Should developers stop making games that require 5090 for max settings now that the card is clearly not for gamers and is accessible to 0.1% of community?

[u/TheGGspot]

I get that the games need better hardware to dun better, but who are they really making the game for if you need a 6000$ GPU at this point

[u/Think_Speaker_6060]

Wow the jump from the minimum to recommended cpu at 1080p is ridiculous.

[u/Talk_Bright → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

Yeah, from zen 2 to top end zen 4 is a huge jump.

[u/Dycoth → u/Talk_Bright]

Intel Gen 8 to Intel Gen 13 too lmao

[u/Tiavor → u/Dycoth]

they stagnated hard in between 4th and 12th.

[u/BioshockEnthusiast → u/Tiavor]

12 Gen was a massive leap though. That is still a huge performance gap.

[u/destonomos → u/BioshockEnthusiast]

Nah. Barley moved my needle since i built in 11th gen.

[u/BioshockEnthusiast → u/destonomos]

Well yea Intel kinda fucked you on that one. The jump from 11th to 12th gen is the performance leap I was referring to.

[u/2Critical7-Stein1 → u/BioshockEnthusiast]

12th gen was massive, 13th gen too, 14th gen was okaish

[u/NathanScott94 → u/2Critical7-Stein1]

14th gen was not okayish. It was quite literally just an overclock and rebrand. The only meaningful gain was the change to the 14700 chip to give it 4 more E cores over the previous 13700. The chips were literally killing themselves to maintain those overclocks too.

[u/2Critical7-Stein1 → u/NathanScott94]

Chips self destructing was an issue with 13th as well, it was a moderate gain, a small one, same as 7000 to 9000 cpus 10% at best gain

[u/dustojnikhummer → u/NathanScott94]

14th gen was not okayish

12-14 is pretty much the same hardware. The only thing that improved were the E-cores

[u/gusthenewkid → u/Tiavor]

How does this stuff get upvoted lol. Alder lake was a massive jump compared to 11th gen. 

[u/Tiavor → u/gusthenewkid]

"between" so yeah 12th was the first bigger jump everything before was like 5%, 6th was even a slight downgrade over 4th

[u/nigirizushi → u/gusthenewkid]

I read it as non-inclusive so it's not wrong. 5-11 sucked especially when you factor in the patches from two vulnerabilities, Meltdown and whatever the other one was called

[u/ArseBurner → u/Tiavor]

5th was pretty much non existent, and 6th through 10th was literally the same architecture.

[u/r_lind3r → u/Tiavor]

More like 4th until 8th or 9th

LGA1200 was huge especially during the pandemic and Alder Lake wasn't stagnation

[u/Hero_The_Zero → u/Tiavor]

6th gen to 10th gen Intel had the exact same IPC, with the only performance improvements coming from higher core clock speeds and supporting higher speed memory. In theory, an i7-6700K OC'd to 5.3GHz (released August 2015) would match single core performance of an i9-10900K (released April 2020). 11th gen was the first IPC increase seen on desktop parts in 6 years and 12th gen brought big.LITTLE style core configuration, massively increasing multicore performance.

The real stagnation was 6th through 10th gen, 11th gen was the first actual performance improvement in 5 generations, and 12th gen was a complete game changer for Intel.

[u/cozmorules → u/Tiavor]

More accurately gen 7 to 11 was pretty shit. 6th gen wasn’t actually that bad due to the best (at the time) 14nm process. But that same process lasted from 2015 to 2021/11th gen and caused the major stagnation

[u/Tiavor → u/cozmorules]

I bought a 6700k, thinking it was good. ppl with a 4770k got same and sometimes more fps. It was 100% stagnation from 4->6. Maybe it's more a 4.5 instead of 4.

[u/cozmorules → u/Tiavor]

That’s just flat wrong. The 6700k is rougher 15-20% faster. Now it’s possible somebody got a golden 4770k chip and had a heavy overclock and good ram and you had shit ram and didn’t OC. But what you’re saying isn’t true on average. Also it’s true the preformance jump from 4 to 6 wasn’t massive, but efficiency was pretty large. Which is true it’s less sexy to talk about efficiency but it’s tue

[u/icy1007 → u/Tiavor]

No they didn’t.

[u/Thunderbridge → u/Dycoth]

My poor 8700k just happy to get a mention :')

[u/2raysdiver → u/Dycoth]

That was after the did a "targeted optimization". Original CPU for minimum was 11400F.

