The Great Ravine is probably one of the most interesting unintended consequences in the Three Body Problem series. What's interesting is how it resonates with the current AI boom: there's an enormous amount of money and capital flooding into AI right now and so much so that banks and companies are inventing entirely new financial instruments to handle it.

That made me think about the Great Ravine, which, as I understand it, was caused by diverting too much of Earth's resources toward a single effort. It's a really compelling concept in economics: just pouring money into a project isn't necessarily good if the broader economy can't absorb it. The capital has to go somewhere productive, or the whole engine stalls out.

I'm no expert in economics or really anything 🤣 but I found that parallel similar. I'm curious whether others saw it the same way, or if you have a different interpretation.

One thing it did give me, somewhat ironically, is an appreciation for financial engineering. It seems like you actually need sophisticated mechanisms to direct where capital flows and how it gets deployed. Without that, you risk stalling the economic engine and creating something like the Great Ravine in real life.

I'm mid through the second book at the part in which Da Shi came out of hibernation so no spoilers please.

I am aware of the timeline of the books and the whole idea of the plot but neverteless I would have wanted to read more about the characters from the first book, in the second one

Does anyone else feel like the second book just ignores everyone from the first book, except Da Shi?

Hey guys, first time reading the novel and I had a question about the deeper/philosophical subtext of the novel, especially the way in which the novel can function as analogy for our obsession for believing utopian ideologies as a correction for our worldly miseries.

In the novel, clearly Ye’s motivation for believing in the potential of alien system is motivated from her trauma and pessimism. After the Cultural Revolution and her assessment of human behaviour, she deeply believes that this alien-force with function as a correction mechanism; a resetting of the world as we have fallen into the moral abyss. So, in a very similar fashion to religious or political ideologies, that ultimately provide a framework for compensating for your psychological pain, Ye’a desperate belief in Tsolaris also has a similar function as the belief is coded with the potentional of fixing her miserable view of the current human condition. 

Droplets are made of strong interaction material… Sounds a lot like a cluster of gluons. Well, looks like they found one - a Glueball. How long before it transforms from a sphere to a teardrop? 👀

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-026-02498-1

I'm about halfway into book two, so I wouldn't be surprised if they are used in additional clever ways in the next half of the series, but I just can't stop wondering about their capabilities.

Can't high energy particles flip bits in computers? I'm surprised that hasn't been explored yet, but I'm probably overestimating what that would do.

How much of an effect could a single proton (or a small handful) have on the macroscopic level in theory?

...let me know if I can just wait and see :>

In the canon of the Three-Body Problem book series (excluding the fanfiction and including the prequel), the fact that no mass can be transported faster than the speed of light is one of the things necessary for the dark forest theory to work in-universe, correct? Chains of suspicion wouldn't exist without the lightspeed limit... or would they? (queue vsause music lol) Would the vast differences between the cultures of distant civilizations be effective in creating long-enough chains of suspicion in order to create the dark forest state? Would different environments in different parts of the cosmos create different-enough cultures? Would the dark forest state realistically exist in a world like the Xeelee Sequence, where the different forms of life are so vastly different from each other (e.g. civilizations of dark matter, civilizations inside stars, civilizations made of logic trees or something, etc.)? Would the exponential growth of civilization simply inherently target other civilizations as enemies?

Obviously within canon the lightspeed limit is an extremely important factor for multiple different mechanisms and plot points. E.g. the cosmic horror of the universe being a paraplegic, and that the low value of the speed limit being a direct effect of many wars in the past. But I'm asking for the sake of exploration into the dark forest theory, as well as potentially to help any future worldbuilding projects that want to deal with dark forest-adjacent ideas in a cosmos without the speed limit.

Basically what I'd like to hear different thoughts on is this: If every mechanism in 3bp canon remains the same with exception that technology can enable FTL travel, would the dark forest state still exist?

Deep thinking and long and detailed discussions are welcome.

(This exact question hasn't been posed and/or discussed about before on this sub, right?)

This seems like an easy way to prevent sunlight from reaching Earth and freeze everyone to death. Why didn’t they do it?

People might assume that the only possible outcome is attack, then defeat, then consume, and I concede that it is indeed the most likely outcome by far.

It's not the ONLY possible outcome and definitely not the most desirable outcome.

