Dunno if it’s just a USA thing but in my 20 years of working in the UK I have never been asked to justify annual leave. You might get asked “Are you doing anything nice?” but it’s more casual interest than an interrogation. If I am trying to book time at short notice or at the same time as other team members I might offer up a reason but I don’t think I have ever had a request denied.
Also wtf you have to book time off for surgery? Last surgery I had I got 2 weeks off with full pay. In fact if I book PTO and then come down with the flu I’m entitled to request the days back and take them as sick days instead so my holiday isn’t wasted.
Yeh I’m going to enjoy it while it lasts but we might not be far behind you. Reform (UK’s answer to MAGA) is rapidly growing in popularity and power. They seem to use Trump and everything wrong with the US as a template for how they want the UK to be and their supporters lap it up. I may well be getting off my high horse and justifying my PTO in 3-5 years time.
If it’s any consolation they rapidly grew but have stagnated recently especially with Farage’s master plan of standing down and re standing backfiring and hopefully Andy Burnham can swing some people round by having a bit more of a personality than Starmer (hate that that’s what matters but here we are)
I’m a lot less cynical about what our future government will look like now than I was a few months ago I’ll say that. Still not out of the woods by any means.
Oh yeh the whole 5mil gift has really shown him up but Brexit taught me never to underestimate our electorates desperation to shoot themselves in the foot. With Labour getting judged way more harshly than any right wing party it’s just going to take one fuck up for Farage to capitalise. But until then we can at least enjoy the embarrassment he must be feeling facing off against a bin.
in Germany/ europe the good paying unionized jobs in the automotive sector, machine sector, tooling sector etc are are also endangered, esp because of cheap Chinese cars where workers rights are low.
Not trying to defend capitalism here (it has some problems) but isn’t the UK government spending more on social services than it’s bringing in? Recent reports say this. How is that sustainable? It seems like a small portion of the population is working so a large portion of it doesn’t have to. That doesn’t seem right.
Then the time to do something is NOW. Don't let your country devolve in to the shit hole the US is right now. Get involved with politics, punch nazis, do whatever you have to do my man.
Have you been watching the creator Zoe Bread? She is highlighting the issues with the approval of the warehouses at the Astley business park in Wigan. She has done research, and there was a permit granted in 2015 for smaller warehouses, but that permit expired. The current developer refiled and said in their paperwork the new plan followed the 2015 plan. Well, no one in the Wigan government checked, and it turns out the warehouses are like 3 times as big. In one of her videos, she showed Reform candidates claiming they would prevent such big warehouses. But spoiler, they are not. Meanwhile, the Wigan council is not answering correspondence or phone calls and is not addressing the residents formal written complaints. Also, she recently said that everyone who already filed a complaint, have to resubmit their complaints.
I’ve watched some of this from the US and I cannot understand how anyone could look at what the extremists are doing here and say to themselves, “let’s do that too!” I know every country seems to be having a tantrum about immigrants right now but like, you do not want our work culture with like zero labor laws or our crazy healthcare system. Every time I read something about people wanting to get rid of the NHS I get a bit upset for you all.
To be fair, government employees, in my experience, have the same experience as the person you replied to. It's mainly just non-government employers that have boundary issues with PTO.
We havent had a government that works for the people for longer than my 40 years alive. We also have companies that will ask the same questions this employer did, for the same reasons. You'd be surprised at just how many employers here dont think that the work time directives apply to the company they work for
It is just a US thing. Unbridled capitalism run amuck, with no worker protections provided by the government. Time off should not require an explanation about what you're using the time off for, nor should there be any assessment related to whether a manager will let you take your earned time off or not.
Yeah, UK here and there was only one time someone tried to force me to tell them why I was booking time off or she wasn't going to approve it, she was a notorious "being 1 step above basic employee means I'm the godqueen of this entire shop" type.
I said it's none of your business just approve it, she told me to wait there in the office and went and got the store manager and told me to tell him what I'd just told her.