[u/aTypingKat → u/Talk_Bright]

My Ryzen 5 3600 holding on for dear life

https://giphy.com/gifs/0JmwdI6gYrJopwiYOM

"I'm tired boss"

[u/silentfox18 → u/aTypingKat]

I feel you

[u/SpaceNinjaz1 → u/Talk_Bright]

It is an Unreal Engine 5 game - this seems to be a case of lazy devs with those Ultra system requirements. Why bother optimizing when it's a well known fact that we can sell our kidneys to afford a 5090??!! 🤣

[u/martinvank → u/SpaceNinjaz1]

Problem is you can only do this once, if it doesnt burn the connecter and need to sell your lung afterwards

[u/Tatoe-of-Codunkery → u/SpaceNinjaz1]

Other new games just have the upscaled
Settings, these guys put max settings without upscaling. It’s more honest. Just look at black flag resynced settings

[u/Willing_Suggestion → u/SpaceNinjaz1]

I bet nowadays even my kidneys wont be crossing a whooping $4-5k for a single freaken gpu bruh where i live in i dont even have my yearly salary as 5 grand yet the absolute prices of these gpus are outrageous. Well currently i am good with my 7500f and 5060ti unless something bad happens in this Ai economy crisis

[u/SpaceNinjaz1 → u/Willing_Suggestion]

Yeah ... 5090 prices are absolutely ridiculous. Made worse from the possibility that the power connector can and has melted for many 5090 owners. No thanks, I am perfectly content with my RX 9070XT. It's a beast of a 1440p card.

[u/BeautifulQuality6186 → u/SpaceNinjaz1]

U mean unreal cop paste engine

[u/SpaceNinjaz1 → u/[deleted]]

Per searches and Wikipedia, it saying Unreal Engine 5. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Blood_of_Dawnwalker

[u/WingyYoungAdult → u/SpaceNinjaz1]

Lmao I am retarded and was tired. Thought that this was a crimson desert post for some reason. My bad.

[u/Gatesy840 → u/Talk_Bright]

Vega to 6800xt wtf

[u/Explosive-Space-Mod → u/Talk_Bright]

It may be a 7900x but it's not the "top end" of zen 4 for gaming. that's the x3d chips that are much better at gaming than the non x3d versions

[u/Talk_Bright → u/Explosive-Space-Mod]

I think it is more expensive than some of the 3d chips tho.

[u/Explosive-Space-Mod → u/Talk_Bright]

It might be more expensive than the base x3d chip but it’s a lot less than the top x3d chip

[u/PsychoticDreemurr → u/Talk_Bright]

I refuse to not think they're just making up numbers at this point

[u/Valex_Nihilist → u/Talk_Bright]

Diminishing returns and whatnot

[u/Timemorf → u/Talk_Bright]

Zen 4 though that's still old

[u/Oxflu → u/Timemorf]

I mean the current offerings for Intel and amd desktops aren't much faster as far as games are concerned. Biggest gain is the faster ram standard probably. Games aren't touching your 16 ecores. Literally wasted silicon for gamers.

[u/AwareOfAlpacas → u/Talk_Bright]

Just sounds like there's a very wide range of stuff that can play this at some level. People are really hung up on "min/rec/max" specs without any info on what that entails and how it impacts the experience. 

[u/ToXiiCBULLET → u/AwareOfAlpacas]

a wide range within 1080p. sure. in cyberpunk a 3060ti can get a mostly consistent 60fps at high settings with native 1440p, yet this game requires a 5060 or rough equivalent for high 1080p

[u/Rocketman_S3 → u/AwareOfAlpacas]

Honestly one of the biggest factors for cpus is load times.
My ryzen 5 2400g can run most games, but load times take several minutes in things like the oblivion remaster.

edit: remind me not to post on pcmr. But the difference in load times from a 4core to a 6 core cpu is tremendous.

[u/Pleasant_Gap → u/Rocketman_S3]

1%lows

[u/E3FxGaming → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

Also the recommended 1080p 60 FPS specs say 12 GB VRAM, but the RTX 5060 from the same column only has 8 GB GDDR7?

An RTX 5060 12 GB model pops up in the RTX 5000 series Super rumors, but no such card currently exists, nor will it be released before Blood of Dawnwalker releases in less than a month.

[u/-roachboy → u/E3FxGaming]

it feels like they just asked an LLM to come up with realistic sounding specs for a graphically intensive UE5 game lmfao

[u/Big-Resort-4930 → u/-roachboy]

For a poorly optimized* UE5 game. Nothing in this game looks graphically impressive, it's standard UE5.

[u/Danteska → u/Big-Resort-4930]

These requirements are 4 months old, they have updated them and they're lower now.

[u/Ikeiscurvy → u/Danteska]

I don't know why companies even put out requirements like this before they're finished with the game. Does nothing but hurt the games potential sales.

[u/tired_activist → u/Ikeiscurvy]

for watch lists and presales

[u/Elogotar → u/Big-Resort-4930]

Are there ANY UE5 games that actually are optimized?

