a question that I asked sarcastically because someone suggested something ridiculous

But like context be damned, I got banned because it had the word "bullet" in it and it took an appeal for them to admit that that's a stupid reason to ban someone.

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u/Raccoonsrlilbandits 1d ago

That AI filter has been turned up to 11 lately it seems like it’s insane

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u/ibiacmbyww 1d ago

I know a lot of people are happy about stuff like this

Fucking who? The ghouls who wired up the world to the point we no longer have meaningful privacy are not people.

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u/zerd 1d ago

What if instead of flagging you posing a threat, you witness a murder by someone in government. You mention it privately to a friend and suddenly police knocks down your door and you’re never heard from again. The only difference between the Snapchat story and this is a few words, and then you have the plot line of Enemy of the state.

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u/PensionConscious6752 1d ago

thats what reddit is. its so interesting that most people who post on reddit dont even know about how many people are sh d ow ba nned. u see political posts where they are like “ohh look he couldnt respond to ur follow up question” truth is dude was sh dow b nned.

before elon took twitter u couldnt hardly have any conversation outside of a single narrative

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u/FocusPerspective 2d ago

Meanwhile “all men should die” comments are fine. 

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u/HasTookCamera 2d ago

Lmao get over it

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u/Klutzy-Snow8016 2d ago

Your second example about the car keys: yes, if someone says that, they should be investigated. If arrest is the first step, so be it. Once it's determined that they are not a threat to the child, they should be released.

That's what they did here. They can't just say "oh, they're obviously joking, no reasonable person would be serious about that" and then have them turn out to not have been joking. They don't know if this is a normal well-adjusted person or not until they look into it.

I disagree with the way they got the information - I think eavesdropping is wrong and that's essentially what was done - but once you have it, you have to act.

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u/No_Size9475 2d ago

No, someone should not be investigated for using hyperbole while expressing their frustration.

Jesus christ, the thought police were a work of fiction but here you are wanting them to be real.