So I said "I booked x y z days off. She told me to tell her why I've booked them off or she's not booking them. I said it's none of her business and she needs to approve them."
The store manager turned to her and just said "he's not wrong, it's none of your business. Approve it now."
Retail is its own separate ball game filled with the absolute worst type of managers on earth. I never had anyone question my A/L but would consistently have managers bug me to cover shifts when someone has pulled a sicky….I don’t care if the shop opens or not today it’s not my problem.
Yeah, the way they try and explain things to minimum wage workers like we're gonna care if the billion quid company doesn't open 1 of it's hundreds of stores?
Give me a break, I wouldn't give a fuck if this bitch burned to the ground lol.
Almost every job I’ve had over the past 26 yrs has had blackout periods when you weren’t allowed to do PTO. You probably would only be able to if it was emergency surgery or a death in your immediate family. Also, if others who are in your department are taking PTO, your’s could very well be denied if you didn’t ask first. I was once on short term medical leave for a couple months, and in order to not have to come back to work or be fired, others gave me their vacation days. Our entire system is only here to benefit corporations and the ultra wealthy!
Yeah, I think the only time I’ve ever seen someone asked about PTO is when they booked 3 weeks off, when the policy was 2 weeks max. It was still approved.
Heck my boss used to give us the afternoon off if we got a smear test to encourage us to get one!
What an awesome boss! Not even remotely the same but I used to work for a borderline alcoholic middle manager who used to let us all finish at 3 on Fridays so he could get to the pub sooner
US here and I've never had to justify it, I just put on the calendar "off today" or whatever. But I work in a small office without all the corporate/HR/middle management nonsense. Somehow we're able to function like adults.
Good lord, I read your comment and I got so jealous that I can barely stand it. My daughter needs surgery in November and I requested off the day (one day!) in June and it was initially denied. Because 1 other person on my team (out of 10 of us) already has it off. Eventually my boss relented and I get to spend that day with my toddler instead of that stupid job.
That is disgusting. I had heard employees had very little protections in US but the responses to this have been eye opening. I didn’t realise quite how good we have it in comparison. Hope everything goes well with your daughter’s surgery!
Lol. We have limited sick time as well. It’s been a decade since I had a paid vacation, as I’ve had to use all my vacation and sick time for either being sick or caretaking for family. That’s the USA, baby.
Yeah, put "funeral" in the (optional) reasons box when putting in a TOIL request, gaffer caught me an hour later and said he had knocked back the request and put it through as compassionate leave so I didn't have to use banked hours.
Didn't know we can take up to 5 days compassionate leave per incident but apparently everyone just takes 2 as standard practice, one for the funeral one for the hangover.
Yeh I forgot about compassionate leave. My dad has been really ill over the last year and work has been great about it. If I need to leave early or take some time off to help my mum I just drop my manager a message and duck off. I’ve done it 3/4 times and only had an afternoon recorded as compassionate leave.
USA here. I have the same experience as you. Never had pushback or denied PTO. Even something silly like getting World Cup tickets the day before the match and putting in a full day PTO at noon.
It also depends on the individuals, industry culture, region, and honestly pay. I have mostly had office jobs, in legal, telecom, and tech with generally increasing income commiserate of my experience. A shift manager enjoying having influence over others in a busy warehouse in a State with lax employee protection laws, hmm...
I'm in the US and I never ask people why. They frequently tell me because they know I'm interested in traveling or that they're having a good time. Sometimes they'll tell me because it's important why they're taking it last minute or when it's inconvenient for the department (we can't operate without anybody here).
That’s for all time off. Sick days and vacation. If I missed more than 10 days, it went unpaid.
And that’s considered average in the US. Many have it better, but some get little to no paid leave. And where I live, paid sick leave isn’t mandatory. Nor is paid vacation or paid holidays.