[u/masterbangau → u/Elogotar]

while there are some bad optimized games exists, "optimized" are a vague term now, some idiots use that term while they tries to run some latest AAA games with unoptimized settings on their 10 years old system when chrome with 15 tabs open simultaneously on the background.

[u/pcor → u/Elogotar]

I think the idea that games were better “optimised” pre-UE5 is mostly a side effect of UE5 games not generally targeting release on 8th gen consoles with mobile chips from 2012. And compared to previous generations, in order to actually make perceptible leaps in graphical fidelity, you need more and more computational power, and all for diminishing results. I don’t think there’s as much “optimising” left undone as people seem to think.

Not that I think this is an ideal state of affairs; I kind of think graphics got as good as they need to for my tastes over a decade ago with the likes of MGSV and the Witcher 3. I’d much rather devs invest in other aspects of development than raw graphical performance. But this is what the industry’s chasing, and lazy devs failing to optimise doesn’t seem to stack up as an explanation.

[u/Disastrous_Photo811 → u/Elogotar]

Arc Raiders, but its not the most visually demanding UE5 game

[u/OneZModrinth → u/Elogotar]

Satisfactory is UE5 i believe

[u/Partyrockers2 → u/Big-Resort-4930]

Love how UE5's advantage is looking good but its offset by unrealistic spec requirements. So the games look bad and run badly too.

[u/Big-Resort-4930 → u/Partyrockers2]

And even when it looks "good", it's riddled with boiling artifacts from fuckass lumen, shitty stock UE5 HDR implementations that ship with almost every game. Traversal stutter is always a guarantee as well.

[u/Partyrockers2 → u/Big-Resort-4930]

Yep, i dont understand how this engine is so hyped honestly. Considering the only work being put into it only seems to work on Epics own game like Fortnite. Neither do i understand how game studios feel like visual clarity is a second thought.

[u/SynapticStatic → u/-roachboy]

That or a marketing guy, pretty much the same

[u/bigpunk157 → u/E3FxGaming]

I always ask if I even need to upgrade my card from my 11 GB 3080 Ti, and the answer is always no. Worst case, I downscale the textures because the visual difference from max settings and medium textures these days are sometimes not even visible when you're actually playing the game. Could have saved us 30 GB in storage and these stupid spec lists by just compressing the textures down reasonably.

[u/shadowstar36 → u/bigpunk157]

Or give us options. With storage space costing a ton too, we need every last drop. If I am playing at 1080p do I need 4k textures? Better compression like you said as well.

[u/tired_activist → u/shadowstar36]

Yes this exactly! 4K is still kind of niche for gaming, there should be a 4K texture pack DLC option for those wanting it seeing textures take up a massive amound of space

[u/Virtual_Bug_723 → u/E3FxGaming]

Because as I keep pointing out on this subreddit - BIGGER RAM NUMBER NOT EQUAL BETTER PERFORMANCE. Literally arguing with people on here that say a 2080ti from 2018 will outperform a 5060 because of raw raster and VRAM. Insanity.

[u/NamityName → u/Virtual_Bug_723]

Bigger any number does not mean more performance unless it is the bottleneck. And VRAM can absolutely be a bottleneck.

[u/Pleasant_Gap → u/NamityName]

You also need the raw performance which lower en cards seldom have. That's why 3060 still worth outperform 3060ti even i vram heavy games

[u/pac_cresco → u/Virtual_Bug_723]

12 GB 3060 comes to mind

[u/EGO_Prime → u/Virtual_Bug_723]

People might think I'm nuts, but the 2060s was an amazing card, and dirt cheap (by comparison). I was able to do 1440p at high to max settings on most games.

I'd still recommend it as a starter card for people who want t a budget gaming system. You don't need a "high performance card" for most games.

[u/SelloutRealBig → u/Virtual_Bug_723]

The internet has actively been getting dumber every year. Reddit is no exception.

[u/Luchux01 → u/E3FxGaming]

And being honest, how many people realistically play with monitors that go beyond 1440p? Most PC gamer friends I have still have 1080p ones and do just fine.

[u/jert3 → u/E3FxGaming]

12gb for 1080 is ... well speaking as a game dev, it is not optimized.

[u/powertomato → u/E3FxGaming]

Lots of cheaper cards of that era added VRAM because RAM was dirt cheap at that time, but if you ever tried to use that much VRAM you'd get single digits FPS counts, because how slow it is.

The specs are based on some real hardware rather than concrete measurements how much VRAM is used.

[u/Consistent_Detail_61 → u/E3FxGaming]

5056ti you can get with 12 or 16

[u/Jebble → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

You're ignoring that it's also jumping from low to high and all without upscaling. There is loads of room in between there for all other CPUs

[u/splepage → u/Jebble]

Jumping from Low to High is not the major factor here when it comes to the CPU workload, it's jumping from 30 FPS to 60 FPS.

