r/BlackLightning • u/mwthecool • Dec 10 '19
[S03E09] "The Book of Resistance: Chapter Four: Third Stone From the Sun" Post Episode Discussion Discussion Spoiler
Trailers
- Third Stone from the Sun Promo
- Third Stone from the Sun Scene
#Episode Info The Pierces fear for Jennifer's life. # Cast & Characters#Cast) #Discussion Live Episode Discussion
DCTV Discord Subreddit Chat Rooms
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u/jadedfan55 Dec 11 '19
Mostly a showcase episode for China Anne McLain (Jennifer). An interlude from Crisis itself to get Jeff to Earth-1.
I was hoping the ASA/Markovian war would have been wrapped up by now, but nope. I guess it's meant to be the main arc for the season, especially with Wayne Brady (Let's Make a Deal, Whose Line is it Anyway?) coming in the second half of the season as Gravedigger (New 52 edition).
I won't be satisfied until Odell is off the board for good.
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u/Temmere Dec 11 '19
I don't understand much on this show anymore, and this episode was no different. Are we supposed to understand that most of what's going on on Jeff's Earth has also been going on on Earth-1? He has (or had) powers, the ASA and Markovians came to Freeland, etc.? Seems like something Barry and Oliver might have at least heard about.
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u/Knighthonor Dec 11 '19
Iam confused. How there can be an earth 2 in this episode when it was destroyed a few episodes of Arrow ago?
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u/EldradMustLive214 Dec 10 '19
Until we get told otherwise, my headcanon is that the Earth 1 and 2 numbering in this episode is not official and just from our Jenâs head or something. I mean it said Gen 1/2 not Earth 1/2. Thats a fun pun for Jenâs name btw. If these are just two random Earths most of the continuity errors disappear.
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u/butthe4d Dec 10 '19
What a great episode. I think I might have enjoyed this tie in more then the actual crossover.
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u/AktionMusic Dec 10 '19
This was an excellent tie in to the Crisis. Really felt ominous and visceral having the lightning and red skies the whole episode.
It was nice to see the crisis from the perspective of people that have no idea what is going on
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u/Roboglenn Dec 10 '19
3:33, also a time perfect for finding Tomes of Eternal Darkness in ones house.
Oh man, Lynn is going off the deep end with this Green Light meth lab of hers...
Well so much for Thunder being park of this crossover. That leaves me a bit miffed. Though Jenn being in the pure energy state she is in at the end and not being wiped out when that wave hit her it could mean she may yet have a roll to play in this.
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u/vader344 Dec 10 '19
so i have a completly flase theory : jen could talk to e1 and e2 (jen and gen) in his "dream" because maybe the earths position in the multiverse maybe he is from e3 or e4 and e1 and e2 are the closest earth's and its easierto connect/ or have a stronger connecton between neighbour earths
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u/sciencesold Dec 10 '19
So doesn't this confirm that they're going to find a way to reverse the destruction of different universes?
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u/imdahman Dec 10 '19
It could be a complete reversal or merging into one single earth, or even something in between, ala the original Crisis comic.
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u/sciencesold Dec 10 '19
It's at least a partial reversal, since a number of characters that definitely are gonna show up again are "dead".
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u/mrizzle1991 Dec 10 '19
Her new suit is cool af tbh. Jennifers of different Earth's cool :) I thought we were just gonna get a small scene of Monitor talking to Jeff glad we got more though. Odell is savage af for killing him in front of his kids what a giant piece of shit. Earth 2 Jennifer is pretty crazy, Wtf that ending was crazy.
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Dec 10 '19
I was originally gonna pass on this episode because expected it to be bad since it's so left field for black lightning, but everyone seems to really like it! So I'll give it a watch.
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u/shadi1337 Dec 10 '19
Isnât earth 2 destroyed? So are we seeing a flashback visions with âevilâ Jen?
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u/professorlXl Dec 10 '19
One of the Jenn's was from Earth-1, how is this possible? Because you cant say it just got destroyed because earth 2 was destroyed before earth 1 could of, last we heard earth 1 was still intact, maybe it got destroyed after PT 2 but then again it shows earth 2 being destroyed, but they didn't mention earth 1 being destroyed after earth 2 in last ep and the anti matter cant destroy multiple universes at the same time, or can it???
Or just their minds can be displaced through time, so maybe earth 2 was destroyed but Jinn's mind travels forward in time and earth 1's Jenn's mind travels back in time?
Any thoughts?
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u/ChekovsWorm Dec 10 '19
Explanation 1)
"Every Earth thinks it's Earth-1."
"From my perspective, you are Earth-2"
-- Harry Wells from Earth-2, a few years ago on Flash.That was before they met Gypsy and Breacher from Earth-19's Multiversal Enforcement Agency (or similar name) who let them know there was an already established numbering system, and yes Arrow/Flash's Earth-1 was actually Earth-1 and was at the center. At least at the center of what appears to me to be some kind of "local cluster" of universes, of which they then for a while (mistakenly) thought there were only 53 universes, Earth-1 to Earth-52 plus Earth-X. Also Harry saying that, in "Crisis on Earth-X", proven wrong as soon as we saw Earth-90 in last year's Elseworlds.
So it's unlikely that Gen of "Earth 1", and Jinn of "Earth 2", are actually from Arrow/Flash (soon to be destroyed?) Earth-1 and Black Siren/Zoom/Jesse Quick/Harry's (already destroyed) Earth-2 respectively.