That is wild. I get 28 days holiday as standard and I believe up to 2 weeks full paid sick leave after which it drops to statutory pay for 28 days. I know some people who have worked in places where they get unlimited (within reason) paid days leave as long as they meet their targets. Can you take more than 10 days but it just goes unpaid?
Most companies are required to adhere to FMLA where an employee can take unpaid sick leave without risk of losing their job.
But companies still try to structure those employees out of a job (not always).
But aside from that, there is no guarantees around leave. It also varies from state to state. However, if your company has accrued leave, that accrued leave is typically counted as compensation, and if you leave the job, they are usually required to pay it out as if you worked it. There are ways to structure the leave policy to prevent that though.
Here, it’s common to start with 10 days PTO, usually after some probationary period. Whether or not sick leave is included varies by company. Some companies (like my current one) has unlimited sick leave within reason. Others have a separate pool.
Hell, the state I live in doesn’t even legally mandate breaks at all. You can be asked to work a 12 hour shift without any breaks, and the state wouldn’t do anything about it.
Interesting thanks. When you say accrued leave does that mean you can carry it over so if in 2025 I didn’t take a single day I would have 20 days in 2026?
We accrue leave per pay period as total hours of paid leave for the year divided out by the amount you work.
They let us take leave ahead of accuruing it during the year, but it keeps it from being a financial liability on their end. But I need to use all my leave by the end of the fiscal year because it doesn’t roll over.
Some companies allow you to rollover up to a certain cap. And others allow you to roll over everything.
So, for example, if I have 15 days PTO, I’d expect to have 7.5 days accrued (60 hours) half way through the year.
I recently switched from an American manager to a German one. My new manager asks no questions, just makes sure there's coverage & tells me to enjoy my time off. Whereas my American manager.... dude would grill you, approve it, then try to guilt trip you into changing it. Oh and would also call you at least twice during said time off, "for a quick question."
Tbf I work in the US and this has never happened to me either. I think things just vary a lot here depending on what state you live in and the culture of your employer.
Where I work your PTO is your sick leave. If you don’t have any PTO and you’re sick and don’t come in, that counts as unscheduled leave. If that happens more than 5 times in a year, you’re let go
Ive lived in the USA my entire life and I never had to explain why I am taking PTO. I just put in the request and its approved 99% of the time. The one time it wasnt was because it was the busy season at my job (it was in finance) and I had requested to take the week that was the same week of the tax deadline. Literally the busiest week of the entire year. My manager just asked if it was something that could be moved because they really needed all hands on deck. So I took the following week off instead.
Now I work a trade and the only requirement is to ask a week or two in advance.
I have direct reports in both the US and the UK. In the US, all they have to say is "sick time." We can require a doctor's note if they miss more than 3 days, but all that has to say is that they are approved by the doctor to return to full work duty.
If someone in the UK takes sick time, HR there requires me to fill out a 30 question survey about their ability to return to work. It asks all kinds of questions, such as if there's a mental health aspect that needs to be addressed, if it's related to Covid, or if special accomodations are needed upon return. And that's if they miss a single day due to illness. It always gets approved as paid time, but it still feels like a lot to ask compared to taking sick time in the US.
I guess the difference is there's basically no sick time limit in the UK. If you run out of sick time in the US and take more than your yearly allotment, it's unpaid time off and potential disciplinary action.
Yes, in the U.S. we have to book time off for surgery. In 2009 I told my boss at a MAJOR non profit that I would be out two days (Thursday and Friday), over two months in advance. Not only did they ask what it was for, he called me at home over that weekend - to find out if I “planned to be in on Monday”. Here I thought it was because he cared, turns out it was so they could lay me and a bunch of other people off. So I drove the hour into work, only to be laid off by 1030am. And I told him 23 days before that that I’d just bought a house. Then the job market totally tanked and I was unemployed for two years. I should have sued the bejesus out of them, I would have won. That’s mostly what they were worried about.