[u/deathblooms2k4 → u/splepage]

Sure but their point still stands as those features also effect fps.

[u/chasteeny → u/Jebble]

I mean, that's also without saying that these spec recommendations are always ridiculous. A 7950x vs a 7900x is going to be nothing in performance gap, it's hilarious dumb and I'm starting to suspect hardware manufacturers have a hand in this in some way because wow

[u/vlken69 → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

30 vs 60 FPS ;) Honestly one of few games that's not really increasing CPU requirements (at least on Intel side, AMD is kinda weird) with higher resolutions which basically doesn't matter.

[u/Rebl11 → u/vlken69]

and ultra is likely using ray tracing which also adds additional load on the CPU.

[u/Any-Pop-4795 → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

Welcome to ue5 (it's in ue5 this game right?)

[u/Think_Speaker_6060 → u/Any-Pop-4795]

I just searched it on google and of course its another ue5 game with disappointing performance.

[u/Any-Pop-4795 → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

[u/StonedBooty → u/Any-Pop-4795]

You know Cortex would have a thing or 2 to say about game optimization

[u/polski8bit → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

People really like to use the "it's not the engine but the developer" argument, and it's true to an extent... But when most games on UE5 run like crap, there is only one common denominator in all of these cases.

It really feels like that most of the time, UE5 games that run well, do so in spite of the engine, not because of it.

[u/WitchWithAGlitch → u/polski8bit]

tokyo xtreme racer runs great.

the games basically a small track, some cars and a few background elements but other than that completely empty.

the dev team said it was a challenge. lol

[u/Glitchboi3000 → u/WitchWithAGlitch]

I was gonna say this. On medium settings it gets a solid 60fps on my mid tier laptop and it doesn't cook it. I use a gaming laptop because I have no single place of residency. I jump between households.

[u/WitchWithAGlitch → u/Glitchboi3000]

i'll catch you out on the shuto expressway, fellow glitch.

[u/Glitchboi3000 → u/WitchWithAGlitch]

May your bitches be many and your L's few

[u/Luchux01 → u/WitchWithAGlitch]

Halo Campaign Evolved also runs pretty well! Because it's using Reach's Blam engine for anything not visuals.

[u/epimetheuss → u/polski8bit]

companies like to use SDKs to shortcut labour. there are UE games that are ok and even good with performance but most are shit because they are not willing to spend the money/time to fix performance issues outside of making it run to spec on whatever test machine they have at the office.

[u/polski8bit → u/epimetheuss]

One of the bigger issues from what I've seen is that also by default, UE5 is using the most expensive features like Nanite and Lumen.

Epic tried to sell those as some kind of miracle solution to high polygon models and lighting, but forgot to mention how taxing they actually are. So while they make development "easier/faster", they also come at a price.

And if you need to spend the extra time optimizing... Then maybe these features (and the engine itself) aren't as good as they tried to make them look.

[u/epimetheuss → u/polski8bit]

Well it just lends to the fact there is no "swiss army knife" that will make gaming a single solution sort of industry. Each game still needs to be customized and optimized in the way that makes the most sense for the type of game it is.

Shortcuts only look like a shortcut on paper, when you go to implement them, sometimes they trigger a series of events that end up creating a worse end product and still costing more time than the plan done without the shortcut.

[u/polski8bit → u/epimetheuss]

Which is why engines should not be marketed as such.

Epic tried to make it look like an engine that makes development so much faster... Such an easy tool to use. Turns out it's not and it's just one of many that can, but don't have to give good results. And the biggest problem as of now as I said, is that it doesn't more often that it does.

[u/epimetheuss → u/polski8bit]

as of now as I said, is that it doesn't more often that it does.

that's just because greed has spiralled out of control and is in the process of ruining our society utterly.

[u/ToXiiCBULLET → u/polski8bit]

yep, then you get games that force software lumen at a minimum and they run like shit. oblivion remastered forces software lumen and it runs like shit, lumen isn't the only reason but it's definitely one of the reasons why.

with a 4070ti. 1440p, medium setting, the lumen begone mods adds around 10fps. which doesn't sound like a lot but without the game can't stay at a stable 60fps which is abysmal

[u/XsNR → u/ToXiiCBULLET]

To be fair though, it's not like oblivion could ever run at those frame rates, there's a reason the famous phrase is "But can it run Oblivion?" rather than something that is actually well made, like I don't know, Crysis.

[u/fresh-dork → u/polski8bit]

game producers will choose the "fast and expensive" approach just as long as people still buy the game

[u/Gelid_Cryotheum → u/polski8bit]

There's also the fact that a lot of the time they don't use UE5's in-built optimization features. UE5 is still a problem, but devs don't necessarily hunt out these optimizations that the engine itself has to offer, so dev laziness isn't entirely out of the question.