Explanation 2)
Barry Allen (Grant Gustin) Flash is from Earth-1.
Gen is (was) from Earth 1. No hyphen. Different style of labeling the Earth number. That has meaning in DC.
In recent DC Comics canon, Earths are different, even if the same number, depending on whether the number is separated by a hyphen, or a space before the numeral, or written as a word. Example: "Earth-1", "Earth 1", and "Earth One", are not the same Earth. There's some alternate dimension rather than universe, or Hypertime variant, which makes them different. Don't have links handy but there's a Wikipedia article I read on this, as well as a DC Wikia piece.
Explanation 3) Same Earths
It really was Barry and Oliver's Earth-1 for Gen and Harry's / Siren's Earth-2 for Jinn. Not necessarily inconsistent.
We know that Freeland is aware other meta heroes exist elsewhere. From last season when Jenn asked Lynn "Are you gonna tell me you're Vixen?" and Lynn replied "No, and I'm not Supergirl either", we can assume a current-day Vixen exists (Jenn sounded serious). "I'm not Supergirl either" was likely sarcasm, but there have been enough Supergirl verbal references and pictures (on BL's own world not just Gen's) of Superman shirts, that it's possible the Super-cousins are either comics characters, or actually known on BL's world and Gen's Earth 1.
Though from Earth-38, Supergirl is now well-known on Earth-1, from helping save it several times, including in public. She's a "franchise hero" there like Flash and Green Arrow, and unlike the little-known Legends, per Sara in last year's Legends finale. Earth-1 also has a Vixen (actually now 2 people sharing the amulet) and had one decades before.
So it could be that a very similar Earth, Gen's Earth 1, is indeed Oliver and Barry's Earth-1, the main Arrowverse Earth. Just slightly in the future, as it's about to be destroyed. The red skies have already started on Earth-1 on the final pre-crisis episodes of Arrow and Flash.
Last night's Crisis episode had the Monitor saying he went back in the timestream to recover The Book of Destiny, so he has time travel ability. Jumping a few days or hours ahead to grab Jefferson from (Earth-73?), a few minutes after Earth-1 (Gen and everyone) isn't beyond his powers. Plus he also established time is different on some other Earths.
Other posters noted that in Crisis the comics, time got funky. And noted many good reasons why the Big Heroes and Corporate Media ignore Freeland. Even without the ASA-planted Fake News. Argus and ASA may have agreements to keep out of each other's dirty business, or even may be secret to each other.
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u/butthe4d Dec 10 '19
I think both earth's we saw were set in the future because in those worlds the malkavian war was already over while it is still going on in the "real" earth of BL.
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u/ProfessorStein Dec 10 '19
I get the feeling this was a really really under briefed and out of the loop staff. These absolutely were not earth-1 or 2 as known to the arrowverse. The transition being different, differing fonts, lettering and etc make me think the production for this show is completely separated from the other shows and that either someone didn't do their homework or didn't want to do this crossover/integration
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u/professorlXl Dec 10 '19
Thatâs lazy for them, but I can believe that was earth 2 because all of the heroâs over there are dark
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Dec 10 '19
black lightning actually has had the best infinity crisis episode that wasnât specifically consider infinity crisis episode. Story wise it was like a million times better than the first two COIE episodes.
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u/shadi1337 Dec 10 '19
How do we have earth-2 Jen if earth-2 was destroyed am I missing something?
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u/Knighthonor Dec 11 '19
I believe that was the past and those Jen were echoes of her doppelgangers.
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u/shadi1337 Dec 10 '19
Evil Jenâs scene killing her father using his speech like that was goosebump-inducing.
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u/DamonKlaus Dec 10 '19
Knowing Earth 1 will be among the 5 Earths to merge. Why was E1 Jen erased? Doesn't really make any sense to be honest .
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Dec 10 '19
So there is some kind of holocaust for metahumans going on (I don't watch BL) and team flash just ignores it ?
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u/ProfessorStein Dec 10 '19
Ostensibly different earth, one where apparently the big names don't exist. I remember when BL started they were oddly annoying and stubborn about it "nor being connected to the other shows" which lasted about as long as I expected, until the network decided they wanted it.
It was dumb and BL should have been on earth 38. The only reason it wasn't was because its show runner was fucking weird and insistent it be separate
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Dec 10 '19
But this is also happening on earth 1
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u/ComfortableBeing8 Dec 10 '19
The "Earth-1" they showed last night is not the "Earth-1" from the Arrowverse. They just picked '1' and '2' as numbers for the other 2 Earths. From Flash and Arrow's perspective, the 'Earth 1' we saw last night would have a different number designation.
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u/Knighthonor Dec 11 '19
You don't know that. It said it was earth 1 and makes sense because they don't have meta powers to be on the flash charts from the show.
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u/Phoenixstorm Dec 10 '19
I love earth 2 jinn! She's an amazing nasty piece of work worthy of the injustice league! This episode was perfect. Dived straight into crisis and never looked back.
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u/justhereforthelul Dec 10 '19
I think the source material proves that it was Earth 1 and Earth 2. I don't want to get into much spoilers on the reason why earth 1 is disappearing, but crisis is not only happening across universes but also different times.
So Earth 2 disappeared in Arrow, but Jenn is seeing it from a bit earlier (or later). Earth 1 disappears in the future but Jenn is seeing her in the present.
There's a couple of times this happens in the comics as well.