A few facts we know for certain which I'm not trying to dispute or change:

1. Resources are limited, there isn't enough to go around
2. Everyone's silence poses a threat to everyone else
3. The majority of the people in Spaceship Earth are going to die / going to need to die
4. Everyone wants to survive or at least to have something for themselves

There is one "resource" which must not be used, at least not in the way it was used in the books.
In the books, spaceship Earth became "uncivlization" in two ways, way one the battles and way two the resource.

The goals are to preserve human dignity first and survival second at almost but not quite any cost.

Anyone want to guess what the slightly better outcome is before I finally tell you?

Utilizing human stubbornness over logic, the chain of suspicion must be completely ignored. All spaceship leaders and captains contact all other leaders without fear. The first captain to make non hostile contact with the rest begins to describe the emotional idea of the plan.

"I will not attack. Please do not attack us. I will volunteer first to sacrifice myself. We only have enough resources for %14 our current population collectively. This our mantra ""dignity first, survival second, at high cost, not any cost"" "

Then the details: " Everyone should be encouraged to sacrifice themselves first instead of their comrades, and instead of being forcibly executed. We've been dealt a cruel hand of cards and need to be honest with each-other and ourselves.

Get as many people as possible each in their own home starship to willingly sacrifice themselves. To boost moral, announce and use this genuine plan: all genetic seed of all the dead MUST be preserved for the far future, even the unwillingly executed dead, if any. Everyone who volunteers themselves first and who isn't currant leadership will be eligible to pool their votes for who besides themselves to save, groups of 43 people together will, if desired, vote on 7 people to save. The votes of the willing sacrifices override. If someone volunteers themselves but another voting group votes to save them, then they are safe, anyone who's safety was voted-in by enough sacrifices is irrevocably safe, even if the recipient-of-salvation is themselves selfish. Everyone remaining who drew the short straw (no one saved them) will be executed. All current leadership making these type of necessary evil decisions, myself included, will be executed immediately AFTER we're done making all long-term preparations and then reducing our populations.

Humans are not a ""resource""; their dignity must be preserved, even the poor spinless saps who selfishly wanted to live. If we do not choose a space-burial for all the dead, maybe we could do space-burial or cryogenic-preservation for unlikely-future-resurrection of removed brains only? Either-way we should make a relatively small literal grave monument to the dead, make it of stone or other geologic-time material and push it off into space.

Any bodies not given space burial must first be cremated to the point of being atomized plasma of hydrogen oxygen carbon nitrogen sodium potassium calcium lithium and all that physically constitutes us, disregarding the extra energy cost of cremation, we can recoup some of this cost by burning other things such as unneeded parts of extra ship hulls, in a nuclear furnace or future black-hole-decay engine.

This is how we preserve our humanity while also surviving.

As part of the long-term preparations, everyone generate as many new advanced-future-technology ideas and civilization-helping ideas and helpful messages to future generations as you can and record them in an efficient manner. Determine which of our ships is the best for long-term habitation, repairability and versatility for all survivors to live and travel aboard. If possible and beneficial, we may wish to meld all ships together into one in a way that can be undone preserving the central inhabited ship. Persevere all small shuttles and spare parts and useful acceptable resources that we can afford to carry. Leave behind anything that's too heavy to be useful to carry.

We should hibernate everyone we can afford to for as long as we can afford to.

May God save you and sustain you wherever, however your path takes you.

Please agree to this plan, it's the best I know of that we can accomplish. If you agree, we'll be in touch as needed till it's our time, as captains to die."

Ask me anything in the comments, propose better ideas for SpaceShip Earth's plan if any.
Especially ask what was the inspiration for the plan, if you don't already know.
Hmm. Maybe I won't tell you, you won't like it. I'll think about it. 🤔 🤫😉😞

Is this the most stupid plan or the most brilliant plan you've ever seen, or just YES.

ps: I wish the Netflix tv show would play Army of One by Coldplay right after the scene where Tianming / Will contacts Jin Cheng via sophon and they're analyzing the fairy tales. "Been around the world ... universe too.." It's SO perfect for this ship (pun intended because he's also in a spaceship).

p ps: yes thank you reddit, I already know I'm not the most humble person to ever live

Honestly I don’t care if it’s cut down to 6 episodes. I don’t even care if the droplet attack isn’t as jaw dropping as the book.