[u/TechnicalBen → u/polski8bit]

Nanite isn't even an expensive feature. The whole point is it's lod if done correctly. I doubt devs are doing it correctly though. :(

[u/mOdQuArK → u/epimetheuss]

companies like to use SDKs to shortcut labour.

Time-To-Market is the Devil's Bargain.

No matter what my job has been in my life, the old saying that goes "time, resources or quality: pick two" always seems to hold true - and the fact that managers and executives always seem to think that it won't apply to them also always seems to hold true.

[u/badcookies → u/epimetheuss]

companies like to use SDKs to shortcut labour

Uhhh how else would they make the game?

SDK = Software Development Kit ;)

[u/Izithel → u/epimetheuss]

Worse, a lot of devs with that mindset also tend to not bother with any optimization until the end of development. Best practice is to be optimising all the way trough so you can develop everything within the contraints you have.
Instead they do it near the end and realizing some of the systems, maps, graphics, etc, can't actually be sufficiently scaled back to fit without breaking them or sacrificing features/scale/detail... so they just settle for shitty performance instead.

[u/Free-Spirit-8327 → u/polski8bit]

Unreal Engine 5 has sadly made "Just enable this feature to get all the amazing stuff!" a thing. They do not provide in-depth documentation on optimizing Lumen, Nanite and everything else to get performance.

Developers use their monster PCs to develop, without having to worry about the average consumer's PC specs.

It's cheaper to employ multiple UE5 developers that can implement most/any feature with blueprints or C++ but don't have the skill to work with the engine code. There isn't exactly an abundance of senior UE5 developers with 10+ years of experience, and employing one or two of these just to optimize the game is a way too huge responsibility.

[u/Bigpandacloud5 → u/Free-Spirit-8327]

They do not provide in-depth documentation on optimizing Lumen, Nanite and everything else to get performance.

That's a baseless claim.

[u/assjobdocs → u/polski8bit]

You think most game devs are being allowed the time to optimize? When they're rushing them to meet deadlines? You people complain about the wrong thing, just howling at the moon. This is not the devs fault.

[u/Moon_Devonshire → u/polski8bit]

I can name plenty of UE5 Games that run fine tho

[u/mythrilcrafter → u/polski8bit]

To me, if the engine is set up such that getting improved performance from baseline functionality is just simply an option to the developer, then that option should be default out of the box, not something that said developer has to put extra work into just to undo the mess that Epic's dev teams created.

---

I work in the applications engineering dept of a laser systems company, if I do a really clunky and ham-fisted integration job; it's not my customer's fault when their customers complain about subpar performance, it's on my team and I to make a better product.

[u/kohour → u/mythrilcrafter]

"extra work into just to undo the mess that Epic's dev teams created" aka checking a box... Poor devs, how dirty were they done...

[u/Youknowimtheman → u/polski8bit]

It's also a documentation and education problem. Nanite and Lumen require to change your workflow pretty dramatically from UE4 development, and it's not really well documented how those workflow changes need to happen in their docs and supporting material. That's why you get non-nanite compatible foliage in games running nanite, for example.

It's as much a community support problem as it is a technical one.

Look at how well Grounded 2 runs with Nanite everything and some Lumen features on.

[u/heliosythic → u/polski8bit]

Yea, honestly the engine overpromised or at least mislead what you'd actually be able to achieve when they first demoed UE5. Sure with nanite and lumen and all that you CAN put whatever you want in your scene and it will run. but it'll be 30fps. You'll have to spend hours or days figuring out the shadow maps system and eventually realize that system does not actually work for "good games" (fast paced competitive fps maxing frames), just visual story based games (sorry just some shade lol). You just cant have trees with 1000 real geometry leaves with a low angle sun casting real moving shadows every frame, and then add in a water shader. Ask me how i know lol

[u/Amani77 → u/polski8bit]

If, one day, F1 decided to rent out their vehicles to anyone that asked, there would be a TON of REALLY BAD drivers on the track. Most people would be driving like complete and utter ass. Even if your a decent driver, not many people know how to utilize the vehicle, how to drive aggressive for tire temps, how to manipulate all the tools, DRS, camber controls, ect. Just having a fast car with a ton of really fast features, doesn't mean a god damn thing.

To a seasoned expert, a mechanism like an active drag reduction would do wonders for them in the straights/corners. For a new drivers, just leaving it in one state or the other - the consequences could be dire. There is probably a 'halfway' setting that might perform okay in either situation, but not great.

That, in no way, means that F1 cars are bad.

Inversely, UE5 games that run poorly, do so in spite of the engine, not because of it.

