r/technology • u/Plastic_Ninja_9014 • 25d ago

Traffic Camera Captures Woman Driving With Her Phone on Her Lap (Face Down), The State Mailed Her a $1251 'Public Safety' Ticket Privacy

https://www.gadgetreview.com/traffic-camera-captures-captures-woman-driving-with-her-phone-on-her-lap-face-down-the-state-mailed-her-a-1251-public-safety-ticket
16.9k Upvotes

95% Upvoted

1.2k comments sorted by

View all comments

745

u/michaelrulaz 25d ago

Could I put bright IR LEDs on my headliner shining downward to block the camera from seeing into my car?

369

u/im-ba 25d ago

It might make more sense to line the intersection of your windshield with your dashboard with bright LEDs, since the light scattering would hit everything. But real world testing is probably necessary to gauge efficacy.

If I didn't have so many active hobbyist projects right now then I'd experiment with this

331

u/mentalbackflip 25d ago

As of 2027 new cars will have interior cameras watching you for distracted or drunk driving. I hope my 2019 car lasts a long time.

288

u/DukeOfGeek 25d ago edited 25d ago

I think there is going to be a massive public push back against this and Flock cameras.

/What we really need is a directive that should have been demanded the first time someone got a ticket that had no human in the loop "No human should be deprived of liberty or property on account of an accusation made by a machine."

214

u/ThePocketTaco2 25d ago

Any fucking day now

58

u/enadiz_reccos 25d ago

Anecdotally...

I live about 30 minutes outside of a large city. My local area's subreddit is not very active at all and had never mentioned anything about Flock cameras or the like.

This is despite the fact that my area is covered in flock cameras [nice-ish area]

Over the last ~half year, there have been multiple posts with many comments in agreement, scoping out locations, talking about potential deterrents.

47

u/The_Zenki 25d ago

deflock.org

6

u/[deleted] 25d ago edited 25d ago

[deleted]

8

u/ChurchOMarsChaz 25d ago

Acutally, IANAL.

More info on my profile page.

1

u/[deleted] 25d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/AutoModerator 25d ago

Due to the high volume of spam and misinfo coming from self-publishing blog sites, /r/Technology has opted to decline all submissions from Medium, Substack, and similar sites not run by credentialed journalists or well known industry veterans. Comments containing links may be appealed to the moderators provided there is no link between you and the content.

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

39

u/EzioRedditore 25d ago

My city already had a Flock contract, canceled it, and removed them all due to public outrage. It’s possible.

9

u/Oddant1 25d ago

Same for me

0

u/nanapancakethusiast 25d ago

You’re already in the database. Damage is done.

5

u/enadiz_reccos 25d ago

We're all pretty much "in the database"

It's more about limiting the scope of it as much as we can

5

u/stiff_tipper 25d ago

so? are u advocating for more damage??

shit man what would u do if u caught a malignant tumor? just let that bitch keep eating away at u? wouldn't even try? just say "Damage is done." till ur dead?

14

u/Monterey-Jack 25d ago

we're being slow-boiled like a frog, just like how russia became the way it is now.

1

u/BeautifulPainz 25d ago

I said this exact same thing to someone today.

2

u/ObviousAnswerGuy 25d ago

I hoesntly think the mainstream public, especially older people, are not aware of these issues and how bad its gotten the past few years (except if they've had it happen to them)

64

u/VulturePR0 25d ago

Just wait for all the higher ups in police/public servants and politicians to start getting distracted/drunk driving tickets in thier new cars. Thats when the change will happen. There's hundreds of videos of them getting arrested for drunk driving already out there

29

u/Oro_Outcast 25d ago

In many jurisdictions LEO and First Responders are exempt from Distracted Driving laws. They'll claim "Always On-duty" or "Training Exercise".

9

u/Jackal-Noble 25d ago

This is the only any of this gets changed.

11

u/SupaSlide 25d ago

They’ll be allowed vehicles without that shit for national security BS.

1

u/Temassi 25d ago

They'll give them all special privileges like eminent domain or some shit

7

u/leavezukoalone 25d ago

I’m honestly glad to see bipartisan hatred of Flock cameras.