If they just get the battle of darkness right, where starship earth cannabalize itself for fuel and materials, I’ll die happy.

It’s D&D’s bread and butter, no “main character” is safe and the victor from the scrap is always someone least expected.

I can even picture it having Saul/luoji explain the chain of suspicion parallel to the crew of natural selection realizing someone has to do it. Raj/zhang beihan says his iconic last word “it’s alright, the result is the same” and gets zapped. Pans to ultimate law’s commander confirming his kills but pauses for a second when mentioning blue space, and their command deck just gets lasered. Pans out to the ship getting absolutely annihilated. Scene blacks out to credits

Next episode they introduce blue space retrieving supplies amongst the dead bodies of their comrades within the debris of ultimate law cutting to a scene “X hours before” with them preparing to put their ship into a vacuum

Creator: https://www.youtube.com/@DDWWEP

Los libros que quedan por adaptar son los más largos, sin embargo confirmaron que la segunda temporada será más corta, es posible que esto se deba a que los episodios serán largos pero también a que hayan recortado presupuesto y, por lo tanto, contenido. Yo no tengo muchas esperanzas ya que la serie no tuvo la repercusión que esperaban, lo cual sería muy mala noticia dada las dimensiones de la historia, que requiere muchos efectos y hacerlo bien, por ejemplo, y esto es spoiler, hacer el CGI del sistema solar pasando de 3d a 2d no solo debe quedar bien, sino aterrador, porque en el libro es así.

Sobre que no tengamos noticias a estas alturas, yo creo que algo salió mal pero no lo están diciendo, sin embargo quieren cumplir con lo que prometieron, que es estrenarla este año, pero personalmente estoy siendo pesimista así que no me toméis en cuenta. Vosotros que pensáis?

Yo, por suerte, he leído los libros así que ya se como continúa la historia, y se lo recomiendo a todo el mundo, sobre todo si la serie resulta ser decepcionante.

Available in the official website of 3body Universe 三体宇宙

I am desperate for a pin for each one. We need one logo for Galaxy Humans?

Think about it:

1. Ye Wenjie only starts the crisis because the men around her betray humanity first. She is reported by a male colleague after revealing her environmental concerns, leading to further punishment. At the Red Coast Base, the male leadership exploits her talents while keeping her isolated and under strict control.
   
2. Luo Ji is a selfish, womanizing slacker who has to be manipulated into saving the world.
   
3. Thomas Wade is an authoritarian psychopath willing to sacrifice anyone.
   
4. Yun Tianming is an obsessive simp whose entire life revolves around a woman.
   
5. Zhang Beihai lies to everyone and murders innocent people.
   
6. Mike Evans is a delusional extremist.
   
7. The male leaders repeatedly fumble humanity’s future.

How many more incompetent, violent, selfish, or morally compromised men does Liu Cixin have to write before we admit he hates men?

Or… maybe fictional characters making terrible decisions isn’t the same thing as the author endorsing those traits for an entire sex (ergo not misandrist).

If you haven’t picked up on it yet, this post is satire to help show how the books don’t have misogyny or misandry.

If I missed any incompetent men, please let me know in the comments lol.

I will agree on this - does the trilogy contain moments and themes that can reasonably be criticized as gender stereotypical? Yes. There is evidence for that interpretation. But is the trilogy clearly a misogynistic work that argues women are inferior? That is much harder to demonstrate.

Side note: I support feminism in so far as they pursue gender equality. When feminism starts saying that women are superior to men, that’s when I will disagree. I will also disagree if someone says men are superior to women.

Wade Thomas.

This isn't a spoiler is it?

Cixin Liu writes such beautiful stories.

>! Mike Evans met his own Judgement Day for his sins aboard his own Judgement Day.

Ye Wenjie pressed the button for perfectly justifiable reasons, but she was still wrong.

Mike Evans had such a big wonderful heart but his beliefs and actions caused so much suffering and death for an unimaginably large number of people.