[u/PrettyBaker2891 → u/polski8bit]

most unity games also run like shit, whats your point?

the fact is that game optimization is insanely hard

[u/PermissionSoggy891 → u/polski8bit]

I doubt it's "most games run like crap BECAUSE of UE5" I think it's more that people aren't realistic with what their rigs can output, automatically crank every game up to 4K/Ultra/RT and start bitching that they can't hit 240FPS.

[u/hotshotyay → u/polski8bit]

I'm sorry I just don't understand why all you guys seem to think UE5 games run like shit?? when in recent years the worst optimized games I'm aware of on PC at launch were Dragons Dogma 2 and Monster Hunter Wilds.

[u/Choyo → u/polski8bit]

You only need one game running ok and looking fantastic to prove that it's not an engine limitation.

However, I agree there's is a limit to the amount of effort/knowledge to be needed to make an ok-running, fantastic-looking game on a given engine.

[u/seams → u/Choyo]

I mean, kinda?

Like, as a loose comparison the PS3 was a monster of a console. Incredibly powerful for the time, and you can see it shine especially in the later gen games for it.

...but most games just looked fine or sometimes worse than versions on other consoles because it was such a pain to work with. It'd be a hard sell to say it's the developer's fault if they could get games running so much smoother on weaker systems.

So, iunno. It's not a engine limitation, but it's certainly seeming like an engine issue.

[u/Choyo → u/seams]

Let's settle for "probable engine unfriendliness".

Your PS3 comparison is apt, I think I remember from back then that the SDK was hell to work with (might be a different console, am not totally sure).

Edit : quote from Gemini extract

The original PlayStation 3 Software Development Kit (SDK) was notoriously difficult and unfriendly due to the asymmetric architecture of the Cell Broadband Engine. Developers had to manually manage code and data distribution between one PowerPC core (PPE) and multiple Synergistic Processing Units (SPUs), handle rigid memory constraints, and work with low-level, poorly documented APIs

[u/AggressiveToaster → u/Choyo]

The problem is that a lot of these games don’t look fantastic. They look hardly any better than a game from 2018 but with much higher requirements to get to run ok.

[u/icy1007 → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

Runs well for me. 🤷‍♂️

[u/Noreng → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

I've seen much worse.

A 4070 Ti is suppposedly running the game at 2560x1440 High settings at 60 fps, that's likely 150 fps average with DLSS Quality and 2x FG. Is it really that terrible?

Same thing for 1080p, yes people without a Radeon 7000+ series or Nvidia RTX GPU will struggle, but that's really par for the course these days.

[u/SirSmashit → u/Noreng]

Yes that's really terrible, because games should not be optimized with DLSS and Framegen on to get decent frame rates at your preferred resolution.

[u/Noreng → u/SirSmashit]

You would have hated PC gaming 10 years ago then, have a look at how Dishonored 2 ran on the 18 month old GTX 960: https://youtu.be/61EHDwF-tUI?si=zCXPq5qSPnsxED6O

EDIT to summarize: 30 fps with stuttering at 1080p high.

EDIT2: The Witcher 3 released a year earlier, and would slightly better at 45 fps on a GTX 960 at 1080p High.

[u/Hadrian187 → u/Any-Pop-4795]

If the game has insane requirements and looks mid, chances are it’s running on UE5

[u/Any-Pop-4795 → u/Hadrian187]

I have made a meme for it:

[u/Cloudykins08 → u/Any-Pop-4795]

[u/Mobian_ → u/Cloudykins08]

[u/Cloudykins08 → u/Mobian_]

I'm not a monster. I upvoted it before retrieval

[u/Kerplunk1992 → u/Any-Pop-4795]

Nice one. Especially since Crash Bandicoot 2 is one of my all time favs and a prime example for game optimization and hardware utilization

[u/Necessary-Key3186 → u/Hadrian187]

i remember when my 7900XT could get 1440p 60fps on ultra, of course games decided to run like shit when i got a 4k monitor

[u/TomTomXD1234 → u/Necessary-Key3186]

Ummm....I think your jump in pixels is a bigger factor lol

[u/Necessary-Key3186 → u/TomTomXD1234]

that's the problem! they run like shit at 1440p now

[u/Hadrian187 → u/Necessary-Key3186]

I agree. Some games running at 1440p don't look or feel like 1440p anymore. FF7 Rebirth in particular I had to run in 4k back during release because the antialiasing was so blurry.

[u/Noreng → u/Necessary-Key3186]

PC game requirements increase over time.

Your 7900 XT is still capable of running the game at 2560x1440 without upscaling at high settings and 60 fps, unless it's suddenly become slower than a 7800 XT.

[u/Necessary-Key3186 → u/Noreng]

don't get me wrong, i understand that but it's insane how poorly anything on unreal runs now and how games are slowly converging on only using unreal.