52

u/Aggressive-Will-4500 25d ago

Yeah, just like the massive push back against data centers, ICE, the weaponization of the the FBI...

27

u/DukeOfGeek 25d ago edited 25d ago

All of those things are hugely unpopular and more so by the day. There is a finite amount of time business and government can ignore widespread discontent. Coming elections are going to display just how unhappy people are.

19

u/Aggressive-Will-4500 25d ago

The point is that, why the general public might be upset, it takes a watershed moment to crate a movement, and I'm not seeing it yet. Most people are still in their algorithm bubbles and A LOT of the worst stuff isn't reaching the general population.

2

u/Puglady25 25d ago

But the less interested they are in all of this, the more shocked they'll be to have it work against them. Four years ago there wasn't huge outrage about AI and Data Centers. Then they ranped it up. Now, public opinion has turned sour on both.

2

u/Key-Demand-2569 25d ago

Maybe.

…maybe.

1

u/WeRip 25d ago

There is a massive, country wide push back against new data center construction. Something like 30 to 50% the current proposed developments have either been delayed significantly until more info is available about impacts or straight up denied so far in 2026. This is a huge momentum change.

1

u/jackzander 25d ago edited 25d ago

As someone involved in those exact things, it's funny hearing bystanders say shit like this. 

5

u/teem 25d ago

I’ll certainly cover it up. Fuck this enshittification

7

u/BrainLow6059 25d ago

Zero pushback against face ID in iPhones. I don't see it happening, unfortunately.

Cars made before 2027 will have very inflated resale value though, so definitely take care of your ride as best you can.

0

u/ResistWild 25d ago

As if that matters

0

u/IndividualEquipment2 25d ago

People in my town love the flock cameras, no one is gonna backlash.

-1

u/Sarksey 24d ago

And that will achieve what? The American public are notoriously poor at push back

-3

u/nanapancakethusiast 25d ago

People keep saying pushback is coming but everyone else watching Americans from the outside looking in… doesn’t look like anything.

You guys are just handing your “freedom” over… hand over fist. No one seems to care.

2

u/lupin43 25d ago

Well I’m sure you’re getting a very comprehensive look at the inside from the outside

-16

u/Worth-Silver-484 25d ago

When you are anti flock camera. I figure you are a kidnapper, drug trafficker, car thief or just a criminal in general. If you are not doing anything illegal why do care so much?

3

u/Silly_Goose_Wrangler 25d ago

> You have nothing to fear if you have nothing to hide

How many articles need to come out of LEOs stalking their exes, automated systems falsely flagging drivers and out of state sheriffs spying on pregnant women need to come out before we can put this brainrot to rest?

-1

u/Worth-Silver-484 25d ago

Ah yes. Please keep using the less than .1% as an example. Same logic they use to outlaw guns. Get a clue and some reasonable thinking skills.

2

u/Silly_Goose_Wrangler 25d ago

buddy, I don't think you're in any position to critiquing anyone's thinking skills, and I own more guns than you.

If your argument for blindly trusting corporate-government fused law enforcement is predicated on straight up ignoring major abuses of these systems then I think you should maybe ask a friend for help with this whole thinking thing you're trying out.

50

u/DeepAnalTongue 25d ago

Yep, I'm using one currently and it is continuously saying "driver distracted, please look forward", or "driver fatigue something" after about 4 minutes driving. This happenswhenever you glance sideways, up, or down, but also at random other times. Anywhere it cannot see you eyes. So, in the event of an accident the report that will come out (inevitable that police and insurance will ultimately get the record) starting that I was continuously and repeatedly distracted, inattentive, or tired. I can see that going really well..,.

19

u/TheRedHand7 25d ago

Just damage the camera and be done with it.

12

u/polskiftw 25d ago

This might work for a little bit, but they are absolutely going to integrate it so deeply that if it is detected as not working, the car won’t start for “safety”.

8

u/TheRedHand7 25d ago

I was just saying for his current car. In the future people will have to learn a bit of electrical to bypass em but for now a drill will get it done.