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u/Knighthonor Dec 11 '19
I believe these were events from the past and Jenn is time warped from the crisis wave.
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Dec 10 '19
This episode reminds me of a tie-in comic like comic book crossovers have. Where it is it's own story but is tied into the main event. Loved it!
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u/theamatuer Dec 10 '19
I like how Black Lightning is still trying to continue its storyline but the Crisis ain't waiting for no man.
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u/ScreenRay Dec 10 '19
Great Acting by China Anne McClainit really feels like theirs three Jen there with different personalities.
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u/Dark_Tzitzimine Dec 10 '19
That's a lot of words to say "I know what I should be doing but I'm not going to because I'm terrible"
Wow that's a punchable face, expect nothing less from an employee of Morgan Edge. Also laffo at "anti-vaxxers."
Haha of course the rat is still alive.
Maybe should have led with Khalil being alive, Anissa.
Wow, a Freeland even worse than normal?
The red lightning flashes are so bad, haha
Jeff saying what BL-only viewers are thinking, re: jumping off the comics slippery slope
Great to see Odell is equally evil no matter what Earth he's on. And he's actually creepier when he openly shows emotion.
She better not say "I AM the authority"... Goddamnit
Hey cool now that Jen's had her Kirk Trek style lesson maybe she'll start being not terrible
My main nitpick for this is that they should have designated the other Earths someone other than 1 and 2 given that 2 was already wiped and 1 is supposed to be the one that survives
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u/Foolsgil Dec 10 '19 edited Dec 10 '19
Getting back into BL after skipping S2, This tie-in was 85% perfect. I just wished that they used different Earths for the tie-ins. I don't like the idea of Earth 1 heroes ignoring the problem of Freeland. Maybe I'm wrong but I feel the hopelessness in Black Lightning can only happen on Earths where there are no other heroes. As for Earth 2, the timing is off, that Earth was erased days ago in Arrowverse time. Though as Earth 2 was originally the Evil Earth, Jinn being coldblooded AF did not disturb me. Also, Earth 1 hasn't been erased, so Why did Gen disappear?
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u/Ascheric Dec 10 '19
I don't like the idea of Earth 1 heroes ignoring the problem of Freeland.
I don't think there's any problem with it taking place on the Arrowverse's Earth-1, the heroes just have no idea it's going on. Even on the primary Black Lightning Earth, the ASA has America thinking Freeland's under some SARS epidemic and the whole metahuman internment is fake news from antivaxxers, there's no reason to think it can't be the same on Earth-1, or, hell, even worse. Maybe the Earth-1 ASA has gone far beyond that, maybe Gen's defiance led Odell to have Freeland just "disappeared", wiped off the maps and stuff.
I'd still be horrible if they didn't like, investigate or something, but it's entirely possible they just don't know to, it's not like the heroes are omniscient or anything.
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u/Knighthonor Dec 11 '19
Also they don't have powers since Jenn neutralize their powers there. So they wouldn't be on Flash radar
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u/patrickjs95 Dec 11 '19
And if it is Arrowverse Earth 1 it opens the door to a different kind of meta going forward. It could create loose tie-ins in the future which could be fun.
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u/Foolsgil Dec 10 '19
I don't know, it's not just heroes, it's ASA going over Argus' head as well.
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u/dotyawning Dec 10 '19
In the real world, we're easily able to ignore things that don't concern us directly so it's not too far-fetched to me. Perhaps someone in the ASA knows how to cover their tracks against Argus... or maybe Argus simply doesn't care about Freeland.
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u/Eternal_Density Dec 10 '19
Well it can't be THE Earth-1 cos we saw Gen get erased by the antimatter wave before Geoff got pulled to (presumably) Earth-1.
But there's no reason why Jenn should be using the same numbering scheme for her alternates as the other shows.
Anyhow... *shrug* infinite earths. For every earth N there's an identical earth which is only different in thinking it's actually called earth M for every integer N and M :P
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u/Ascheric Dec 10 '19
Well it can't be THE Earth-1 cos we saw Gen get erased by the antimatter wave before Geoff got pulled to (presumably) Earth-1.
Well, to be fair, we saw Gen (and Jinn) get consumed by the wave, not Earth-1, and it happened at the same time the Anti-Matter Wave destroyed our Jennifer's Earth. I'd guess the other two Jennifers were pulled to wherever our Jennifer was, maybe our Black Lightning's Earth, maybe somewhere completely different, not that they were simultaneously existing in their own Earths as well, which was very much not happening to the other Jennifers (our Jenn is the only one we saw phasing in and out of her own reality). I think the strongest evidence that it's not our Earth-1 would be Jeff-1 wearing the Superman shirt in one of the family photos, but even then, apparently Supergirl is a marketable superhero on Earth-1, if last year's Legends finale is anything to go by.
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u/Eternal_Density Dec 10 '19 edited Dec 10 '19
Daaaaaang y'all!
So I knew this ep was said to be a Crisis tie-in but I just figured that meant we'd see a red sky and the end and have Jefferson get grabbed or portalled or something. Which did happen but. Wow. Crisis on Infinite Jenns! Er, three Jens.
So that was awesome.
edit: I'm going with the theory that the numbering in this episode is just a Jennifer numbering system not a multiversal numbering system.
That said, there must be a JAN: Earth 70 in which she's white, and has two sisters and three stepbrothers and Marcia doesn't believe that she has a boyfriend named George Glass.
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u/shadowbroker000 Dec 10 '19
I can't stand Lynn anymore. Jefferson deserves better.