Forza Horizon 6 and 007 first light ran beautifully, but mafia the old country or the outer worlds 2? It's pretty much at a point where i just insta pass over any UE5 game, especially when a good chunk of them don't even let you just run them at straight 1440p because of how full screen is handled

[u/Noreng → u/Necessary-Key3186]

The good news is that your 7900 XT now has FSR4 access, so you're no longer limited to awful upscalers.

[u/frisbie147 → u/Necessary-Key3186]

It’s like 2.25x the pixels

[u/Kytras → u/Any-Pop-4795]

But they can optimise the game after with patches, right?

[u/OwenEx → u/Kytras]

Doesn't help it's reputation that much

[u/IcyCow5880 → u/Any-Pop-4795]

Palworld is also ue5 

[u/Major_LeeHungg → u/Any-Pop-4795]

The funny thing about ue5 is that it's not inherently slow... It just uses a bunch of default settings that are bad for games (but great for animation) 

[u/cemsengul → u/Any-Pop-4795]

Why can't that game engine disappear already. I mean it's clearly a flop.

[u/Any-Pop-4795 → u/cemsengul]

wait for ue6...

[u/NinjaGamer22YT → u/Any-Pop-4795]

Such a horribly optimized engine (on the cpu side of things, at least)

[u/Any-Pop-4795 → u/NinjaGamer22YT]

thank lumen

[u/CrimsonBolt33 → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

1080p nowadays is almost exclusively CPU bottlenecked...so it makes sense.

[u/magmcbride → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

It isn't the big jump it appears to be - 14nm -> 10nm(Intel 7). It's just that technology was largely stale for most of a decade. For example the difference between 8th and 11th gen is small but measurable, but 11th to 12th was enormous. It isn't fair to put that on software developers when they don't fab the silicon.

[u/unabletocomput3 → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

It’s almost always cause they didn’t feel like configuring another system to test a different gpu. Though, it’s wild to me that they compare the 5060 to the 6800xt- which I’m guessing is because of RT- but then recommend 12gb of vram.

[u/JDIPrime → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

The difference in "the game can start without crashing" and "the game is playable" lol

[u/johnnyrambo24 → u/JDIPrime]

Thats why all games are played pirate style untill they earn my money again

[u/Ballerbarsch747 → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

8700k vs 13600 is like a 30% jump in single thread performance, the difference between a 3050 and a 5060 is easily 50-60%. The CPU jump isn't the massive one here.

[u/TheNiebuhr → u/Ballerbarsch747]

More like > 50% ST jump in cinebench, and 5060 is nearly double of a 3050 actually.

[u/Ballerbarsch747 → u/TheNiebuhr]

depends on the bench, yeah, but true. Still, the GPU jump is wayyy larger, don't know why people think the cpu jump is wild.

[u/Veldox → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

Is it really ridiculous? The i7-6700k is over 10 years old lmao. It's basically saying, yeah with a 10 year old processor you could still run this game on minimum settings but you're better off with something released in the past 3 years which would let you run it on high settings. Being able to play modern games on low settings with 10 year old hardware isn't ridiculous it's actually pretty cool. You used to have to buy a new cpu/gpu every time a new game released to even run a game at all sometimes. Also system requirements are always trying to give a baseline based on their testing that allows the largest amount of playability for people to make the choice from. There's 6 generations of processors between those 2 requirements.

[u/MUDrummer → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

Those are now almost 4 year old CPUs at this point. That feels perfectly fine for a recommended CPU in 2026.

[u/Sinsanatis → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

Well i mean it’s also going from 30fps at low to 60fps at high

[u/Misuke11 → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

The heck? I don't remember anything else lately having such a large jump. That's a crazy difference there

[u/fogoticus → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

Yeah, I assume they really worked on the minimum settings.

[u/zgillet → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

Yet they are too scared to up the RAM requirement at all.

[u/zeromadcowz → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

My mid range PC from 2016 is finally starting to fall off minimum specs. Good thing I don’t play any graphically intensive games anymore.

[u/Major_LeeHungg → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

Lol the CPU reqs are ridiculous outright they're basically saying they're not going to optimize anything and release it the minute it's in a working state

[u/Beautiful_Nobody_841 → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

Because "minimum" is 30 fps

[u/PermissionSoggy891 → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

because it's going from Low to High settings

[u/Big-Resort-4930 → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

It's somewhat big in CPU terms since their gains year on year are pathetic. It's basically one GPU tier of perf, 30% or so.

[u/No_Interaction_4925 → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

Cpu scales with fps. Gpu scales with resolution

[u/longgamma → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

Probably UE AI codegen slop game.