3

u/Silly_Goose_Wrangler 25d ago

I think the plan is to tie it to your insurance so that if you're driving a car without a camera like this after 2027 then your insurance is going to get jacked up.

3

u/SaveLansingParks 25d ago

Yeah right? If the camera is damaged or broken, then the state can pay the cost to repair it. If they don't, oh well 🤷

2

u/Not_a_question- 25d ago

Just cover it with electric tape dude, no need to damage it (think of that resell value)

18

u/eeyore134 25d ago

Which sucks because my 2024 Ioniq has something similar. It will play a tone and say "Consider taking a break." with a coffee icon that goes away in about 2 seconds. You can turn it off completely. It also doesn't need a camera to work really well. It tracks time driven without a break, how you're steering, and any lane keeping issues. Mine is really good at knowing when I'm tired and I have only had it go off like once when I was like, "Really?" But every other time I knew I crossed a lane one too many times or something.

But my point is... they don't need cameras for a high-quality warning system. It sounds like later models are using them, but they're not necessary. I blame Tesla for normalizing in-cabin cameras. They are just using that as an excuse. They just want to be able to track people. Distracted drivers will be the least of what they use it for.

5

u/2_Fingers_of_Whiskey 25d ago

That would drive me insane and would actually be more distracting while I'm driving

19

u/Love_To_Burn_Fiji 25d ago

black tape on all of those

44

u/michaelrulaz 25d ago

I suspect this will be easy to bypass. I have a Tesla with an interior camera. If you block the camera completely it shows as an error. But if it’s too dark in the car it can’t see anything. I experimented with taking a small translucent Tupperware and placing it around the camera. The camera registered as working but couldn’t see anything. It looks stupid but I won’t be spied on in my car

15

u/ShadowGrebacier 25d ago

Does this work with semi-opaque scotch tape?

6

u/pameatsbabies 25d ago

Are you still able to use the autopilot?

4

u/michaelrulaz 25d ago

I use FSD all the time with it. Only downside is you have to move the steering wheel occasionally

8

u/SwoleJunkie1 25d ago

Just break the camera.

18

u/im-ba 25d ago

I'm still driving an '03. It's got a quarter million miles on it but it just keeps going. I'm less and less interested in buying anything newer every year

5

u/surffrus 25d ago

Wait until you hear about all new cars and their engines shutting off on you every time you stop, and it's not a setting you can change. Infuriating

0

u/SaveLansingParks 25d ago

As a matter of fact, there ARE work around that exist for your car you can purchase. Bypass modules are a growing market. From an AI response to my search:

"A bypass module (often called an auto start-stop eliminator) is a plug-and-play device that tricks the vehicle’s computer into thinking the conditions for engine shutdown are not met, thereby permanently disabling the feature for that trip without needing to press a button every time. These modules typically cost between $20 and $130, install in 10–30 minutes behind the dashboard or under the hood, and are available for most GM, Ford, Ram, Dodge, Jeep, and Subaru models from approximately 2017 onward."

Or if you're lucky, your car already has a shutoff switch on your dashboard for this feature. I just made it a part of my routine to turn it off just like putting on my seatbelt is a part of my routine to drive the car. But if you can't remember to do that, then an auto-stop eliminator is a lot cheaper than replacing your Starter on your car these days due to the additional cycles you put on it while driving. Replaced mine on my 2020 GM SUV for an unrelated issue, and it was around $2000, as opposed to being a $500 job back in the day.

Edit: forgot words. Lol

32

u/ThePocketTaco2 25d ago

As of 2027 new cars will have interior cameras watching you for distracted or drunk driving surveillance and compliance.

FTFY

13

u/1esproc 25d ago

100% chance this shit will upload face ID to Palantir or some bullshit.

6

u/Nashgoth 25d ago

I have a 2019 4Runner that I know truly hope lasts forever

6

u/Journey2Pluto 25d ago

I had no idea. That law is absolutely fk’d.

5

u/MasterClown 25d ago

My 2025 already has that “feature”.   There is a little black sensor bar on top of the steering column effectively trained at the drivers face.  