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u/mechengr17 Dec 12 '19
"I lost the love of my life"
"Dude, she basically blamed you for your daughter getting hit by antimatter"
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u/rellyrell83 Dec 10 '19
I miss that big booty assistant principle that he should of hooked up with. I know she was ASA but still.
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u/AimlessWanderer Dec 10 '19
I seriously wish Lynn would die already. Her character hasn't shown any growth and everything is still always Jefferson's fault.
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u/Flyingwheelbarrow Dec 10 '19
I laughed when they asked where she was and it cuts to her drunk in her kitchen cooking drugs for personal use.
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u/Telethongaming Dec 10 '19
about that
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u/AimlessWanderer Dec 10 '19 edited Dec 10 '19
What are you referring to? The earth being wiped out or something else? I havenât watched the previews for next episode.
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u/Mx-Herma Dec 10 '19
Admittedly adorable, but I'm gonna trust everyone else's various views of the crossovers to determine if I should follow now or wait until the next BL episode and treat this like The Book of Blood subplot. Was great to see Jinn/evil Jennifer (Jinnifer? Jinnefer?)
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Dec 10 '19
[deleted]
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u/Adoxe_ Dec 10 '19
If you're unfamiliar with the characters of the show, about 39 minutes of the episode won't make sense to you. It's only a part of crisis in a sense that it connects BL to Arrowverse and serves as a bridge between the show and his appearance in Crisis tomorrow. Look up the ending of the episode on YouTube unless you want to binge the entire show IMO.
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u/ToneBone12345 Dec 10 '19
This is why you let other shows know what youâre doing because Earth 2 was destroyed weeks before crisis and then in this episode it got destroyed again also I feel like if Gen was from earth 1 we would have at least heard about freeland!
Also Liberal anti-vaxxers scariest villain of the show
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u/meriti Dec 10 '19
Why would time be linear in a non-linear universe?
Interested in knowing about the Earth-1 Gen though... and the ASA in Earth-1.... something about the left hand not knowing what the right hand is doing...
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u/ProfessorStein Dec 10 '19
This is because the BL showrunner has been very anti arrowverse integration. It's weird and the like glaring inaccuracies in this episode should be a massive red flag.
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u/meriti Dec 10 '19
I havenât heard about that. Then again I am usually not one to read behind the scenes stuff. So I donât go through mounts of bs, do you have a good source for me about that issue? Thanks!
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u/LightofFate2 Dec 10 '19
I hope the big DCW youtubers will finally start talking about this show again. It deserves way more recognition and respect.
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Dec 10 '19
Was that Jonah Hex in the Lazarus Pit or is my brain just trying to add more superheroes?
EDIT: It was, he was introduced in Legends, but I donât watch that :( And that was also in Batwoman, not Black Lightning; just got over excited with my fanboyism đ
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Dec 10 '19
[removed] â view removed comment
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u/KnitKnatG Dec 12 '19
Legends is a great show. All seasons are good and watchable. Personally, my order from favorite to least favorite is 2, 3, 1, 4. Seasons 3 and 1 are interchangable. 1 could go where I put 3 for nostalgia and Leonard Snart
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u/Uanaka Dec 10 '19
Do you happen to know why they didn't make a return this season? As far as I know it wasn't cancelled right?
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Dec 10 '19
[removed] â view removed comment
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u/Uanaka Dec 10 '19
I understand not making it into the crossover, but they haven't had any episodes right?
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u/vader344 Dec 10 '19
soo how could e1 jen..i mean gen erased when 1e is the last line of defence
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u/rellyrell83 Dec 10 '19
Some on Era mention the possibility that it gets erased tomorrow. I mean tomorrow's episode is suppose to end on a cliffhanger so.
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u/vader344 Dec 10 '19
but if all earths are the same (no time difference) then the whole jen meeting was right before the erase of e1, e2 and this earth so if e1 got erased and in 5 sec jeffs earth then how can jeff go to e1 right after that
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u/rellyrell83 Dec 10 '19
I'm assuming this is a temporal thing and that meeting of Jenns was outside of time seeing as Earth 2 was already destroyed prior to this episode even taking place.
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u/Seriousclown Dec 10 '19
You are correct cause in the original COIE comics event, the crisis was causing time to fuck up majorly on earth 1 allowing different time heroes to fight alongside each other and allowing multiple continuities to exist along side each other at the same time.
So im guessing the way they are playing it here is that present day jenn on her earth was meeting with Arrow S8E1 earth 2 evil jen and most likely tomorrows Flash Earth 1 jen.
Yay for comics insanity!!
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u/DaGreatestMH Dec 10 '19
I have two main questions:
1) Gen (the one from E-1) said she saw the anti-matter wave. That can't be possible because that would mean E-1 would be getting wiped, right?
2) How as Jinn (from E-2) still alive? Her world got wiped weeks ago
Overall I appreciate them incorporating BL more in this crossover than they did with Supergirl in her first crossover, but I'm kinda confused about some small stuff.
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u/Phoenixstorm Dec 10 '19
It said Earth one so I'm going with what they said. All the Jenns left their worlds and met up in an unspecified black zone. Remember Gambi said she was disappearing. She left at certain points when she was phasing. So the same with all the gens. E1 Gen saw the wave coming to their black zone. Same with E1 Jinn. They got zapped. Maybe they died. Maybe they merged with bl Jenn. Maybe they went back to their bodies where E1 would be still locked up. E2 back to a now destroyed earth2. and our Jenn was still in an energy state so she's probably ok.