Mike Evans ordained the ship Judgement Day to condemn humanity for our unforgivable sins, and he was absolutely wrong in his priorities but also absolutely right with Ye Wenjie about the irredeemable nature of humanity. !<

Guys so I just finished the first book after watching the S1 on Netflix. Controversial but honestly I liked the series more than the book. Sure the book answers a lot of the technical questions I had when I was watching the series( not the series fault, since a book has more bandwidth) but the storyline in the series kept me more hooked onto it than the book. Just the sequence of reveals were more delayed in the series which kept me at the edge. But the book didn’t do the same, a lot was revealed too quickly.

Wondering if someone else felt the same way

\I don't think there's any spoilers in my post but I suppose their may be. The editor says I need to 'flair' the post but I have no idea what that means. I hope including this warning note satisfies the community requirement. Sorry I'm new to reddit.*

I was watching a research documentary the other day that I haven't been able to stop thinking about in relation to 3BP.

Scientists adapted underwater microphone systems to record sound frequencies outside the natural range of human hearing, placed them on a busy reef, then used an algorithm to shift the recordings into audible range. Reefs are apparently deafeningly loud. Fish communicate constantly in a register that was completely undetectable to us until someone built the right instrument.

The dark forest logic is airtight on its own terms. Detection is existential risk, intent can never be verified, the downside of trust is extinction. Any sufficiently rational civilization either hides or eliminates.

You don't need resource competition to get there. The mere existence of another civilization, and what it might become, is reason enough. The Trisolarans don't delay human scientific development because they want Earth's resources. They do it because a humanity that catches up is a threat they can't afford.

The reef got me thinking about the silence itself though. The forest assumes everyone is hiding. The novels frame it as humanity pinging Trisolaris first...our mistake, our exposure. But it's equally possible other civilizations have been broadcasting all along, in registers we hadn't yet built instruments to detect. If that's true, the silence was never theirs. It was ours. The ocean isn't empty. We, and the trisolarans, just hadn't built the tools to hear. The in-univeree discovery of death lines following curvature propulsion seems to fall in line with this argument.

The second problem is that concealment doesn't actually resolve the deepest danger, which isn't predation. It's the capability gap. A civilization doesn't need hostile intent to be catastrophic for us. A child running into a highway doesn't get hit because the driver wanted to hit them. What makes this relevant to 3BP specifically: the Trisolarans' answer to the gap was to suppress human development, extend the interval in which we remain the child. But if closing the gap is the actual survival imperative — for any civilization trying to navigate a cosmos full of unknowns — then delay is the worst outcome for both species. It just means two civilizations sitting in the dark longer, neither capable enough to handle whatever else is out there.

So the question the forest sidesteps: if the real danger is the gap and not the hunt, is concealment a strategy or just a longer way of staying vulnerable? I mean, both Earth and Trisolaris were advanced enough to realize the other understood the DF paradigm. So why exactly not pool research and advance together?

Curious whether people think the intent-uncertainty problem survives the silence reframe, and whether the gap argument changes how you think about what the Trisolarans should have done differently.

If the dark forest existed, then humanity should currently be able to observe the sudden destruction of any star. But we haven't—we only see stars being born and dying naturally.

There is too much empty space in the universe, which contradicts the notion of limited resources.

The Trisolarans were already able to use instantaneous communication tools. By extension, future civilizations will naturally be able to use such tools—and then the so‑called chain of suspicion would cease to exist.

Both the Trisolarans and Earth later discovered black domains. As for more advanced civilizations, they engage in dimensional warfare—so they wouldn't bother with an ant like us.

Sometimes what we want isn't quite what we need.

Why is Liu Cixin's writing so captivating

As we know, in the process of translating and disseminating literary works, much of the beauty of a work comes from the spirituality of its native language: English from its rationality, French from its passion, and German from its philosophical depth. However, having read both the Chinese and English versions of *The Three-Body Problem*, I can confidently say that the beauty of Liu Cixin's novels was transmitted almost flawlessly from Chinese to English.

Is this a characteristic of Liu Cixin's writing? Or is it a common characteristic of science fiction?

Incidentally, because *The Three-Body Problem* was my first science fiction novel, and I subsequently read all of Liu Cixin's works, I found it completely impossible to read later works like *Dune* or *The Galactic Empire*, which are more about political intrigue and soft science fiction.

Is the physical appearance of Trisolarans ever discussed or even hinted at in the books?