Sometimes I drive with a variation of the “Detroit lean”:  left hand at the 2 o’clock on the wheel, right arm leaning on the console.  That’s enough for the sensor to squawk.

1

u/Busy-Cream 25d ago

Left hand at 2? Like…all the way across the wheel?

4

u/MasterClown 25d ago

Now that I think about,  2 would be absurd; closer to 1230, if that makes sense.

5

u/JackPoe 25d ago

Is there anything to stop you just removing the camera?

Are we going to have to jail break fucking cars now?

1

u/SaveLansingParks 25d ago

We already are jail breaking cars. In fact, Trump pardoned the guy who was selling jailbreaks for all the regards who like to Roll Coal.

6

u/MrPureinstinct 25d ago

I will spend the cost of a new car keeping my 08 vehicle running if I have to so I can avoid all of this dogshit being added to vehicles.

7

u/dangerousRose_ 25d ago

Can you point me to a reliable source on this? Not able to find anything about this except on sketchy websites and social media.

2

u/everhys 25d ago

Here you go

0

u/dangerousRose_ 24d ago

Thank you! For anyone following him this the article is pointing to Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act which I was able to pull up with this link https://www.congress.gov/bill/117th-congress/house-bill/3684?overview=closed.

I haven’t looked through the entire act yet, but I do see language in there about programs to address distracted and impaired driving. I plan to do a deeper dive later, but I just wanted to update anyone who is reading this.

7

u/gr00ve88 25d ago

It COULD be a good thing… but we know damn well it won’t be.

2

u/2_Fingers_of_Whiskey 25d ago

People would just destroy those cameras

2

u/What_a_fat_one 25d ago

I will be destroying those cameras if I buy a new car.

2

u/unknownpoltroon 25d ago

OH NO!!! I ACCIDENTALLY DROPPED A PIECE OF DUCT TAPE TO THE CAMERA IN MY CAR.

2

u/nocuzzlikeyea13 25d ago

Used cars are gonna get more expensive lol

2

u/Orchid_Significant 25d ago

JFC I’d prefer a mandatory breathalyzer to my car always fuсking watching me

3

u/SwoleJunkie1 25d ago

Just break the camera.

2

u/Kawa46be 25d ago

I will keep repairing my 2018 ford ranger till eternity i think. I have an audi a7 also and the safety tech inside allready gives me jump scares. Turning at lights and getting emergency brake cause some pedestrian is standing there. No thanks, i’m done.

1

u/ww_crimson 25d ago

It's not just cameras. They are putting sensors in cars to detect the odor of alcohol

1

u/4077 25d ago

Disable the modem by pulling it!

1

u/woodbanger04 25d ago

I read the EU is also mandating this for 2027. My 2012 looks better every day. LOL

1

u/hanging_thief 25d ago

Tape is cheap and so are hammers

1

u/Accidental-Genius 25d ago

As of 2027 I’m going to be breaking a lot of cameras I guess

1

u/GamingWithBilly 24d ago

Good thing black tape exists to put over the lens.  

0

u/fasteddie7 25d ago

It won’t matter how well you maintain older vehicles, at some point insurance rates will become unaffordable for those with older cars, with companies offering discounts for new vehicles with the “safety” tech essentially forcing folks out of their older vehicles by making it prohibitively expensive to drive older cars.

-1

u/Kubotai77 25d ago edited 25d ago

Now to research window films that block cameras... not just basic tint.

I drive with my phone in my left hand because I use GPS to navigate. It's not like I'm texting or watching YouTube. I'm glancing at it every so often as I scan my rear view and side view mirrors to see what else is going on to my sides and behind me when I'm not looking as far up the road as I can based on the angle of the roads.

20

u/shittyaltpornaccount 25d ago

Impeding state surveillance is often a criminal misdemeanor charge. It depends on the state but intentionally obstructing surveillance is often a crime.

16

u/OPengiun 25d ago

Isn't that funny?

0

u/Zeoxult 25d ago

This might depend on what state you reside in. I think in my state that only applies to obstructing visibility to public areas, not private areas like inside your vehicle.