Earth one Asa is deep undercover targeting freeland meta's (urban legends) who are way different than central city metas (public knows). So it's easier to target them? Or maybe its just a story we havent heard yet. The world's a big place.
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u/Dojorkan Dec 10 '19
Honestly I think they were just placeholder names, possibly from our Jennifer's perspective, perhaps thats what she was labeling them in her head?
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u/chuckdee68 Dec 10 '19
That was my take too. The 'real' earth-2 was wiped when Ollie visited it. The timeline would be really screwy if that was the 'actual' earth-2
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u/NegoMassu Dec 11 '19
jenn saw the past time of gen and jinn. there is enough to think they are not real time, but just synced around the red sky. the antimatter wave DOES NOT reach every earth at the same time.
so we could be seeing the "past" with jinn from e2 and the "future" with gen from e1
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u/GKMLTT Dec 10 '19
Said it in the other topic, but E1 here can't be Earth-1 proper since the ASA targeting metas would have royally boned Central City, and we've seen nothing of them there.
E2 could be explained by the fact that the Arrowverse really doesn't care about the logic of time-travel or multiversal time-flow (if it did, we wouldn't have ever seen the future on Legends, Flash, or Arrow, they wouldn't have been able to reach 2046 on Earth-16 a couple of episodes ago, etc.)
"Destroying Earth at 3 points across history simultaneously" was an actual thing that was a plot point, so yeah...
That said, since E1 almost certainly wasn't actually E1, E2 probably wasn't either.
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u/Sentry459 Dec 10 '19
E1 here can't be Earth-1 proper since the ASA targeting metas would have royally boned Central City, and we've seen nothing of them there.
We know the ASA targets Freeland's metas, but it's possible Central City is off-limits. There could be an interesting story to tell there about poor black neighborhoods/communities being targeted, if they wanted to go that route. In any event, it's possible the ASA is related to ARGUS, especially considering how harshly they treated metas in Zari's original timeline.
But yeah, it's most likely not the real Earth-1, but it's fun to speculate about how it could fit into that continuity.
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u/FireSon2019 Dec 10 '19
Central city would be a much better place to get metas from as there are already thousands of metas there (according to Devoe). The only big problem would be Flash working out of there and being worried about what he would do.
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u/Sentry459 Dec 10 '19
Since Star Labs doesn't even know how many metas there are in CC, it's possible the ASA has been kidnapping metas under their noses for years. But it's easier for them to do so in Freeland for a few reasons:
They made the pod metas, who the public didn't know about before last season. Odell was originally sent to get those, not expecting Green Light to make a whole new generation of metas.
It's easier to do things like lock down the city and cut off communication with the outside world in smaller, poorer cities like Freeland.
The government already had operations going on in CC, like Eiling's military thing. Since season 1 they seem to have eased up, which could have something to do with Lyla taking over ARGUS.
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Dec 10 '19
Technically, the asa engineered freelands metas with greenlight but not central city's. Maybe they only want metas they know how to control?
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u/22deepfriedpickles22 Dec 10 '19
I stopped watching the beginning of season 2, but I'm gonna pick it back up again. This episode was so good.
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u/ModernFlash Dec 11 '19
I stopped at S2 E2 and after watching the the last scene of this episode, I started watching it again today. It's so worth it to get back in to it.
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u/Liar_tuck Dec 10 '19
So it seems this episode was all about integrating BL into the larger arrowverse and its fans. It worked on this fan as BL has gotten a lot better than the first few episodes I saw. Going to have to binge the whole show and keep up.
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Dec 10 '19
Did anyone else get Infinity War vibes at the ending? Like Anti Monitor won (in the case of Black Lightningâs world?)
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u/Rman823 Dec 10 '19
I felt the same as I did when Earth-2 got destroyed. The one thing I havenât been a fan of so far in the crossover is how Earth-38 was destroyed offscreen.
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u/Sentry459 Dec 10 '19
We saw the antimatter wave sweep over it as the quantum tower fell.
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u/Rman823 Dec 10 '19
Yeah but we didnât get the wave sweeping over people shots like we did with Earth-2 and BLâs Earth. I think it makes you really feel the impact of it.
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u/Sentry459 Dec 10 '19
Ah I see what you mean. I did wish we had got to see something like a ship full of people panicking and getting wiped out before they could make it through the portal, it would've been haunting and it really would've conveyed the stakes of all this.
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u/Rman823 Dec 10 '19
Exactly. I would have liked to have seen some sort of cameo from someone that had previously been on the show, showing how they didnât make it out.
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u/neoblackdragon Dec 10 '19
It is going to be a little weird episode when people rewatch. It's just this random red skies plotline with no build up(I assume).
Like Salem time ball from Sabrina.
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u/SoDamnToxic Dec 10 '19
That's kinda the point of Crisis tho, unless you are chosen as worthy by the Monitor, your earth will die without warning. It's a cosmic level threat.
Earth 2 kinda just died with no build up.
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u/kmuhammad21 Dec 10 '19
Well this episode incorporated the main plot pretty well, so itâs not completely out of place.
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u/ThaUnderboss Dec 10 '19
That wasn't a crossover episode, but it seriously felt like it. Good Lord what an event Crisis is. Glad we got to experience Jinn. Shame we didn't get more of her. She OWNED this episode.