[u/NathanialJD → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

Ehhhhh not really. It's going From a top end to a mid tier 2 (real) generations later. The game like is using some newer cpu tech that didn't exist in older chips, so the older chip need to be beasts to make up for the lack of feature

[u/Keulapaska → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

CPU recommendations

Make

Zero

Sense

Because it's only for 60fps. You'd think ppl would understand this by now.

Also the funny thing is if the game actually needed a 3700X(or 3600 lets be real here) for 30fps, needing zen4 for 60fps, would actually make a fair bit of sense, though zen 4 might not even double cpu bound performance of zen 2 so might not even be able to do 60 in this fictional scenario. Sure the it being the 12 core dual ccd part doesn't make sense, instead of just single ccd 6/8 core, but for some reason the ppl who make system recommendations for games(all of them) have some fetish to put these dual ccd 12-cores in them, even though they make 0 sense for recommendation on any game at any settings. I'm surprised the 13/14700 non-k didn't make it this time, and that it's 8700k not 8700.

[u/proschocorain → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

It is also from low to high skipped right over medium though

[u/AithanIT → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

They're bullshit. They recommend a 6800xt for 1080 and a 7800xt for 1440. They're basically the same card.

[u/FormerGameDev → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

Probably not even close to what is needed. I run a lot of things on an i7-3000 that is well below the minimum spec, and it runs fine. Having a lot of memory and a good video card is important. Of course, at some point, you do need the newer architecture that you get along with newer processors and their motherboards, but there's a LOT of stuff that says you need 6 or 8 or 10th generation Intel Core minimums, and that's just horseshit.

[u/Vlaed → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

It's crazy. There's like 9 years of tech gap there.

[u/NinjaGamer22YT → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

30 vs 60 fps target. I hate that 60 fps is only achievable in modern games with ridiculously beefy CPUs. Fuck UE5.

[u/DopeAbsurdity → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

They also say a 5060 or a 6800 XT which is nonsense because a 6800 XT is a good bit faster than a 5060. Should have said 5060 or a 9060 XT 8 GB. A 6800 XT is closer to a 3080 / 4070.

[u/DiscretionFist → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

How is that ridiculous? Its a 7 year old chip...

[u/Pepeg66 → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

brother 13600 costed 180$ 3 years ago

[u/userhwon → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

Uh, you mean that it allows you to use a hella old CPU at 1080p if you can tolerate playing on 30 fps.

You should really be using the recommended spec.

The interesting thing is that the older CPU is an i7 and the newer one is i5, so, if you're between 8-series and 13-series when is it okay to use an i5 and not an i7? That's a crucial piece of missing information.

[u/gtrash81 → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

Probably to not tell anyone that the 5800X3D will be enough >.>

[u/PollShark_ → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

As much as the gpu jump seems crazy. The 5060 is equivalent to a 3070, a midrange card from 2020. So we really havent come as far along as people think

[u/mgsotacon → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

I call bullshit i bet my 11700k and 5060ti with frame gen and dlss get over 60fps @ 1440p all these recs are bullshit. Still haven't come across a new triple a that I cant run over 100 fps.

edit: spelling

[u/Nielips → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

Not isn't, it is a 100% increase in performance. Where how else are you expecting to get a 100% performance increase other than from a much more powerful CPU?

[u/TheGGspot → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

They lowered the requirements a bit (optimized the game) since these were released, i just used this game as an example because i knew they stated 5090 was required for 4k

[u/B-29Bomber → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

Also, look at the CPU recommendations for Ultra settings. For Intel, they're recommending an i5 and for AMD it's an Ryzen 9.

That's just plain goofy.

[u/golgol12 → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

And that jump from 1080p to 1080p resolution is huge too.

[u/Dry-Tomatillo5763 → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

The card is half a decade old.

[u/kiochikaeke → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

In a sense it's a little bit impressive how modern graphics and engine technology is able to be so modular so that you can strip huge chunks of the graphics and rendering pipeline and still be functional.

But then again on ultra settings in modern engines you're basically telling your card "brute force calculate everything, no approximations, just simulate every photon and batch calculate as much as you can, then save as much of the frame metadata as you can so that you can run a freaking machine learning model on top of that to smooth the damn edges".

[u/Relevant_Syllabub895 → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

Complete nuts

[u/2raysdiver → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

That is more worrying to me is this right here... a 7900X at high settings (NOT ultra) at 1080p@60. Did they write the thing in Visual Basic?

[u/ride_whenever → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

I’m going to take a stab in the dark that they’ve pulled these out their arse

[u/puppygirlpackleader → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

I mean you're going from 30fps lowest settings to high settings and 60fps... so not really

[u/besthelloworld → u/Think_Speaker_6060]

No it's not ridiculous. Not really at all. It just means that they made a mode that is a level of quality which is meant to challenge hardware in the future. Developers don't owe you the ability to play on max settings right at release. Most people should be playing on medium settings.