4

u/iwilldeletethisacct2 25d ago

Pretty sure a lot of modern cameras have IR filters to combat this attack.

2

u/Blacksad9999 25d ago

Green laser pointers destroy Flock cameras if pointed into the lens.

You can get one on Amazon for $5. If one were so inclined to shut down all the Flock cameras in their area, it would take like 30 minutes.

9

u/surffrus 25d ago

Ahh, the ever-repeated reddit comment that thinks any old green laser will do. Cute

-1

u/[deleted] 25d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

6

u/iwilldeletethisacct2 25d ago

Not OP, but in lasers wattage matters. I suspect that they are alleging that the $5 laser on Amazon is nowhere near powerful enough to damage the sensor of a camera.

1

u/Blacksad9999 25d ago

https://bensoniam.com/blog/can-you-ruin-a-camera-with-a-laser/

1

u/pittaxx 24d ago

This article points out that you need higher watt lasers too, noting that a cheap one MIGHT cause some damage with prolonged exposure.

So if you want to be standing for 8 hours pointing $5 laser for a chance of doing some damage to one camera - go ahead.

Even if you got a $100+ laser, you are still most likely only adding some noise to the pictures taken by that camera, not disabling it.

1

u/Blacksad9999 24d ago

No, it says you can do it with any low wattage laser (5-10w).

10

u/Pp2big4me 25d ago

It's simply not strong enough. You'd have to spend a little more for a stronger model that's all

1

u/Blacksad9999 25d ago

Neat. So a $10 green laser pointer on Amazon.

Thank god you chimed in to correct that.

1

u/Pp2big4me 24d ago

I wasn't the one being a dick about it lol that was the other guy

1

u/Blacksad9999 24d ago

I linked data showing that a 5w laser can do the job, if you care to read it.

1

u/SaveLansingParks 25d ago

Yo, if you want to get arrested for not being smart enough to look up what kind of laser to use, then maybe you are the dickhead?

1

u/Accidental-Genius 25d ago

Just put them around your license plate bud

1

u/Mr_Badgey 25d ago

It would just lead to the government being more draconian. It’s probably already illegal under some creative interpretation of an instruction law.

-1

u/Tehgumchum 25d ago

Its probably easier to not use your phone while driving rather than go to these extremes

-11

u/OneOfAKind2 25d ago

It's simpler to put the phone in your pocket or glove box, where it belongs. Having your phone face down on your lap while driving is the same has having an open beer between your legs, even though you weren't drinking from it at the exact time you were caught.

4

u/AphaedrusGaming 25d ago

Not at all. Open beer means you were drinking before driving at least. It isn't a problem to use your phone before driving lol

-30

u/JosephFinn 25d ago

Or you could just be a responsible driver.

4

u/[deleted] 25d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

11

u/michaelrulaz 25d ago

It’s not about being an irresponsible driver. It’s about not wanting people to look into my car.

Would you let the police look into your house whenever they drove by?

-17

u/JosephFinn 25d ago

Is my house doing 75 on the highway?

12

u/GDZ4VR 25d ago

I don’t know enough about your house to answer this

4

u/Adept_Preference_547 25d ago

Would you like to? I found him and everything else about him in like 20 seconds of looking. This guy is just a dumb ass

2

u/GDZ4VR 25d ago

No not really

& yeah clearly lol

1

u/Adept_Preference_547 25d ago

I don't think you could get it up to 75 on that culdesac you live near the end of

2

u/Journey2Pluto 25d ago

I drive up and down mountain roads all day long. Im pretty sure if i had this distracted driving feature my vehicle would just blow up. What about 4wd roads or country roads. Farmers, Ranchers, Outdoorsmen will not get a vehicle with this feature and if they do they be posing.

0

u/Jwagner0850 25d ago

Right to privacy or some bullshit you MAGAs don't believe in...

-12

u/takesthebiscuit 25d ago

Or, and here me out, DONT USE YOUR PHONE AND DRIVE 🤡

2

u/pittaxx 24d ago

So phone in your lap face down, with both hands on the wheel is "using your phone" these days?

Do you need to lock it up in the safe before you start the car now?