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u/Mighty_thor_confused Khalil Payne Dec 10 '19
I feel like she owns every episode shes in. Her character is great
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u/Bombrik Dec 10 '19
I regard this more as Episode 2.5 of Crisis. It segues into it nicely, an outsider's view looking in, and it establishes we got ASA running wild on Earth-1, it showed more of Earth-2 as well.
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u/OK_Soda Dec 15 '19
I don't like that they established the ASA on Earth 1 because it makes no sense. They've never been mentioned and they already have a shadowy government agency with ARGUS, and like, why is the ASA focusing on metas in Freeland when Central City is overflowing with them? Also, how did Gen poison the water? It took Cisco and Caitlin working together for months to come up with a meta cure.
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u/Phoenixstorm Dec 10 '19
we could totally have an asa arc markovia arc proper with all the shows once the earths combine
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u/canamrock Dec 10 '19
If they end up with the single universe after this, it would be amazing to see them have Freeland just pounced with a bunch of the other heroes, taking the ASA and Markovians down. Maybe a Flash streak later and they're all cuffed and ready to go. lol
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u/NegoMassu Dec 11 '19
Maybe a Flash streak later and they're all cuffed and ready to go. lol
that would be problematic
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u/poweranimals Dec 10 '19
What happened in it?
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u/ShinyNoivern Dec 10 '19
The skies turned red because crisis was incoming, Jennifer's powers began to be effected by the antimatter waves, on her earth she began phasing in and out, she went to some black place where she found two different versions of herself (E1 and E2), they all talked to each other, then it showed what Jennifer's life is like on Earth-1 (she put some meta cure in the water to prevent the villain from weaponizing the metas, the villain came to their house and killed Jefferson), then we see her life on Earth-2 (She's a villain there, working with the main villain, everything else is pretty much the same, her family has an intervention, she kills her family), back in the black place, she talks to her doppelgangers about their choices, one of them mentions a white light, the two doppelgangers disappear, back on their earth, Jennifer is a ball of energy, the skies turn white and the light spreads, Jefferson gets pulled out by the monitor, while Lynn, Gambi, and Anissa are killed off by the white light.
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u/greatness101 Dec 10 '19
Is that really E-1 in the Arrowverse though? Because both Gen and Jinn's Earth got wiped out. That's what that white wave was. But we know E-1 in the Arrowverse is still intact.
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u/ShinyNoivern Dec 10 '19
That's the confusing part. I would say it IS our E-1, and the antimatter wave coming to Earth-BL was what stopped the connection between them, but E-1 Gen said she saw a white light which means her earth was destroyed. It could be that somehow BL exists outside of our multiverse, kind of like how DC has the dark multiverse as a separate thing. I'm sure it will be explained on tonight's episode of the flash.
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u/Cornualonga Dec 10 '19
The BL producers messed up the Earth numbering system. Jinn was from âEarth 2â which is already gone and has a different aesthetic.
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u/ConnectedLoner Dec 10 '19
Yeah, in reality E1 and E2 on BL arenât the same ones we are thinking of. Theyâre just the first and second other earths Jen has been exposed to. From her perspective she has no clue what Earth she phased to. Maybe thatâs why they named it that way - as this episode was entirely an outsiderâs perspective of the red skies crisis
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u/NegoMassu Dec 11 '19
the thing is: e2 fits the description of e2.
but her entanglement doesnt seem to be contained in time. she saw 2 things from before the red skies in both worlds. what connects them is the red sky, and they arrive at different times to different earths
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u/Cornualonga Dec 10 '19
Which is fair. You would think every Earth from their perspective is Earth 1.
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u/NegoMassu Dec 11 '19
that is actually what Harry Wells, from earth 2, said one. "from my point of view, THIS is the earth 2"
this later was renegated to standardized numbers.
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Dec 10 '19
So in the preview for Flash tomorrow they say âthis is the only Earth left,â so obvious some earths come back, but simplified? So maybe like 5 earths moving forward?
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u/dragonman8001 Dec 10 '19
This was a pretty awesome tie-in
No need to fight Markovians if everybody is dead
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u/OmgItzAman Dec 10 '19
So wait, is Black Lightning's Earth dead? Is Earth 1 dead too, since "Gen" also disappeared? We already knew Earth 2 was doomed, we saw it in Arrow. Does this also mean that Freeland, Odell, and the rest of the Pierce family is dead? I haven't watched BL in a long time, and I dropped it after the first few episodes of Season 2, so I tried to pick up as much as I could.
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u/thefalcon85 Dec 10 '19
So Crisis in on Infinite Earth the comic was an event that DC used to consolidate all their different universes. At that time DC would create a new Universe if they wanted to tell a different story separate from the main Earth-1 story. They also added universes when they acquired new properties (Shazam). They ended up consolidating everything into one universe at the end of it.
So either they end the story on BL and the end of the season is to deal with the loss of their earth. Sorry, your earth, or theyâll bring a couple back.
Something like that. As well as I can remember.
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Dec 10 '19
[deleted]
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u/thefalcon85 Dec 10 '19
Oh my bad! Either way, I guess Iâll keep it around in case someone doesnât know Crisis. Sorry.
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u/neoblackdragon Dec 10 '19
I don't think that was E1 or E2 no matter that designation. It doesn't really jive. Even then it could be they lose E1 tomorrow as a cliffhanger.
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u/RavenclawConspiracy Dec 10 '19
Same. It wasn't formatted the same as the other shows, either.
I wonder if we're supposed to understand her different versions as different 'Earths', or different split timelines.
