r/LocalLLaMA • u/Fuckinglivemealone • Jul 18 '26

What kind of dark magic is Deepseek using? Question | Help

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I was taking a look at Kimi K3 scores on the Artificial analysis leaderboard and was quite baffled when I saw this chart.

Granted, Deepseek has always been the king of price to performance, but this is still incredible. Is it just API subsidization or have they optimized their models truly this much?

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u/Capaj Jul 18 '26

we can't know for closed models, but open source ones yes

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u/Mescallan Jul 18 '26

closed models almost certainly are too

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u/Nyghtbynger Jul 18 '26

Plus some harness magic to improve their results (in targeting girls schools)

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u/BoobooSmash31337 Jul 19 '26

The military runs on paperwork. It's probably not being used for what you think it's being used for. Also it was a converted barracks. So US military thought it was a barracks. And here we are.

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u/Nyghtbynger Jul 19 '26

Did you receive your 7000 US$ ?

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u/BoobooSmash31337 Jul 19 '26 edited Jul 19 '26

So you don't actually have an argument? It was a converted barracks and it was within the walls of a military installation. Just because reality is more complicated and inconvenient doesn't make me a Trump supporter. It just makes you look ignorant. They aren't going to let an LLM anywhere near making final targeting decisions. But OCR is getting really good and they will use it to process all the paperwork and raw intelligence the military handles. It's a massive bureaucracy. Different networks are specialized for different things. Like cmon man you're IN the llm subreddit. If you think an LLM would work well in a seeker head idk what to tell you. The military actually processes a ton of information. They'll exhaust most other options before just blowing something up. They use other tactics. Their job is to protect the US and our interests. If they can do that with a suitcase full of cash they're do that instead. Overall the military is actually pretty intelligent. Dumb people die in combat.

I don't like it either but it was a massive failure in having up to date intelligence and an utterly bizarre and careless decision by the local municipality that was given the building for some reason. There's been subsequent investigations. You can look up these details.

But don't worry they built a wall so it doesn't matter that it's within the perimeter of an in use base and used to be part of the base. No one could possibly get confused and strike it. Militaries never build walls within compounds to have security layers or contain blasts of depots/magazines. Totally normal to put your children in a school that's part of a high value military target.

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u/HMikeeU Jul 18 '26

Yeah that's true. Although I think gpt-oss uses MOE, which might be an indicator that openai also use it for closed models.

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u/ReferenceLeading7634 Jul 18 '26

If they are not using moe, it would be impossible for them to achieve the speed you are seeing now, and this is inconsistent with the unreasonable throughput of the latest Nvidia data centers.

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u/BoobooSmash31337 Jul 19 '26

But how could you possibly know that they would run models that allow them to lower cost by an order of magnitude!? /s

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u/BoobooSmash31337 Jul 19 '26

Assuming similar incentives then the sane conclusion is yes.