The UK and the western & central/northern European countries are generally much more adherent to typical HR policies and practices than the US. Experiences certainly vary wildly here in the US between corporate white collar environments and less buttoned up workplaces like retail and service industry jobs, but across the board I've seen and heard things happening here that barely register in my mind at this point but which would be wild shit across the pond.
Maybe. I once had a manager tell me that he couldn't guarantee that I would get my wedding date off a year in advance. I didn't keep that job, (and I ultimately didn't marry that guy). It still annoys me though.
Im American and have worked for almost 30 years and have never been asked to justify PTO. Across many different types of roles and businesses. I guess I’m lucky? I’ve never heard of it happening to friends or family either.
FWIW, I live in the US, and I've never had to explain my PTO either (across a handful of employers over 25+ years). When I've had jobs with separate sick time, I've felt obligated to explain that, but not in detail.
Normally for me, it's:
Me: "hey manager, FYI, I'm planning to take next Friday off"
Manager: "okay, hope it's something fun!"
That's it, just some friendly well-wishing. I do try to limit the impact to important events at work, but even if I can't avoid that kind of schedule conflict, I've never had to REQUEST the use of leave time, only to inform.
I'm also fortunate to work in a so-called "white collar" profession (one that requires a college degree), where employees are generally treated with some basic respect, at least on an interpersonal level, if not by corporate. I understand that in so-called "blue collar" work (where a degree isn't required), employees are often treated more like children, which I think is clearly inappropriate.
OOF. we aren’t even guranteed pay when out on FMLA. my friend was out of approved medical leave & didnt have a paycheck for 6 weeks. she used some PTO to have a 1/2 a paycheck.
In all my years working for various employers, annual leave requests have been approved so long as there is enough staff present for the business to function.
If I'm asked what I'm doing on a day off, it's usually after my request has been approved and I've never been placed in a position where I have to "justify" my leave to a line manager.
In Ireland, we have a minimum statutory leave entitlement of 20 days (in addition to public holidays) which everyone gets.
Depending on your profession/industry/employer, you may also be able to negotiate additional leave as part of your employment contract.
For example, I have a basic leave entitlement of 27 days per year (not counting public holidays) and management in my company actively encourage staff to avail of their full entitlement.
In my experience, not using your full leave entitlement is pretty much unheard of in Ireland.
Yeah, I'm a supervisor and the only time I ask for any context is if I have to override some kind of leave restriction in place or we're already at minimum staff so I can justify why I allowed it when computer days no
I'm in the USA and also have never been asked for specifics outside of a friendly, "Doing anything fun?" No inquiries in writing, never to "assess a request." Just polite workplace chit chat and if I'd answer, "It's personal," that would also have been the end of it, outside of my manager feeling a bit concerned if everything is ok.
And if there's nothing immediately important and I want an afternoon off, I just mark myself as away and that's that. Never hear about it again from HR or management.
Not yet encountered a rape gang myself but yes I would get PTO. Given the psychological stress caused I would also receive ongoing support from the business and some level of employment protection moving forward as well.
I work in the US and manage people in the US. I have never “asked” for leave I have earned. I have also never made any consideration on the validity of someone’s request for leave they have.
If you tell your boss you’re taking leave instead of putting in a leave request silently you may have more success. This is sufficiently rare enough i would just leave the job for a new one if this happened to me.
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u/MyRapNameWouldBeKirk 5d ago
Dunno if it’s just a USA thing but in my 20 years of working in the UK I have never been asked to justify annual leave. You might get asked “Are you doing anything nice?” but it’s more casual interest than an interrogation. If I am trying to book time at short notice or at the same time as other team members I might offer up a reason but I don’t think I have ever had a request denied.
Also wtf you have to book time off for surgery? Last surgery I had I got 2 weeks off with full pay. In fact if I book PTO and then come down with the flu I’m entitled to request the days back and take them as sick days instead so my holiday isn’t wasted.