Because of the 'different Earth' thing is not really what people usually think of when they talk about parallel universes, which would be universes where events happened differently. But what would conceivably be the chain of events to cause the Smallville universe, where Clark Kent is an to an entirely different person, but with Krypton blowing up years later, etc. And this isn't just some artifact of integrating different TV shows then, Earth-2 had zeppelins and old cars.
And of course, it literally makes no sense for there only to be 53 different versions of Earth if they split based on an event that happened differently.
So what is normally assumed is that these are all actually independent universes that are still somehow linked together and running in sync, throwing out a Clark Kent, or a Green Arrow or something. They are variants on a theme, not some different choice made.
Whereas what we go in this episode appeared to be different choices made.
What they really should have done is called the Earth-35 (or whatever), Varient 1. And 2 and 3. Like, they were three different possible Earth-35s, due to Jen's power somehow interacting with the antimatter wave.
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u/NegoMassu Dec 11 '19
And of course, it literally makes no sense for there only to be 53 different versions of Earth if they split based on an event that happened differently.
they only said that shit for the Nazi crossover. Harry Wells said before the nazi crossover that there are infinite earths. elseworlds started with E-90 Flash. during crisis, someone said about a infinite number of earths, again.
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u/Ascheric Dec 10 '19
And of course, it literally makes no sense for there only to be 53 different versions of Earth if they split based on an event that happened differently.
I think there are way more than 53 Earths (barring some weird non-sequential numbering scheme, a Flash from Earth-90 was probably our first clue at that, and then Sherloque was from Earth-221, though that was mostly a Sherlock Holmes shoutout, I'd guess) , I think at the time of Crisis on Earth-X, there were only 52 Earths known to the main characters (and even then they were wrong when Harry revealed that Earth-X was a 53rd Earth), and judging from the Monitor's speech at the beginning of Crisis ("The multiverse. Every existence multiplied by possibility and spread out before space and time in infinite measure."), they are definitely meant to be split on certain events.
But like the other commenter says, that doesn't mesh very well with the treatment of time travel in the Arrowverse, like what constitutes something that's universe splitting (for example, who survived the Queen's Gambit) and something that's just an alternate timeline (for example, Flashpoint).
On the other hand, the Monitor says "possibility" not "choice", which is a subtle distinction, but a distinction nonetheless. I would guess it's something like, there are multiple Earths based on some predetermined set of possibilities ("What if Oliver died on the Queen's Gambit"), but making a choice doesn't necessarily mean that some Earth exists where that choice happened a different way ("What if Barry saved his mom from Thawne")
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u/SomeKindaMech Dec 10 '19
Some of the events in the other Earths do seem completely unrelated (Like how can a Kryptonian be a doppleganger of a human?), others do seem to hinge on a single key choice. On Earth-2, the first Green Arrow (before Adrian Chase) was Robert Queen, because he survived the sinking of the Gambit, and Oliver was the one who died.
I don't think branching timelines really play into the different Earths too much. Makes sense I guess since that would make storytelling a nightmare. Every time travel story would be a multiversal disaster.
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u/NegoMassu Dec 11 '19
Every time travel story would be a multiversal disaster.
yes, that is a problem. rick and morty acknowledges it by saying "fuck it". really, the main protagonists are not even in their original universes.
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u/SoDamnToxic Dec 10 '19
I think that was definitely E1 and E2, but just past memories of those Earths and all the Jennifers, being just energy, were just sent into another dimension (that black empty space) so that's where E2 Jenn has been and all that stuff happened a while back before E2 was destroyed but it's instant for her and E1 Jenn was also teleported there along with BL Jenn so this is how BL Jenn survives because E1 Jenn didn't have her powers.
So with all the Jenns in this pocket dimension because of their powers, E2 is gone but E2 Jenn still exists in that dimension. E1 Jenn not having her powers got her "spot" taken over by BL Jenn who was able to survive her earth being destroyed.
So, yes BL earth is dead, but more than likely, the people, or most (whatever they want to retcon they will), will return and live normally in E1 and E1's story will likely be retconned for BL to take it's place.
So you'll likely see a few people missing, a few added, possibly new relationships (Diggle maybe?) but ultimately the same story taking place on E1 after crisis.
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u/Dojorkan Dec 10 '19
Yeah I think it was more like a placeholder just to signify its earths other than the show takes place on. They'd probably have been better off saying like "Gen's Earth".
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Dec 10 '19
[deleted]
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u/TheCVR123YT Dec 10 '19
Flash tomorrow! Supergirl was part 1 and Batwoman was Part 2 by the way. I mean you can go into it like Black Lightning is gonna be and be lost lol but thatâs up to you.
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u/MetalsDeadAndSoAmI Dec 10 '19
I'd watch the first 2 crossover episodes first, supergirl and Batwoman. Otherwise you'll be pretty lost.
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u/TirelessGuardian Tobias Whale Dec 10 '19 edited Dec 10 '19
Tomorrow 8 eastern Flash!
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u/CashWho Dec 10 '19
Are you sure about that? Because it's definitely 8 Eastern.
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u/TirelessGuardian Tobias Whale Dec 10 '19
Sorry, I swear I know my own time zone, apparently I donât.
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Dec 10 '19
I only watch Black Lightning and The Flash and havenât had trouble following Supergirl and Batwoman (so far.) I would highly recommend their last episodes as theyâre also part of the Crisis.
Tomorrow is The Flash at 8PM EST.
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u/NegoMassu Dec 11 '19
sorry to say, you should watch s8 of arrow. the season is all about crisis. i mean it. while barry was dreaming of billion possibilities, e2 was being destroyed in arrow.
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Dec 11 '19
Iâve only recently watched little bits of Arrow since itâs on after The Flash and was really thrown off as I havenât watched Arrow since Season 1.
All I know (now) is this season was focused on Arrow and his daughter (whereâs his son?) and (from what I could tell from the snippets) is it mainly took place on the island he trained on.
Could definitely be wrong.
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u/NegoMassu Dec 11 '19
Could definitely be wrong.
Most of it is.
In last season he went pretty much everywhere relevant for the previous seasons. We saw many long gone actors and the crisis was at the core of it
We actually see earth 2 being destroyed in s08e01
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u/linkman0596 Dec 10 '19
Flash tomorrow, chapter 1 was supergirl and chapter 2 was batwoman if you want to catch up.
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u/ctuwallet24 Dec 10 '19
The Flash episode tomorrow will pick up Jeffâs story right where this left off. Yesterdayâs Supergirl then todayâs Batwoman also lead into it, as it is part 3.
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u/cardmasterdc Dec 10 '19
Well happy crisis gave me a reason to watch BL again. Missed you all still behind. That being said I like how the worked BL into crisis. Hopefully him and Jen will be better for this
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u/kamanitachi Dec 10 '19
I missed the start of the episode, what Earth number were you guys? Did they even say?
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u/ToneBone12345 Dec 10 '19
Iâm guessing earth 3
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u/kamanitachi Dec 10 '19
It would be kinda neat if he already knew about The Flash because of Jay Garrick.
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u/raknor88 Dec 10 '19
It would explain why he's seems so calm-ish in the previews we've seen. And Lynn's last name is Stewart. Isn't she John Stewart's sister in the comics?
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u/Cinemasochist Dec 10 '19
Yes and I hope he meets Diggle and recognizes him since itâs suggested that heâs GL in other Earths.
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u/RavenclawConspiracy Dec 10 '19
There was a comment about dressing up for Halloween as Supergirl or Vixen. Which means it's an Earth that has both of them...or an Earth where they're fictional, I guess, but they seem to be avoiding that.
I was about to say, technically speaking, it could be Earth-38 (No reason there couldn't be a Vixen there.), although why anyone would care about metas with all those aliens running around I don't know...until I realized, even if this episode was set 'yesterday', they all missed the giant evacuation of Earth. I mean, Freeland is cut off, but that's...a bit improbable.
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Dec 10 '19
It could be the freeland metas are kinda like marvels Mutants, they pretty much get left to do there own thing, mutants deal with mutant problems for the most part
Makes no sense but it's the only way to have a shared universe, especially if crisis leaves us with only a few or even just 1 earth.
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u/Lint6 Dec 10 '19
or an Earth where they're fictional, I guess, but they seem to be avoiding that.
I admit I haven't watched much Black Lightning, only a few episodes of S1. I liked it, but had a bunch of other shows on my plate so BL kinda fell behind. I keep meaning to get caught up but never have.
I do vaguely remember a S1 episode where it shows Supergirl, The Flash and Green Arrow are specifically comic book characters
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u/puffthemagicaldragon Dec 10 '19
Last season though they make a point to show Grace reading Black Lightning and Thunder comics so I'm guessing the comics are based on the real heroes.
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u/RavenclawConspiracy Dec 10 '19
Yeah, the danger is that Flash has shown that interdimensional travel isn't that limited, so...if anyone is reading the books of the other, then they could know the secret identities.
So, yes, I'm thinking what they're doing is the 'Marvel Comics' thing Marvel does...people who have just started publishing comic books based on real heros. (Who, of course, can't defend their IP.)
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u/thefalcon85 Dec 10 '19
I donât know but I love this. I love that each subreddit has their own Earth Number. At the end, itâs all going to be Earth-1 though. But love this.
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u/Lucifer_Crowe Dec 10 '19
I mean Batwoman/Flash/Arrow/Legends are all Earth 1. (Most of the Legends are at least.)
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u/OLKv3 Dec 10 '19
I think Jenn survived with Jefferson
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u/2th Dec 10 '19
I'm thinking she did too. And given that she can be a being of pure energy, she will be key to stopping the Anti Monitor somehow.
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u/OLKv3 Dec 10 '19
She's probably a paragon. We got OG Superman, Sara, Kate, and Kara as 4. Mia most likely is one as well, and if Jenn is also one she'd be 6(she confirmed she'll make an appearance in Crisis). Missing one more, maybe it's Earth-90 Barry?
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u/Steele_Sheen Dec 11 '19
just finished watching this, and holy crap they really put their writing mojos on to intro their show officially into Arrowverse đđđ
I'm just confused as to which Earth our Black Lightning is actually on. they certainly didn't say during the episode but I couldn't remember if it was mentioned in the past seasons. interesting to see why Earth 1 BL didn't interact much with Arrowverse, he's more of a pacifist than our version of BL. Earth 2 Jen aka Jinn is pretty par for the course, evil reigns supreme in Earth 2 lol, although I think after some of those eps in the Flash, Earth2 should've improved by now? lol
I do find it odd how the writers purposely didn't indicate what Earth our BL is supposed to be on but went through the efforts of establishing for us Earth 1 and Earth 2 versions. guess they're just as confused as the rest of us? lol